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Yes, it is quite amazing the length the German's went to in there quest to make there Officers and NCO's, and even the enlisted men, look good in dress and in the field.
I mean there was a pretty hefty war going on. But they pursued right to the end.
I really do not think we will really ever know a lot of the answers.
That alone keeps it captivating.
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Yes, it is interesting to see a factory control tag on an RZM HJ or SA.


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Hello Brent

Back in the day I had a few loose ones and only a couple on daggers!

Never know when they were added!

I think its a good topic and see if i have pics!

Now here is a sweet mint Rad owned by Patrice! I see a tag but when it got there who knows!


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2

Gets the heart pumping seeing this dagger!!!!!!!!!!!


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Sweet!


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Any tagged HJs in Hogles new book?

Or Waynes bayonet book!

Maybe John can add what he has seen!

Yrs ago many tags were 25.00

PVON

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Pvon wow wish I could shoot nice images like that my Trident RAD Leader has the same blue pannels as it should be!! That's the juice baby✌️🤙👍

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A quick progress report. The Tag gallery will probably be ready to review by this weekend. The gallery currently has over 50 tags, including a few seen on unmarked knives and bayonets declaring the blade to be "Solingen Quality". I have a couple of tags from firms that are not known to produce edged weapons. A few tags, including Henckels, Holler, and a paper Puma, are very poor quality. Hopefully, someone has a better photo. The attached tag was thought by some to be post war, but was seen on an early HJ Knife wink

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Vern
For a fact I had purchased a trident razor with this exact tag on it. Not marked m7/19 I can't speak to if it was used as a dagger tag or a stop gap fill from maker marked to rzm.code. the tag I had like this had no ink stamp at all just red white printed. I guess this the the slippery slope we all tread on. I'll continue to dig for images. Thanks for your hard work and everyone who helped out here.
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Members,
I should have taken a breath before leaving the ICU but I had to change the way collectors see this. I had drive before my illness and it's still present and crystal clear. I should have put this up 1st but wanting to solve some suspect behavior before it became fact was my motivation
Thanks to Gary for making me clear the air !!
Don't let this sugar cube device tagged by Ed. Wüsthof become something it is not

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I made the mistake of collecting tags but with the reference of how they were found. That is now some of the problem. This piece was stored and I've spend days trying to locate it. I wish I had kept tags with items I found them on. A dis-service to the hobby and to collectors. I let my obsession rule the facts. That was a gross error in judgement but something that needs to be corrected. Back when Skipper wrote his book. It was a reference only. More of things I can't afford or buy. But dreams. I do not have unlimited means I was trying to build a collection of minty tagged items. I learned how to find these over time and became rather good at it. But without correct reference to how when where I just added to the confusion. I hope the Trident sugar cube picker clears up my mistake and the reason I desperately want to fix this.
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Yeah, funny how that works wink


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Vern, I can honestly say I never seen this side of it till TWs video. I knew that the mistake I made others make and how it's crazy hard to say I made a mistake. So there ya have it. I'll spend the remainder of my time fixing what I can. I would urge anyone lurking to rejoin or join. No matter what level you collect or wish to collect. This place is a great resource. And you can bitch about locked threads or banned members or what ever. The hobby is the juice. So let's get back to the basic reason we are here love of the stuff. Let's not confuse a tag on a sugar cube device as a dagger hang tag. Thanks guys for letting me try to clear up some messed up things

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Hi Bret dagger tags have been an anomaly since I began colllecting in 1982. Both Toms and other dealers have offered a selection of dagger tags to the collector over the years. Tom J had the largest selecton. Can you post here which tags in your opinion are period pre 1945 dagger tags? The Eickhorn metal tag with insert is probably the most iconic ( I believe I purchased my last example from you on GDC years ago) Thanks cheers and best, Ryan

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[Linked Image]Ryan ,
Yeah the sugar cube grabber is the only thing I saved where the tag stayed on the piece. It was a fluke. It was so small I figured that's not even gonna pass muster to show it. Alcoso had a small tag. Nickel sized. Thought if I ever found a mini that was stone mint id put the small tag on it. That's the issue here. I'm not the only person doing this. And that's the problem.
What is real?? Eicks, puma metal tags, p/s per a Tom Johnson story. Said he purchased a horde of them on trip to Germany. He had never seen them before that. PS factory . The Schmidt tag Vern shows is killer man!! Love it!
So let me be clear. I'm still all about the tags Mike Hansen aka 2new was a member here and a tag collector. I was on him about how where do you find them? He never gave it. But I did find the path to them. Just snagged another one late last week. But for the right reasons this time.

