UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories The Honor Ring Forum SS HONOR RING Opinions ?

Mike,

I'm sorry it turned out as it did, but I'll bet the investigation was somewhat exciting itself. Although it's a mystery solved, I still hope you snag one that passes muster.

I couldn't decide whether or not to say "Decision" or "Verdict" is in ....I decided not to use "Verdict " because ...it's a little to negative ..and there wasn't anything negative about this thread.
It was a learning experience ...and I enjoyed the Hunt ---and the Help
I even met a few more members because of it ..I'm glad I posted it.
I only hope my friend is able to get his money back. ...something tells me we'll be seeing Mr. Blossfeld's cloned Ring again someday. We'll be ready next time.

Jim A., much thanks for posting the photos and info! You guys can go as mild or wild as you want to here..Theres also 21 back pages with plenty of great info, photos of HRs there...

*Mike P.,,glad you enjoyed the hunt,,we all did too! Sometimes the hunt is better than the catch. Thanks for all your photos and info also..

I know many who believe it is not wise to post photos of their rings. Really, its the best thing you can do. Doument the ring by posting the photo of it, seam, skull, engraving , name..

Can we set a standard here? How about this question,, does anyone have a HR with a script lower case 's' in the engraving ?

*

I'll second that Gaspare ! ...Thanks Jim.
I PM'd Jim hoping I could speak with him and thank him before I posted the outcome ..I'm sure I'll hook up with him later.

THAT IS WHY I BOUGHT THE RING FROM A LONG TIME BIG DEALER.IF MY RING TURNED OUT BAD, EVEN YEARS FROM NOW I COULD GO BACK AND SAY GIVE ME MY MONEY BACK,AND GET IT WITH OUT A BIG FIGHT.I FIGURE WHEN YOU BUY A SS ITEM FROM A DEALER IT TAKES 3 YEARS OF APPREATION GROWTH TO BREAK EVEN.THAT YOU CAN MAKE A DOLLAR IF YOU EVER SELL.I MET A 50 YEAR SS COLLECTOR WHO IS SELLING OUT NOW.I LOVED HIS SS OFFICER VISOR.HOW MUCH?$11.000.000 HE WAS VERY HONEST.I TRADED A $300.00 GUN FOR THIS IN 1968.I AM RETIRED,AND IN 1968 I WAS A FRESHMAN IN HIGH SCHOOL.THIS GUY I ASKED A LOT OF LONG TIME SS GUYS ABOUT AND THEY ALL HAVE KNOWN HIM FOREVER AND HIS STUUF IS AS GOOD AS GOLD.

Mike, Glad that you got Don and Andy's opinion on the ring. Both are great guys and always willing to help us collectors out. Good luck on your quest for a TKHR. Once you find a good one it will be one of the high points of your collection.

Gaspare,C Gottlieb has a lower case double (s)Honor ring for sale with a grouping of items.Like the other items with Mike Peters ring those to were "close" Item #42 Photo #9&10.

thanks Zorro...

Looking around quickly at the back pages here and other sites I've seen the following: 8 HRs with lower case 's' in the engraved last name.
*None were script.
Is there any member with a lower case script letter 's' in their ring? , Or even have a photo from their files? Thanks , G.

*

It is my opinion that cursive or "script" style
small case letters in recipient's names do not exist on a Totenkopfring. Of course, since I haven't seen them all, I could never say for certain. The Germanic approach to things is not whimsical, but very precise and orderly, and would seemingly extend to a prestigious award, especially. People often ask what Himmler's Totenkopfring would say. Would it say "Himmler" twice? My opinion: Of course.

Actually, after thinking about it, since he WAS , afterall, the Reichsfuehrer, it wouldn't be surprising if Himmler had a special inscription. But on other rings, I don't believe so. You know, I did have Himmler's personal TK Ring lying around here somewhere, but I seem to have misplaced it.

G,

Checked the files, I found 11 and none had with a lower case script s.

Gaspare, what do you mean with lower case s and -none were script- ?
I have a lot of rings in my files which contain "s" in the name. Most of them are the normal script "round" s some of them (according to writing rules eg. st or sp) are the "long" (f shaped) s.

Wotan,,anything like the repro ring that started this topic? or like this? , thanks , G.

The Outcome !
The "grandson" stopped visited my friend a few days ago with a few more thing to sell ..but my friend confronted him on the Ring ..asked him outright why he "salted" the group by adding the fake HR and lied about it.

He admitted that the Ring didn't come with his Grandfathers things and that he bought it 10 or so years ago. The Grandson was a Biker for a while and was told that it was a real one so..apparently he paid a lot for it. He said he wore it for years . The bottom line..the Grandson/Biker wasn't very happy to find out that he was ripped off but ..my friend will be getting his money back.

And because of this thread , many Collectors are now familiar with the "Blossfeld" repros and the fact that only Jim owns the original.

