UBB.threads Forums General Interest Community Center Problem with a returned item

Ralf,
I have no idea what dagger you bought from me and are waiting to have shipped as there is no such transaction. Maybe you are thinking of another Paul Carter on WAF. That would be OK if there there was one. Anybody else starting to see a pattern??? RFI is one of the most straightforward and honest dealers I know of.

yes and so is PAUL CARTER ONE OF THE BEST .ME THINKS your name dropping is suspect very susbect

quote:

Originally posted by P Carter:
Ralf,
I have no idea what dagger you bought from me and are waiting to have shipped as there is no such transaction. Maybe you are thinking of another Paul Carter on WAF. That would be OK if there there was one. Anybody else starting to see a pattern??? RFI is one of the most straightforward and honest dealers I know of.

Sorry Paul Carter,
Sorry Chris Taylor,

I can't remember why I wrote "Paul Carter" it is Chris Taylor I bought an edged weapon from. Don't know, if Chris is member of this forum?

quote:

Originally posted by RFI:
Ralf,
What were your problems with Gotlieb and Paul Hogle?
Thanks!
Bob

There was no problem with Gottlieb

Customer not satisfied - money back guarantee...

This is my policy.

Thank You for Yor attention...

quote:

There was no problem with Gottlieb
Customer not satisfied - money back guarantee...
This is my policy.
Thank You for Yor attention...

Very professional in every way, as I stated
I can recommend business with Gottlieb
Thanks Gottlieb

From all that I have read here it would appear that the buyer is less than familiar with the construction quality of later RZM pieces...Bob is an outstanding name in this hobby and in this business...from all of the emails provided he has been upfront and honest.....if you are standing by the terms of your return policy and the purchaser is not that you are totally justified in whatever approach you choose....no one would/could fault you...No one is perfect and everyone has a story but Paul Hogle and Bob are two of the most decent, honest and easiest chaps to deal with in this hobby...cheers, Ryan S

^^ Absolutely..

Please try and work this out amicably, gents.

As well, please be careful when bringing other names into the discussion; have your t's crossed and I's dotted so as to not cause unnecessary consternation.

It was me, and not Paul, that Ralf purchased a sword from.

Just got the address & it's on its way now Ralf!

Hi Again!
I think these will be my last posts since I see no new information being added and I am doing this in reply to Ralf’s last post on the WAF.
Firstly, this picture shows damage to the pommel from a wrench that probably the vet used to take it down. This was here before I sold it and was never in dispute and has nothing to do with my willingness to only give a “partial refund”.
This is one of the pictures that was used in my sale. A friend helped me get these pics out of Front Page which I use to update my web site.

This picture was taken after it was returned and shows the scars that are a partial reason for the dispute we have.

This picture was taken before I sent the dagger to Ralf. You can see around the TM there are some small scratches. Before I take pictures I use a micro-fiber cloth to remove dirt and oil. I distinctly remember trying to remove these scratches but they would not simply wipe off

This picture of Ralf’s shows the dagger after it was returned so, now I believe not only was the dagger taken apart but I am now positive it was cleaned by Ralf as I had originally believed. The scratches now are super minute and have been mostly removed, I am not sure what was used to do so. So, my reason for a partial refund or I will be happy to ship it back, at his expense has to do with the disassembly of the dagger and the cleaning of the blade.
A friend showed me how to get the pics out of “Front Page”, now I think I can verify my problems with the transaction.
Sincerely,
Robert Iqbal

The rest of the pictures were from my sale. The gap in the cross guard and blade fit is visible. Also, the last picture was taken with a flash to help show the cross graining. It needed this light to look this way, now the entire blade looks like this as if it were chrome and the scuff that were there are now gone.

reverse

picture with a flash to show cross graining

Bob,
dear collector friends,

first of all, because of many pm from friends who said I didn’t say it clearly I wanted to state clearly that:

I didn’t open the dagger.
I didn’t use a collector tool or any other tool on this dagger.
I didn’t make these scratches.
I didn’t clean the dagger.

