Translate German to English - Click here to open Altavista's Babel Fish Translator Click here to learn about all those symbols by people's names.

leftlogo.jpg (20709 bytes)

Upgrade to Premium Membership

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#54989 12/05/2008 12:31 AM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 300
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 300
Hey everyone,

I just saw this on sale here today. I am asking for opinions merely out of interest since I cannot afford this one nor do I collect these. However, do you think this could be the real deal?

Here's are the link and pictures:

















http://www.aukro.cz/item497821291_prodam_orig_dyku_sa_s...ta_roma.html#gallery

JAN Big Grin


An avid KS98 bayonet collector.
#54990 12/05/2008 02:51 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 337
Offline
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 337
I'm not comfortable with this one. But better straight-on photos of the etch might change my mind.

Low angle "glamor shots" seldom give me confidence when I'm looking to purchase. If the seller is looking for top money then I should not expect to see indirect angles and shadows.

#54991 12/05/2008 08:02 AM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
S
Offline
S
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
Jan....
After talking with some of my experienced colleages off line we have some long standing concerns regarding many of the items you seem to be putting out here for opinion (testing).
First those two Totenkopf rings are fake in the opinion of persons whom opinion I trust in these items.
Now you present a dagger who's owner resides in Chomutov, Czech Republic. A city of less than 50,000 people. Known by a very small circle of collectors as the "Solingen" of the Czech Repro daggers. (Yes,I don't like this one either but I will not tell you why. Cool)
For the past year I have seen nothing but fakes put up by you saying "What do you guys think?" or "Look what a friend of mine dug up."
And it seems like the the product of your friends are almost always a fake.
Which you follow up a question of why some one thinks it is bad and to point out the details.
People are talking and it may be time for you to either buy some of these gems or pick up your chips and try a different game cause the table is getting cold.
But I for one will no longer continue on helping on what I personally consider the improvement of your "friends" product.
Not only that but I will continue to be it your face like that ugly fake ground-dug Totenkopf ring which is the 2nd fake example your "friend" had dug up in the same field! HA!



A new post from German Daggers Dot Com > German Daggers Dot Com > The Honor Ring Forum!

Author Topic: HH ring - today discovered
Jan CZ
Posted 04 December 2008 15:49
quote:
Originally posted by Serge (aka Wagner):

quote:
Originally posted by Josias:
I agree that the Himmler signature looks very good compared to almost all fakes I've seen. Still, it's not typical of the 1940's style Himmler engraving, and appears too small. The thicker, beveled engraving you see here looks more like the 1934 style. The notion that seeing the recipient's name, which is ALREADY known, is nonsense, because a faker can see many different examples of original rings on this forum and WA forum. My original ring has a capital "K" also. I't would be nice to see if it's the same style. What's the sense of posting something, and then hiding part of it? MORE PICS!!!!!


Is this a second time a "friend" of yours have found a Tote ring? And I recall that you showed another "ground-found" tote ring also leaving out the name of the owner.
I recall there were questions about that ring too. Forum members asking for more photos but your "friend" didn't want to show. So was it perhaps it had the same name as this ring? Same friend perhaps found 2 tote rings!? Our two different "friends" who both don't want to show the owners name?

Regards,
-serge-


Serge, this is really second ring he found. First one was discussed here: http://daggers.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/74097573/m...050048054#2050048054
He found it at the same field!
Ok, I am gonna resize other pics, and post them.

Jan



I also urge my fellow collectors to look at Jan's post on WAF and see the material that is fronted by him there. It is IMO all shady. That is where the evidence leads me. Other opinions my vary. I have stated mine.

Regards,
-serge-

#54992 12/05/2008 01:04 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
I don't know anything about what this guy has posted previously but I do know I don't like the dagger.

Gailen David

#54993 12/05/2008 01:11 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
quote:
Originally posted by RevYJ:

Low angle "glamor shots" seldom give me confidence when I'm looking to purchase. If the seller is looking for top money then I should not expect to see indirect angles and shadows.


