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#35538 05/22/2009 03:49 AM
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I ran across this one. It is advertised as a bagged eickhorn with no mentions of being a full rohm. But I was sad when I looked at the trademark and inscription. Scary they are being made with bags.



#35539 05/22/2009 11:01 PM
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so is it just the bag and inscription that is bad or the whole thing ? I know we have been seeing a lot of bags pop up all of a sudden.

#35540 05/22/2009 11:52 PM
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I can't take much more of this.

#35541 05/23/2009 12:08 AM
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the dagger looks fine

#35542 05/23/2009 01:15 AM
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the whole thing is bad. I got the same story we all got the cosigners husband brought it back from the war. The eickhorn trademark is 1 inch from the cross guard. Should be 1/4 inch. Oh well someone at the upcoming auction will have a unpleasant surprise.

#35543 05/23/2009 01:49 AM
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So I'm outta the loop here as always!! where is this for sale at? And also I must miss alot where are these at???
"I know we have been seeing a lot of bags pop up all of a sudden."
I'm always game to check out bags or the like. I must need to get out more Confused
Bret Van Sant

#35544 05/23/2009 03:13 AM
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After the auction is over ill post where it was. There is other things there I would like to get that came from other cosigners. I will post it in June.

#35545 05/23/2009 04:07 AM
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Well dont bother with it then I was not lookin to get the drop on a item over you just wondered where it was being offered. thanks though. Bret Van Sant

#35546 05/23/2009 12:01 PM
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the dagger looks fine nothing wrong with it
apart from inscription???

#35547 05/23/2009 12:59 PM
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Mananero,

That early large Eickhorn trademark is correctly placed. It the small one that is close to the crossguard.

Dave

SA1.model013.jpg (33.71 KB, 864 downloads)
#35548 05/23/2009 12:59 PM
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Other "tail"

SA_Eickhorn_1.jpg (53.34 KB, 857 downloads)
#35549 05/23/2009 06:30 PM
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HHHHmmmmm I was told by a well known dealer that the trademark has to be 1/4 inch from the cross guard on a rohm. My ground rohm wingen is less than a 1/4 of a inch from the cross guard.

#35550 05/23/2009 08:02 PM
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I'm with you mananero on that.I also though the M/M was to be close to the crossguard.May be Dave should clarify his post.Is he saying the m/m is correct for a Eickhorn ???
Just looked at the post again .I think Dave is saying the small mark is for the Rohm.Which means the Rohm is not a Rohm.


You know you're over the hill when "Happy Hour" means Nap Time


#35551 05/23/2009 09:30 PM
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the dagger is a genuine early large logo eickhorn sa that appears to have a fake rohm etch

#35552 05/23/2009 09:38 PM
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I am saying that IMO both the SA and SS daggers were made with both the large trademark as pictured above and the much smaller "small double oval" trademarks we are more used to.

I believe (no proof) that the large ones are the first ones and they are not that common.

To answer another question: The earlier large SA/SS dagger is found with and without the Rohm dedication. The small trademark is found only on Rohm dedication SA/SS and SS Himmler daggers.

Dave

#35553 05/23/2009 10:15 PM
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quote:
I'm always game to check out bags or the like. I must need to get out more
Bret Van Sant

I'am not saying there good or bad but there were 3 listed over on germanmilitarycollectables.com

#35554 05/23/2009 10:48 PM
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Man...these are starting to pop out everywhere.

-serge-

#35555 05/24/2009 01:02 AM
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so is the inscription good?

#35556 05/24/2009 01:26 AM
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From what I was told from the big dealer was that the dagger itself was probably good but the bag and inscription are not good. It is a shame since it was a nice dagger to begin with. I would have been very proud to put it with my other bagged examples. Since the auction house put a auction value of 200 to 400 on it. Oh well. If you guys want more pics I can get more. I am going tomorrow to talk to the auctioneer and a few other things.