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Here is another Herder wink

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The one I show is on scissors. The tag will stay on them😜 Vern, I like the looks of the one you show.. Bret

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As these ails were between myself and the late Thomas Johnson
I see no reason not to post them. It's information. The photos I can't pull up so maybe the info will be of some use. You will see occasional reference to GDC it's not my intent to stir any I'll will they were observations only between myself and Johnson.
Vern if not allowed I will delete.Bret
February 16, 2009

Dear Bret:

Thank you very much for your incoming email messages of earlier today. You have one leg up on me, as I have never seen a David Everts factory control tag. Although this one may have come off of a deerfoot hunting knife, I am sure the same control tags must have been used on their Third Reich dress daggers as well.

In regards to the Klaas tag, I am sure that you are right in your assumption that the blank space was left open to enter the appropriate Klaas model number.

You certainly are not =E 2boring me to tears”, Bret, as you have even shown me something in your emails that I have not seen in the past (the David Everts factory control tag).

In answer to your question about, do I have a period Alcoso factory catalog, I actually have two different Third Reich Alcoso factory catalogs. I have the standard Third Reich Alcoso catalog which has been reprinted, but, by the way, not reprinted by Rex Reddick as Joe Wotka states, but was reprinted by Frederick Stephens in England. In addition to that catalog, I also have an ultra-rare Alcoso factory catalog that shows all of their Third Reich miniature pieces. Unfortunately, the machete is not shown in either of my two original Alcoso catalogs.

Yes, Bret, for some unknown reason a number of the GD Forum members seem to like to take “cheap shots” when not warranted.

All the best, Bret, and I hope this clears up your questions. Thanks again for sending along the color photo of the latest control tags.

Sincerely Yours,

LTC (Ret) Thomas M. Johnson
President
Johnson Reference Books & Militaria

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More emails.

February 18, 2009

Dear Bret:

Thank you very much for your follow-up email of earlier today. I appreciate your kind words about my reference books, and if you get the opportunity, you might mention on the forum that all of my eight volumes of Collecting the Edged Weapons of the Third Reich are presently being translated into Russian. Volume I and Volume II are already in print, and Volume III is presently at the printers. Additionally, I am also negotiating with individuals in the Czech Republic to sell the rights for all eight volumes to be translated and printed in the Slovak language. I think that speaks pretty well for whether the boo ks are meaningful or not.

On the issue of tags, Bret, the Solingen manufacturing companies purchased their metal tags from outside suppliers. I tracked one manufacturer down in Solingen to see if there were any left over tags from the period, but of course the metal ones were long gone. However, I was successful over the years to turn up some of the paper tags.

Please do send the scans of your Alcoso and any other oddball tags. We did not find any attachments to your email.

All the best, Bret, and I look forward to future correspondence. Please be sure to visit our website at www.JohnsonReferenceBooks.com.

Sincerely Yours,

LTC (Ret) Thomas M. Johnson
President
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I'm reference to the PDL metal tag


March 1, 2011

Dear Bret:

This is a follow-up to my secretary’s email to you dated 24 February. As Sherry explained, I was out of town attending the SOS Show and just returned last evening and am getting caught up with the mail.

Thanks very much for sending along the digital color scans of your P.D. Lüneschloss quality control tag. I have had one or two of these Lüneschloss tags on dress bayonets (but never a dagger or sword) in the past.

All the best to you, Bret, and I look forward to future correspondence. Incidentally, I did not think that we had had one of these company tags in the past, but once I saw your color scans (as they say, “a picture is worth a thousand words”), I do remember handling either one or two duplicate tags through JR&BM years ago.

Sincerely Yours,

LTC (Ret) Thomas M. Johnson
President
John Reference Books & Militaria

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More emails Krebs info here



July 8, 2009

Dear Bret:

Just a short note, as I am leaving in a matter of minutes for the airport, but, I did want to acknowledge your reply.

