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#43287 12/10/2009 02:26 AM
Joined: Mar 2002
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IT is STILL Grandpa’s though; RIGHT????

DOT NOT DONATE to museums, it becomes their property and you can NOT get it back, and they are the ones who often sell it and use the profit too their own ends!

http://home.peoplepc.com/psp/n...62-94e3-40c450ccee01

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“Souvenir hunting was routine by soldiers during the war, and problems arise when people try to sell rather than return culturally important items, said Thomas R. Kline, a Washington-based lawyer who specializes in art restitution and works for the foundation.”

????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

"It's really important that as people go through their attics and they find the things that grandpa brought home, people are aware that something as simple as a book of pictures could have a cultural significance," Kline said.


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"When soldiers and their families realize what they have and come forward to return it, there's never an issue. It's a happy moment and there's celebrations of one kind of another," Kline said. "We owe a huge debt to this generation that saved the world from Naziism."

Red Face WRONG WRONG WRONG Mad

#43288 12/10/2009 02:32 AM
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Hitler's album of coveted art found at Ohio veteran's home, returning to Germany

quote:
Originally posted by blairbunker:
IT is STILL Grandpa’s though; RIGHT????

DOT NOT DONATE to museums, it becomes their property and you can NOT get it back, and they are the ones who often sell it and use the profit too their own ends!

http://www.startribune.com/ent...aDyaEP:kD:aUiacyKUUr

cat=TopStories&referrer=welcome&id=20091209/d5d99021-7b0d-4662-94e3-40c450ccee01]http://home.peoplepc.com/psp/n...62-94e3-40c450ccee01[/url]

??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

“Souvenir hunting was routine by soldiers during the war, and problems arise when people try to sell rather than return culturally important items, said Thomas R. Kline, a Washington-based lawyer who specializes in art restitution and works for the foundation.”

????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

"It's really important that as people go through their attics and they find the things that grandpa brought home, people are aware that something as simple as a book of pictures could have a cultural significance," Kline said.


??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

"When soldiers and their families realize what they have and come forward to return it, there's never an issue. It's a happy moment and there's celebrations of one kind of another," Kline said. "We owe a huge debt to this generation that saved the world from Naziism."

Red Face WRONG WRONG WRONG Mad

#43289 12/11/2009 02:32 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
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I remember him taking the album towards the end of "Band of Brothers", and Captain Speirs trying to get it away from him!

He should have sold it to a collector years ago, he could have made some real cash! I am amazed that no one contacted him and tried to buy it. But, if he wants to give it away, that is his right also.

JMO

Chief


"Gott Zur Ehr Dem N�chsten Zur Wehr"
#43290 12/11/2009 03:49 PM
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Your link says "This story is currently unavailable or expired."


Doug
#43291 12/12/2009 01:46 AM
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Posts: 200
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quote:
Originally posted by Chief:
I remember him taking the album towards the end of "Band of Brothers", and Captain Speirs trying to get it away from him!

He should have sold it to a collector years ago, he could have made some real cash! I am amazed that no one contacted him and tried to buy it. But, if he wants to give it away, that is his right also.

JMO

Chief

The album you are thinking of was Hitler's private personal photo album which was liberated by Alton More of E/506th. More died in a car accident in the late 1950's. I believe that album was sold by the family in the 1970's.

This is a totally different album, and returning it actually is good. It is a catalogue of looted art from all over Europe, and its' return may help returning that art to the rightful owners.

#43292 12/12/2009 04:09 PM
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Opps!

My mistake, right church, wrong pew!

Sorry,

Chief


"Gott Zur Ehr Dem N�chsten Zur Wehr"
#43293 01/03/2010 08:54 PM
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Private ownership versus public sentiment
Same argument?
http://blog.militarytrader.com...ublic+Sentiment.aspx

#43294 01/04/2010 11:30 PM
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No argument at all really, since the diver had no title to the silver, because the silver remained property of the U.S. Navy. It was not declared surplus, and was not a war trophy.

As I understand it, ship's silver is a controlled item and must be inventoried annually. When a ship is decommissioned, the ship's silver is returned to the Navy Yard for storage.

Unfortunately, the author of the article is wrong when he says:

The silver is not unlike most other relics brought home by veterans.

The silver is very different from your grandfather's uniform, captured Luger or Samurai sword. It was not declared surplus, and was not a war trophy. The diver recovered it it from USN property while on duty in a official capacity.

The author makes a specious argument that the "the silver from the Arizona was salvaged by a diver during the War, long before the sunken ship was declared a national cemetery or a memorial. The USS Arizona became a war grave on December 7, 1941, not when declared by President Eisenhower in the 1950's. Those that died aboard her did not disappear that day and magically reappear when declared a memorial.

The Arizona was stricken from the Navy Registry in 1942, but was not sold for scrap, transferred to another government, nor was it donated as a museum ship. It remained government property. The ship's silver was not the personal property of a sailor, but a controlled item of the Arizona.

So, for all of his wailing and gnashing of teeth, the author of the linked article is off-base when he claims that the Navy should have bid on the set.

#43295 01/05/2010 02:51 AM
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Would salvage rights work in this case?

#43296 01/05/2010 04:17 AM
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Mikee, I'm not a lawyer, but in this case, I don't believe so since the diver:

a) was a member of the Navy,

b) diving on a Navy ship, that

c) while stricken from the rolls, had not been abandoned because work had been on going since the attack.

#43297 01/06/2010 07:47 PM
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My interpretation of this matter is very different to that of someone acquiring a war trophy from a defeated foe. Whilst theft is theft there is arguably a circumstantial difference that mitigates the question of morality.

In the case of the Arizona silverware the individual was in the employ of the U.S. Navy working on their property & as such his acquisition of the items in question was nothing less than theft.

The passage of time does not diminish what might be considered by many as a serious crime.


War is when your government tells you who the enemy is.
Revolution is when you figure it out for yourself.

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