Boy you must hate the pictures on my site!!!

Gailen David

#54994 12/05/2008 01:20 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
quote:
Originally posted by Serge (aka Wagner):
Jan....
After talking with some of my experienced colleages off line we have some long standing concerns regarding many of the items you seem to be putting out here for opinion (testing).
First those two Totenkopf rings are fake in the opinion of persons whom opinion I trust in these items.
Now you present a dagger who's owner resides in Chomutov, Czech Republic. A city of less than 50,000 people. Known by a very small circle of collectors as the "Solingen" of the Czech Repro daggers. (Yes,I don't like this one either but I will not tell you why. Cool)
For the past year I have seen nothing but fakes put up by you saying "What do you guys think?" or "Look what a friend of mine dug up."
And it seems like the the product of your friends are almost always a fake.
Which you follow up a question of why some one thinks it is bad and to point out the details.
People are talking and it may be time for you to either buy some of these gems or pick up your chips and try a different game cause the table is getting cold.
But I for one will no longer continue on helping on what I personally consider the improvement of your "friends" product.
Not only that but I will continue to be it your face like that ugly fake ground-dug Totenkopf ring which is the 2nd fake example your "friend" had dug up in the same field! HA!



A new post from German Daggers Dot Com > German Daggers Dot Com > The Honor Ring Forum!

Author Topic: HH ring - today discovered
Jan CZ
Posted 04 December 2008 15:49
quote:
Originally posted by Serge (aka Wagner):

quote:
Originally posted by Josias:
I agree that the Himmler signature looks very good compared to almost all fakes I've seen. Still, it's not typical of the 1940's style Himmler engraving, and appears too small. The thicker, beveled engraving you see here looks more like the 1934 style. The notion that seeing the recipient's name, which is ALREADY known, is nonsense, because a faker can see many different examples of original rings on this forum and WA forum. My original ring has a capital "K" also. I't would be nice to see if it's the same style. What's the sense of posting something, and then hiding part of it? MORE PICS!!!!!


Is this a second time a "friend" of yours have found a Tote ring? And I recall that you showed another "ground-found" tote ring also leaving out the name of the owner.
I recall there were questions about that ring too. Forum members asking for more photos but your "friend" didn't want to show. So was it perhaps it had the same name as this ring? Same friend perhaps found 2 tote rings!? Our two different "friends" who both don't want to show the owners name?

Regards,
-serge-


Serge, this is really second ring he found. First one was discussed here: http://daggers.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/74097573/m...050048054#2050048054
He found it at the same field!
Ok, I am gonna resize other pics, and post them.

Jan



I also urge my fellow collectors to look at Jan's post on WAF and see the material that is fronted by him there. It is IMO all shady. That is where the evidence leads me. Other opinions my vary. I have stated mine.

Regards,
-serge-


Serge (aka Wagner): I know I'm old but do you think you can teach me to write neat letters like you before I die? Probably not. Oh Also, is there really a Santa Clause???

Gailen David

#54995 12/05/2008 04:22 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
S
Offline
S
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
Gailen, For you to come in here now means I have misjudged this dagger. Therefore I stand corrected. - serge-

#54996 12/05/2008 04:30 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
Serge: I don't understand? I don't like the dagger and I thought you felt the same way? Please explain??

Gailen

#54997 12/05/2008 04:52 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
S
Offline
S
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
Gailen, My misunderstanding. I thought you had liked it so I bowed to your academic knowledge of these.
So I don't have to stay corrected today on this one? Big Grin

-serge-

#54998 12/05/2008 05:03 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
Serge: Your pretty good on these. Over the years I only can remember one that we disagreed on..... and who knows you could have been right on that one.

Gailen David

#54999 12/05/2008 05:15 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
S
Offline
S
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
Ah-shucks Gailen...Thanks.
But there nobody who knows these Rohm dedications better than you. And you have known them from the days (correct me if I'm wrong) of the Great Western Gun Show...When it was in the city of Commerce across from the Tire factory.