Second, I respect that many collectors trust Bob's honesty.
I did the same at the beginning of our trade.
That was the reason why I paid USD 3400 without insurance and with no experience from a deal with Bob before.
If you remember I called this part of our communication “The Beginning”.

The following I called “Something is going wrong”
I discovered that the dagger described from Bob as a KILLER with exceptional blade (“The blade is nice and I think you will be very pleased with this dagger!) I discovered as a dagger with a big gap between the crossguard and blade and a repair to the blade tip (pics poste 27 January 2010)!!!

That was the reason why I sent it back, not because of the scratches, which are in my eyes minor problems.

Bob is offering no proof of the condition of the dagger that he says was altered. I am trying to provide proof that it was not and was returned in the same condition as received.

Here are the facts:

Fact 1:

Bob suspected me:

“When I received it the vertical hanger was absent and the dagger had been taken apart. It is not being returned as it was sent and has scars where it was disassembled” (starting post of Bob) on WAF “He denies taking it apart but I know it was a virgin piece.“ (WAF post # 6) and “these scars may sound very small however, the dagger was taken apart and some people would not buy it with these problems (email from Bob 22nd Jan post # 27 nearly at the end).

Bob (on WAF post # 46) regarding the scratches on the nut by pointing out pictures # 29 and 30: “Post number #29 and #30 are from me to Ralf to show where my problems are with the return.”

Bob recalls his suspect on me:



After showing everybody on picture post # 49 that all scratches on the nut had been there before Bob stated (post WAF # 50): “And again, as I have stated previously. This is not where the problem with the return lies. This was done by probably the vet and I totally agree it has been there. My problem has to do with the scars caused by a collector’s tool used to take down political type daggers.”

Bob (post 05 February 2010): “Firstly, this picture shows damage to the pommel from a wrench that probably the vet used to take it down. This was here before I sold it and was never in dispute and has nothing to do with my willingness to only give a “partial refund”.

That’s the truth:

It had, by Bob's later admitting, never been a “virgin” as he described the dagger in post #6. He admits that the vet probably opened it in posts 05 February 2010/WAF #50 and #52.

Scratches on the nut had there been before!


Bob (post WAF # 15) :” As far as pictures, I do not know of any dealer who on a routine basis photographs the upper cross guard to show if it has been tampered with or not so, I do not have before pictures”

If any dagger described as "virgin" is for sale, I think the most important part to take pictures would be the top crossguard and nut to show that the dagger had no scars to show it had never been taken apart.

Otherwise: No pictures = no proof


So I have pictures showing the scratches in condition as it arrived, I also have some person who can attest that this was the condition I got it.



Fact 2:

After loosing this argument Bob now (post 05 February 2010/ WAF# 54 and # 55) suspects me:

“… now I believe not only was the dagger taken apart but I am now positive it was cleaned by Ralf as I had originally believed. The scratches now are super minute and have been mostly removed, I am not sure what was used to do so.”

He obviously forgot that he sent me pictures dated

8th Sept. 2009 showing the scratches like post 05 February 2010/WAF # 54

and dated !!!

1st Nov. 2009 showing the blade without scratches

this pictures Bob sent me attached at his email of 1st Nov 2009 18:20:11 -0800 (PST) (see my post of 29 January 2010 17:02)

That’s the truth:

The scratches had been never on the blade as I got it on 14th Dec. 2009.

Bob had cleaned the dagger himself, if it had been cleaned.



It’s on your choice how you would call somebody who wants to fool me and you, the community, by taking rabbits out of a hat!

Please think about, what you will feel, if you get handled like this!?

This is not the way I want to be handled as a honest customer!

I deserve my money back!!!

The picture above is Bob's picture before sending it to me, photographed on 1st Nov. 2009!!!!

I hope both gents can clear there differences.
I don`t know the seller myself, but I know the buyer. And I know that also the seller have an very good reputation.
Ralf is in fact an collector with 100% good reputation in germany I`cant believe that he is dissasambling a dagger and then send it back.
All what he was doing in past was correct as I know.
Both, seller and collector are in my opinion good guys. Thats why I`m shure that all conflicts can be solved.

I hope so, because such threads are not good for both partys.

Medes