#35557 05/24/2009 05:43 PM
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The only ohe of these bags that I ever felt good about was on a Himmler SS that Dr. Distlehorst had back in the 1970s in his collecting days.
Mint and with a bag in about this condition with the stamped notation of inscription, it is probably the only one known to be original at the time and may be the source for copying for this SA bags we see today.
This being said, without seeing the piece in hand I would not say it is good or bad. Features do look OK to me, but would still have to see in person IMO.
Ron Weinand


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#35558 05/25/2009 05:28 PM
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Now this is interesting. I was at the auction house yesterday that has the bagged rohm. They had a good number of people coming in and inspecting it. There is a number of phone bids too. I was digging around since there is no auctions locally for me to buy things at. I contacted soldusa about some old federal hi powered shotgun shells I bought for consignment. I decided to look at their catalog. Interesting they have a full rohm for sale too.

http://www.auctionzip.com/cgi-...category=0&zip=&kwd=

Now what is the chance of having two full eickhorn rohm being sold in the same week. Both look the same. INTERESTING. Usually when the first wave of repros come out nobody knows anything.

#35559 05/25/2009 05:30 PM
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Sorry you have to dig a while to find it. But here it is with just the window pics

http://www.auctionzip.com/Full-Image/606991/fp771.cgi

#35560 05/25/2009 08:09 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by mananero:
Now this is interesting. I decided to look at their catalog. Interesting they have a full rohm for sale too.

http://www.auctionzip.com/cgi-...category=0&zip=&kwd=

Now what is the chance of having two full eickhorn rohm being sold in the same week. Both look the same. INTERESTING. Usually when the first wave of repros come out nobody knows anything.


Yes as Arte Johnson used to say: "Veeerrryyy Interesting". Smile
Also Interesting that Sold USA had one, a Rohm just like this Three months ago. Confused I think it sold for around $2,000. Do you think someone got a DEAL?
Are you sure you want your Full Rohm's name to look like this?


Yes, why are there so many full Rohm's at the auction sites? With so many variations? Confused Now with
BAGS..but wait that dagger looks like it was worn but hey...it's got a BAG! Eek
If you ever find a dagger with a bag they should look like the two examples like "wotan" shows.
http://daggers.infopop.cc/eve/...=597100751#597100751

You want a full Rohm get one from the same place "AA" got his E-Pack. I'll bet you it didn't come from an auction house.

-serge-

#35561 05/25/2009 10:35 PM
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The small trademark Rohm directly above is NOT correct in my opinion. Trademark way too far away.

Dave

#35562 05/26/2009 12:47 AM
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But they draw the newbies and dreamers all the time. Frown

Does anyone for one minute think that these auction house don't know what they have? These guys do reseach! I just had one from back in your parts Dave call asking me questions.
You think your going to get a nice Full Rohm SA from these guys for under $2,500? Oh I know the "Vet Widow" stories. Well if you bid I'll bet you you can get a lot of these for $2,500...just one little problem...they are fake.
I concur with Dave. That a fake wrongly placed Eickhorn motto. Plus a Fake dedication. But that's JMO.

I think you guys better wait for Gailen, Red, or Pat to come in here...or perhaps they won't be here because it is real and they will be bidding on it ...along with ME! Big Grin

Here's what Dave means regarding the Eickhorn motto placement.

-serge-


#35563 05/26/2009 01:27 AM
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Correct !

Dave

#35564 05/26/2009 01:41 AM
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the rohm in question is also benchmarked with a "3" Would someone go that far to be convincing maybe, but most collectors dont even know about the benchmark numbers.I also believe a hand inspection will tell the story. But for now im giving a thumbs up on the dagger, I'd like to here gailen's opinion


"Drive Fast and Take Chances"
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#35565 05/26/2009 01:43 AM
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also the grip is fit perfect to the crossguards and seems to be no wear on the grip as you would expect on a bagged example nice early nickel lower fitting with no wear,


"Drive Fast and Take Chances"
Author... Roy Carroll
#35566 05/26/2009 02:04 AM
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roy it is in your backyard. About a hour from york. Actually if I went to york I would drive past it.