-serge-

#55000 12/05/2008 07:12 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,377
S
Offline
S
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,377
Whats this?The "Mutual Appreciation Society
Weekend"?????
SEiler Big Grin Big Grin Big Grin

#55001 12/05/2008 07:22 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
Yeah! It's the Christmas season. May all your Rohms be real! Ho! Ho! Ho!

Gailen

#55002 12/05/2008 08:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,377
S
Offline
S
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,377
"Rohm Rohm on the Range...where the real and the Mickey Mouse play!!!!!!!!!" Big Grin
Merry Xmas to you Mon Ami
Seiler

#55003 12/05/2008 08:35 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 366
F
Offline
F
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 366
THE SAME CHAP APPEARS TO BE SEEKING OPINIONS ON ETCHED BAYONETS ALSO???

#55004 12/05/2008 08:37 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 300
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 300
Serge,

I have to admit that I am newbie in this hobby. However and STRONGLY SO! , I have to say that you are confusing me with JAN CZ - that's not me. Yes, we are both from the Czech Republic, but my nick is jancz3rt and I do not know JAN CZ. Mind you, Jan is one of the most commonly seen names here in the Czech Republic.

I am not going to beg for an apology but I feel insulted as you seem to be throwing me into one box. I can tell you that I have made many friends here on GDC and on WAF. I do not want to name them because they could now suffer as a result of being associated with me, the "spy and suspicious guy." I am in it purely for the hobby and BECAUSE I WANT TO LEARN SOMETHING! I would not ask for opinions on things that I would know are legitimate for 100%. Reference books can tell me a lot but fellow collectors know much more than that - Von Ryan and others for example know much more than they have in their reference books.

Now, please do some research before putting blame on me or suggesting that I am doing this to help some "friends" or that some of my "friends" have found something. If you carefully go through my posts, you will see that I have welcomed opinions and subjective feelings on the pieces I wanted opinions on - mind you I did not post the Totenkopf ring threads...

I am in no way going to leave this alone as I feel insulted. I consider myself an honest person. I am in this for the hobby alone. There is probably no way for me to convince you I guess but do rest assured that many people know me in the real light and not in the light you are portraying me.

Now, I think I have laid out my cards. I love collecting TR dress bayonets and will continue doing so. I just feel bad that someone thinks that I am in this to help get information for fakers and so on.

I honestly think that I deserve an apology but will live on without it. I needed to let you guys know. You can decide by yourselves.

Thank you for reading this.


P.S.:

quote:
Originally posted by falstaff2k:
THE SAME CHAP APPEARS TO BE SEEKING OPINIONS ON ETCHED BAYONETS ALSO???


Yes, that is me because indeed I collect dress bayonets (etched and standard - see my collection in my signature)! Oh my, it seems like I have just been dug a grave for no just reason.


Jan Big Grin (not Jan CZ or anyone else)


An avid KS98 bayonet collector.
#55005 12/05/2008 09:41 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
S
Offline
S
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
Ok. OK! It wasn't you who posted on that totenkopf thread but the other JanCZ. -

OK, Guys!! Listen up! I meant JanCZ not jancz3rt. Red Face
Geez what is the odds of our limited membership these days that there would be 2 JanCZ's??
Confused

For getting you mixed up with the other "JanCZ" with the doubious "Ground-found" tote rings - of course I apologize for that. It's a honest mistake.

Now since your new you should know that most of us who have been in this hobby are a suspicious bunch. If your not...you won't last long.
However at the same time if you continue posting questions about items that keep proving the be fake over and over again some people here are going to be thinking one of two things.
1. That you don't do your own due dilligence, ie, buy some books.
2. Or your association with constant fakes has an alterior motive. (Even if it doesn't).

My suggestion to you as a new collector is to stay away from CZ auction sites like the one with the Bad Rohm SA above, or Militaria 3-2-1.