One thing that was interesting to me ...I never thought about all the other "markets" where the fakers can easily rip off people who think they are buying original TR items ..like Bikers.

Many of these people will never own any reference books and don't know any Collectors to help direct them ..Picture all the Bike Rally's and publications like "Easy Rider" etc ..all prime targets.
I wonder how a Biker would handle finding out that he was ripped off when he bought a $4000 SS Helmet ? ..A Dealer refunding his money would be an interesting scene to watch huh?

So ...PT Barnum was right ,I guess there's a lot of them born every minute , and they're not all Collectors.

Mike,

On that thought, I wonder how many bikers of yesteryear wore actual 3R items. I'm sure at least a few were adorned with real honor rings and Knights' Crosses.

Great ! Thanks a lot , now I'll have that "wonderful" thought stuck in my head
..............
I didn't think about that

I will get opportunity to take a picture two Blossfeld rings. One ring is from Poland about ten years ago. Other is lately from Canada.

hello blackjack.....I have this honour ring for about 25 yrs. I had made it bigger yrs. ago & was just wondering if its possible by LQQKING at pics if it could be real,& the second ring I bought about 5 yrs. ago I'm an old ex biker that went through this fad...my email is leesjokers@yahoo.com please let me know I can send u pics ...thanx lee

Lee,,, It is free to post photos here.. They should be no larger than 100kb.. Since your a member and posting you can put them right up here your self!
Please, I invite you to view the back pages for many nice photos of Honor rings and private purchase to compare/view to..,G.

Concerning the "Blossfeld" rings, I've seen a TK Ring where the "ss" in the name is engraved as an "eszett", which symbolizes "sz" or "ss". It resembles a capital "B" in appearance. I believe that may have been the way it was originally done. I would like Jim Arrasmith or any other owners of a Blossfeld TK Ring to post some more closeup photos.

I had a casual discovery that compare two rings. May be one is the ring Jim Arrasmith had ever. Another one is cast copy made in Poland. I think copy wasn’t make from original. But the copy is bigger more than original. Any opinion is welcome for my appreciate.

Hi. Lee. Post here your ring, please.

Original1

copy-1

original-2

copy-2

original-3

copy-4

original-4

copy-5

orginal-5

copy-6

This post has been outstanding from start to finish.
Thanks to all for the great material.

Sometimes I think is there a German WWII collectible that is the perfect copy?
And fooled us since decades and noone knows about except the maker?

About this ring all I can say very perfect and gladly still not 100% perfect. For sure when something gets fixed it would fool many many people.

The picture of the 2 rings stacked on top of each other confirms one of 2 things. The ring on the bottom was made using computer or laser generated technology, with the top ring used as the scanning model. OR, both rings are fakes that were made by the same person. This goes for the ring that started this thread as well.

I was reading the whole post lot with extreme caution and interest.This is a SERIOUS thread, and so far away from my knowledge and identification skills.

Josias, have in mind that in less developed countries than US, where high tech machinery isn't available, crafters could duplicate a ring only by pictures in a very reasonable price.Also, this could be a copy of any similar HR as it has differences in the bones, IMO.And could encrave any name on the wax easily, and simply have it on the ring once casted...

Look very carefully at the wear on the bottom of the upper left bone of the top ring, and compare it to the ring underneath it. The wear pattern is exactly the same. There's also the same identical impression or line on both rings where the top left bone meets the skull. It's possible that the top ring is authentic, but I'm positive the bottom ring was made from laser scanning the top ring. Either that, or both rings are fakes with different induced wear. The area where the bones meet the skull doesn't look right, even on the "original". I also am not convinced by the inside inscription on the "original". I know that not all inscriptions are perfect, but if you compare the 2 original rings in Don's first book (Oettlin and Geldern), and the "Koehl" ring to the Blossfeld original, you'll see that the Blossfeld ring lacks certain characteristics. The "B" looks like they made a mistake, the 2 "s's" look like they weren't sure how to make them, the bottom of the "f" is round and fat, instead of thin and tapered, the "e" looks good, but is considerably lower than everything else, the "d" looks disconnected, and also goes straight up, instead of curving, and the numbers are not only very different in height, but the "4" and the "3" are a mess, The "i" dot in Himmler's name is missing, the horizontal stroke in the "H" is poorly done. The rest of the signature looks pretty good, but isn't very crisp. I didn't want to post pics from Don's book without asking, but if you look at the 2 rings I mentioned, and with these pics, you'll see what I mean. All three examples have a uniformity, flow, and fineness that the Bolssfeld ring doesn't. If I had to bet, I'd say all the Blossfeld rings pictured are possibly fake.

Recipient

Date (notice uniform height and crispness)

Signature (Ring is fairly worn, but signature is still complete)

"Smiling skull" (Notice recessed parts of bones)