Your em ail reminded me about the Kronen Krebs tags. I also bought a large s ack of these from Atwood at the same time as the Carl Julius Krebs bag of tags. I had forgotten about the Kronen Krebs tags, as I think they have all been sold by JRB&M.

You are absolutely correct, as one was only one sided, and the other one (which looked very similar) was double sided.

< FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>All the best, Bret, and=2 0I look forward to future20correspondence.

Sincerely Yours,

LTC (Ret) Thomas M. Johnson
President
Johnson Reference Books & Militaria

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Members, the emails I'm sharing are not in order so some info comes out of left field. To share all emails would be pointless. Some are observations from me again. I'll upload more as I get to them.
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I've tried to find the emails with more info than not. Here is a cool story about PS tags from Tom Johnson

uly 7, 2009

Dear Bret:
Thank you very much for your incoming emails of 6 & & July. Yes,=2 0I think I can safely say that the origin of ALL of the PS tags was JRB&M. As I mentioned, Paul Seilheimer’s grandson provided me with all of the leftover tags that he had, and there must have been close to 25 to 30 tags, all in mint condition.

Incidentally, what was Chip Gambino’s asking price for the PS tag? Do you remember?

In regards to your question, did I purchase bags or other factory related items fr om the man, I did indeed purchase a large number of orig inal, unused Seilheimer factor y paper bags for bayonets.&nbs p; They are not wide enough to accommodate dagger crossguards. When I got these bags they were filthy with decades of dust, grime, and dirt and I should have left them that way, because after we cleaned them up they now appear to be too new. Nevertheless, they are original, but it is hard to convince collectors of that fact.

We did not receive any photos of the Garantie t ags, Bret, so could you please resend these scans to us? I will get back to you as soon as I have had the opportunity to print the scans of the two other Garantie tags. I personally am not aware of Ackermanncher being a maker, but if it was a knife maker, I probably would not have any information on that firm in my records.

All the best, Bret, and t hanks for these latest emails and scans. Please be sure to visit our website at www.JohnsonReferenceBooks.com.
< /div>
Sincerel y Yours,

LTC (Ret) Thomas M. Johnson
President
Johnson Reference Books & Militaria

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Ackermann & Co. of Solingen-Remscheid, tradename Ackermanncher, produced wood and metal working tools and saws.


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So a question are you reading these emails? If no ok if you are and if you are did you spot a glaring omission by Johnson in the 1st email I posted from him? I won't go off topic here but raise the question of Luftwaffe machetes?

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That would indeed merit a separate topic wink


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Going back over pics I took at Max,as time permits will look at what I might have took pic of!





PVON

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Tom always had cases of stuff

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A few from 2011


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Thanks man very nice!!

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Thanks Paul and Bret for posting cheers et al Ryan

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Tags are still being used.......

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Vern
The 2 tags from knecht in the gallery I put up show Germany on them. That would be for export basis only. That should be noted or maybe put them in a spot for export tags?
Bret

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I'll note it in the description and bring the gallery online this afternoon wink


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This is a link to a gallery of Factory Inventory tags. Anyone who would like to contribute to the gallery can post them in this thread or email the photos to me at vern@germandaggers.com. The gallery is also linked in the GDC Reference Library. Enjoy wink

https://www.germandaggers.com/Gallery/Tags.php


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What I find works well is just looking at period photos and advertisements from period trade Journals etc.. .
As I'm sure it is posted already many tags are just plain post1945 made and many may be period but were not (usually) or at all used on daggers swords bayonets..
There has been some disinformation posted here and much more printed in current Military magazines
For instance the (Solinger Fach Arbeit) was also used for bayonets daggers and swords before 1946. There is also two different colors and the two colors do make a difference on what they might be on.. this tag should not be in the export file.. Source of this information is multiple trade journals and period advertisements and leaflets concerning these two color of tags with photos and drawings.
There is some good information here but some of this posted is based on opinion and a leap of faith.
You have to look beyond e-bay and the internet..
P.S. I own original cutting and stamping (Embossing)dies for some Solingen tags. One of them is a pre1946 export tag for Klass to the South American market.