No reason to leave this fasinating hobby.

Regards,
-serge-

#55006 12/05/2008 09:52 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 300
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 300
Hi Serge,

Apology accepted and please note that it is nothing personal. I really do not wish to be shown in a bad light and will do much more homework before I post something in the future. I was hoping that it would be quite clear that JanCZ is a different person given the topics of his posts and of course his date of registration. Hell, you can even go as far as checking the IP address.

Ok now, on a more serious note, I am afraid we do not have as many possibilities when purchasing items here in the Czech Republic - the US is a different story. I have purchased from Wittmann before and believe me that I would prefer to do so. However, it is quite pricey and when you add shipping to it, it is a lot more than I am able to generally pay.

Now, I will look forward to posting here in the future and hope we can put this "incident" behind us and focus on the hobby.

Thanks a lot for your understanding, much appreciated.

P.S.: I should also state that I do not have many reference books. I am going to work on improving that too Smile I think my safest bet is to focus purely on dress bayonets which I know most about and have been collecting for 2 years.

JAN Big Grin


An avid KS98 bayonet collector.
#55007 12/05/2008 10:05 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
Well said! Would have taken me an hour to write that. And that's before a rewrite.

Gailen David

#55008 12/05/2008 10:36 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
Jan: Specialization is really smart. Focus were your knowledge is. To many guys collect all over the place. They may be pretty good in most area, if they lasted long enough. And if they lasted, they weren't super knowledgable in one area. Always a good idea to be smarter then the crook who's trying to cheat you, Don't you think.

Also, pay the extra money on postage to get a piece that's guaranteed by knowledgable dealers. You'll make money down the road.

That's my story and I'm sticken to it.


Gaieln David

#55009 12/06/2008 03:35 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,654
Offline
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,654
Lets have a BIG old fashion group hug Big Grin Big Grin Big Grin Razz

#55010 12/08/2008 05:32 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 5,814
Likes: 18
Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 5,814
Likes: 18
I prefer to sing 'Kumbaya'.

John


Always looking for Eickhorns and etched bayonets.
#55011 12/08/2008 06:33 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 366
F
Offline
F
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 366
The neatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing people that he did not exist!

#55012 12/08/2008 10:22 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 300
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 300
quote:
Originally posted by JohnZ:
I prefer to sing 'Kumbaya'.

John


quote:
Originally posted by falstaff2k:
The neatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing people that he did not exist!


Guys, I guess there is no point in me trying to convince you. I know I am right and you have every right to think or sing what you want. I will not take that away from you. Maybe I am the devil after all :-) Now on a more serious note, I will not take this personally from now on and continue with my activities as I had done in the past. I will do more research before posting however.

JAN Big Grin


An avid KS98 bayonet collector.
#55013 12/08/2008 10:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
Jan: I think the guys are just having some fun.

Gailen

#55014 12/08/2008 11:23 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 3,805
Likes: 23
Offline
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 3,805
Likes: 23
Jan,
That's a very nice collection of bayo's and other stuff you have and well done for only two years of collecting. Your command of the English language is to be commended.

#55015 12/08/2008 11:23 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,958
Likes: 29
S
Offline
S
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,958
Likes: 29
Hi I have to admit that I prefer it when we display this kind of commaraderie...and an infusion of humour mixed with some knowledge...reminds me of the good ole days (insert icon shedding a tear and sniffling)...now if we can just infuse some of this good natured spirit into the dreaded SS black death threads we will have it...cheers, Ryan Wink

#55016 12/09/2008 04:46 AM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
S
Offline
S
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,615
Likes: 1
We all long for the good ole days....

#55017 12/09/2008 08:11 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 300
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 300
Ok ok Smile It's fine. I look forward to learning new things here in the future.