#35567 05/26/2009 06:42 PM
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I don't think there's any doubt that the dagger itself is a beautiful early Eickhorn, everything about it looks right to me, the grip shape, eagle, crossguards and scabbard throat, right down to the benchmark.

I agree with most other folks here, a hands-on is needed mostly to see if the motto, maker mark and inscription share the same etch characteristics and edge detail. The inscription and maker mark look good to me, and as reluctant as I am to say so, there are just so many of these rare daggers appearing lately, it can only make one nervous. This one looks cautiously good from these pics, but I wouldn't spring for it unless I had a good look at it...

Where's Gailen???

Red

#35568 05/26/2009 09:27 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by mananero:
Now this is interesting. I decided to look at their catalog. Interesting they have a full rohm for sale too.

http://www.auctionzip.com/cgi-...category=0&zip=&kwd=


Yes as Arte Johnson used to say: "Veeerrryyy Interesting". Smile




-serge-


Auction houses that deal in militaria build up a reputation with their customers. They can't get it all "right" all the time. I do know the guys at Sold USA and have dealt with them for a number of years. Dave & Chris are Good people.
Today we discussed the above dagger openly. I stated my concern and opinion. We went over the details.
In short with no hassel at all they had agreed that there were "issues" and told me they will remove it from the auction. And it has already been done! Eek It was their decision and I commend them on their action.
Your not going to get that from other auction houses.

Unless you really study these dedication
daggers there is no way the even the average collector going to notice these minute details since the inscriptions are done on period daggers.
Again it is only MY OPINIONand I'm NO Expert but just a student. But I do believe these "close calls" need to be examined "IN-HAND".

-serge-

#35569 05/26/2009 10:28 PM
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Where the bagged one is I told them that there is a very good chance that it could be a fake. They just shrug their shoulders. I even brought in exampls of bagged sa daggers and my ground ones. Nothing sank though. I sent a email to soldusa last night or sunday night. Actually I picked up a 1/2 of federal 12 gauge shotguns shells that is the orignal reason I sent them a email. That is how I ran into the other "rohm". I am going to watch when the bagged one sells and let you guys know what it sells for.

I like soldusa more since they did that. I never did any business with them. I wish all the auction houses I deal with would do that.

#35570 05/29/2009 03:21 AM
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The bagged version sold for 1500 to a bidder on the phone.

#35571 05/30/2009 02:01 PM
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One of the questionable daggers I received has this same blade. This is an interesting dagger because, except for the blade, it appears to be 100% correct. In other words, this was a good early SA where someone just switched out the blade.

This blade is good enough that I thought it was possibly an original variation until I saw this post.

16_Rhom_(14).JPG (46.72 KB, 409 downloads)
#35572 06/16/2009 11:05 PM
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#35573 06/16/2009 11:06 PM
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Oh yeah nice placing of the gau mark

#35574 06/19/2009 02:21 AM
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correct me if im wrong but was that scabbarb painted .I thought all early ones were andionsed sorry cant spell.not claming to know anything just learning

#35575 06/19/2009 09:50 PM
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Reichstall a painted scabbard is not a red flag in its own right as you will find many early scabbards{because the original anodising did not hold up}were painted over the worn anodising, a lot of other factors must be taken into consideration to assertain originality.

#35576 06/21/2009 02:37 AM
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I STAND CORRECTED JUST YOU WOULD THINK A EARLY BAGGED ROHM WOULD NOT BE PAINTED UN BAGGED YES BUT THATS MY OPION IF I CAN SPELL

#35577 06/21/2009 02:48 AM
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In all my years of buying daggers from veterans, I have yet to find an original period early nickel silver dagger with a painted scabbard that was not anodized or blued until the veteran got it.
All the ones that were early and painted that I found was done by the US veteran and he admitted to painting or chrome plating them.
Ron Weinand


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