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Originally Posted by BretVanSant
Catch my breath a bit
Alcoso tags I've seen 2variants 2 size variants an AWS an ACS and mini of same tags.all from hair clippers. If you collect you know the history of this firm. Export tags many times say Germany tags bound for inside the EU at the time pre 45 from what I can tell do not.
Years ago when this dagger site 1st started a guy named Mike Hansen had tags 2new was his name he got out of the hobby which at the time I couldn't see why. Fully get it now. Try as you may some people wish the hobby to exist for money only. But to hear some say a tag is for some other reason than what I have seen with my own eyes is a bit disheartening. Assuming or guessing is ok but cause you buy it does not make it fact.a person like Damast has the period references to show much of what is known today. Ive not even seen what he has but I trust his view and opinion. Johnson's stories carry real weight to me Every PS tag know said came from him he bought them all at once sure maybe some gi snagged a bagged tagged example but that would have been the exception not the rule. If TJ preserved anything written I don't know. But I have his stories. Many people collect at a higher level than I do it's based on money. No harm no foull. I will not allow some speculation to rule the mob at least without doing to right thing. 2new could fund his collection easy. I work at it now suddenly Craig wants a mint Peres dagger???? For what 2 or
3 tags he owns? I remember the gurka knife deal also.
It's about the Benjamins ok so say that.
I can't correct this behavior but I can warn people of the suspect nature of some tags. While real right as rain maybe not for a dagger. This all ends well so you know. In the heat of that I find a dagger dedicated in in 1937 but the model year changes in 1938 11 months difference so what's wrong in that picture? So hard reset time is that model 11 months early? Dedicated late but presented on a day 11 months before?? I've come back and want to let everyone know partial truth does not work here.
I hope that scratches the surface. Don't ban me or lock me down. I just need to let people know what's going on here is not 100% fact but some guess work on his part when fact are so very important.
Bret


Thank you for the compliment, Yes I was standing right there when the Tag video was made at SOS. It was done behind my table.

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Originally Posted by BretVanSant
Catch my breath a bit
Alcoso tags I've seen 2variants 2 size variants an AWS an ACS and mini of same tags.all from hair clippers. If you collect you know the history of this firm. Export tags many times say Germany tags bound for inside the EU at the time pre 45 from what I can tell do not.
Years ago when this dagger site 1st started a guy named Mike Hansen had tags 2new was his name he got out of the hobby which at the time I couldn't see why. Fully get it now. Try as you may some people wish the hobby to exist for money only. But to hear some say a tag is for some other reason than what I have seen with my own eyes is a bit disheartening. Assuming or guessing is ok but cause you buy it does not make it fact.a person like Damast has the period references to show much of what is known today. Ive not even seen what he has but I trust his view and opinion. Johnson's stories carry real weight to me Every PS tag know said came from him he bought them all at once sure maybe some gi snagged a bagged tagged example but that would have been the exception not the rule. If TJ preserved anything written I don't know. But I have his stories. Many people collect at a higher level than I do it's based on money. No harm no foull. I will not allow some speculation to rule the mob at least without doing to right thing. 2new could fund his collection easy. I work at it now suddenly Craig wants a mint Peres dagger???? For what 2 or
3 tags he owns? I remember the gurka knife deal also.
It's about the Benjamins ok so say that.
I can't correct this behavior but I can warn people of the suspect nature of some tags. While real right as rain maybe not for a dagger. This all ends well so you know. In the heat of that I find a dagger dedicated in in 1937 but the model year changes in 1938 11 months difference so what's wrong in that picture? So hard reset time is that model 11 months early? Dedicated late but presented on a day 11 months before?? I've come back and want to let everyone know partial truth does not work here.
I hope that scratches the surface. Don't ban me or lock me down. I just need to let people know what's going on here is not 100% fact but some guess work on his part when fact are so very important.
Bret


I just have taken more time to read the posts WOW Bret you totally get it about period sources.

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Made the correction for the "Solinger Fach Arbeit" tag. Thanks for the correction. Any other tags or information you wish to share would be greatly appreciated.


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Damast, thanks man 👍✌️🤙

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