JAN Big Grin


An avid KS98 bayonet collector.
#55018 02/04/2009 04:39 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 11
D
Offline
D
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 11
quote:
Ok. OK! It wasn't you who posted on that totenkopf thread but the other JanCZ. -

OK, Guys!! Listen up! I meant JanCZ not jancz3rt.
Geez what is the odds of our limited membership these days that there would be 2 JanCZ's??

Hello
Jan ZC - Yes there is such Man, it is good that I have not bought from him Ring - 2 year ago, its Fake ring!


For getting you mixed up with the other "JanCZ" with the doubious "Ground-found" tote rings - of course I apologize for that. It's a honest mistake.

Now since your new you should know that most of us who have been in this hobby are a suspicious bunch. If your not...you won't last long.
However at the same time if you continue posting questions about items that keep proving the be fake over and over again some people here are going to be thinking one of two things.
1. That you don't do your own due dilligence, ie, buy some books.
2. Or your association with constant fakes has an alterior motive. (Even if it doesn't).

My suggestion to you as a new collector is to stay away from CZ auction sites like the one with the Bad Rohm SA above, or Militaria 3-2-1.


No reason to leave this fasinating hobby.

Regards,

#55019 02/04/2009 04:40 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 11
D
Offline
D
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 11
Jan ZC - Yes there is such Man, it is good that I have not bought from him(it) Ring - 2 year ago, its Fake ring!

#55020 02/04/2009 05:01 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
Seems to me that someone should change their name don't you think?

Gailen David

#55021 02/04/2009 05:09 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
Maybe you could change it to "JanCZnotthecrook" or "JanCZthenewimprovedmodel."

Gailen David

#55022 02/04/2009 05:22 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 11
D
Offline
D
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 11
Maybe ...
This man digs in Czechia, but sells Fake Ring, he spoke me that found Honnor Ring (but Ring Fake) also he say - he found Antipartizanen and Petsamo ring but ring Fake

#55023 02/04/2009 05:34 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
In case you didn't know, it was an old Czechia custom to bury fake items.

Gailen David

#55024 02/04/2009 05:43 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 11
D
Offline
D
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 11
quote:
In case you didn't know, it was an old Czechia custom to bury fake items.

Gailen David


O.O.O. Yes I then have understood, but I did not know, I trusted ! Now I nothing buy in Czechia!
I know very much was sold from Czechia - SS Camo Jaket (from local film-studio Statniy Film ) but it is all Fake, Sahariana, and SS Camo Jaket 44 and more more .....

#55025 02/04/2009 05:53 PM
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
G
Offline
G
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 714
This is great!

Gailen David


Link Copied to Clipboard
Popular Topics(Views)
2,261,647 SS Bayonets
1,760,352 Teno Insignia Set
1,128,799 westwall rings
Latest New Threads
Spitzer Stuka Etch Opinions
by RookieSA - 03/29/2024 09:58 AM
Luftwaffe Swords
by Tanker - 03/27/2024 07:29 PM
Paul Weyersberg Heer
by Tanker - 03/27/2024 07:13 PM
HJ Fahrtenmesser,
by OWN - 03/27/2024 07:05 PM
Wir fahren gegen Engelland - Battle of Britain
by Stephen - 03/27/2024 10:06 AM
Latest New Posts
Spitzer Stuka Etch Opinions
by Mat J - 03/29/2024 11:13 AM
Luftwaffe Swords
by Luftbud - 03/29/2024 09:21 AM
Paul Weyersberg Heer
by Luftbud - 03/29/2024 09:13 AM
Personalized reproduction honor ring source?
by Evgeniy - 03/29/2024 09:02 AM
F Dula with a twist
by C. Wetzel-20609 - 03/28/2024 09:29 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums42
Topics31,653
Posts328,718
Members7,502
Most Online5,900
Dec 19th, 2019
Who's Online Now
8 members (RookieSA, Herman V. (aka Herr Mann), Mat J, Documentalist, maybarker, Billy G., Don Scowen, Honestmike), 564 guests, and 103 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5