UBB.threads Forums General Militaria Historic and Period Firearms Forum Walther PPK

i would really like to know the honest to goodness dollar value for this early model PPK? I have been told 800.00-1000.00. That seems low. Thank you in advance to you advanced more knowledgeable than I PPK collectors. Best!

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That is a Model PP, not a PPK. $800-1000 is probably about right in that condition. FYI, it was produced in 1938.

Thanks Vern, Much appreciated.

Any others! Thanks

Looks like someone took a wire brush or scuff pad to it. What a shame.
I have seen many with Nazi proofs in the $2000.00 range, without cleanup marks.
I still do not have one, on the long list.
Ed

Thanks ed,
It sure does look like it was cleaned with a brush. How much do you think it's worth if you were to purchase it? Thanks Ed.

Mikee
A lot of things to consider on this firearm. Matching clips, matching holster, Nazi marked, not to mention condition.
The cleanup marks look faint, may be able to restore some of it.
You will not see a rig like this for sale at a show for under 1200-1500, most higher if all matching.
These PP's are a hot item. and always have been. PPK's are post war. The Vet eagle is a nice touch, original??
Hope this helps some.
If the price is right, I would put it in one of my safes, 2000-3000 for a real looker.
Ed

Ed, PPKs were produced starting in 1931. Here are 2 of mine produced in 1939

Vern
Those are nice, complete and awesome boxes with great labels.
I was always under the impression that the K was introduced for the USA imports of the PP.
It's a shame I did not get to walk around shows with a person of your knowledge level, I might have learned something.
Thanks for showing, and telling,
Ed

Ed, the letters were added to the end of the serial number in 1938. They used a "P" for the Model PP and a "K" for the PPK Model. Slides are marked "Zella-Mehlis (Thur)" on the pre-1945 examples. Carl Walther fled Germany in 1945 ahead of the red army. In 1952, he licensed a factory in France, Manufacture de Machines du Haut-Rhin, to produce the PP, PPK, and later, the PPK/s under the "Manurhin" label. The French firm stopped producing the "P" serial in 1986. Fritz Walther, Carl's son, began assembling "P" series pistols at the "Ulm/Do" factory in 1953 from parts produced in France. By 1956, all parts were being produced in Germany.

The Walther PP and PPK/S models have also been produced by Interarms in Alexandria, Virginia, Smith & Wesson in Houlton, Maine, and, since 2018, PPK and PPK/S models have been produced in Fort Smith, Arkansas, at the factory of the US-based subsidiary Walther Arms, Inc.

Quality wise from a shooter's stand point, the pre-1943 models have the best fit and finish with the quality falling off between 1943 and 1945. The French examples are almost up to pre-war standards with the Ulm/Do models a close second. The Interarms models are OK but nothing special. With a few exceptions, quality of the Smith & Wesson and Fort Smith production is very disappointing.

Vern
Thank you. A walking book of knowledge.
It does seem any produced after the early Interarms models were pretty rough at best.
A shop in Fort Collins Co has about 20 or so war models, I have drooled over them many times.
With the loss of the Colorado house and property, one is only a dream for me now, but?
Thanks
Ed

Ed, you could still buy from Colorado. Just contact a local gun shop and ask for info on their procedure to transfer from out of state. Most gun shops will do it for around a $25 transfer fee (some will handle it for free). Pay for your choice, and provide shipping info for your local shop. They will handle it from there

Here is a photo of my Manurhin Model PP

Vern
Yes I could.
I was referring to the cost of the very nice Nazi marked PPs, $2000 and up. But you never know.
The Manurhin and French ones are way more reasonably priced.
Vern, you seem to have some really nice things in your collection, congrats.
Ed

OK. You may want to check Gun Broker, Guns America, and Guns International. They have several at a good price. I've picked up a few goodies over the years

Just wanted to add to this thread.
I was at a very small local gun show yesterday, just to kill a half day during the boring winter.
Not anything really to look at, did see a super nice 2nd pattern F/S fighting knife in very nice condition, asking $500.
While walking around, talked to a young guy who had a SUPER nice RZM marked Walther PP in 7.65.
He was not selling it, my luck, but finding info on it. Talked for quite a while, that was nice.
The PP had the RZM marked slide, but no Nazi eagle marks anywhere.
Vern probably knows about these, I have only seen a couple.
Every show has its perks.
Ed

The RZM marked Walther PP is very rare piece. Produced in the 1934-36 time frame, I only know of 4 originals. Most RZM marked Walthers are the PPK model. As it was produced for the Nazi party, it should not have WaffenAmt stamps. Last one I saw at auction sold for $6500

Vern
It was a pleasant surprise to get a look at the pistol. Did not get around to how he got it, but just how rare it was.
It did have a holster with what looked like a German name on the inside flap. and had a matching magazine.
Why don't I get a little of that stuff once in a while.
Thanks for the info
Ed

Here is a photo of the last one I saw.....

Amazing! I had a blued S&W PPK a few years ago, and it just wasn't for me. What would one of these go for?

Pre-war PPKs boxed with accessories typically sell in the $3500-4000 range. I have tried several of the American made PP and PPK models. None come close to the fit, finish, and performance of the German or French made pieces.

I have heard the S&W ones are terrible.

The American made pieces have a problem with the trigger/sear/hammer. The parts are not well polished and the temper is too soft. You end up with a gritty or jerky trigger pull. A good gunsmith can rework them but it's easier just to buy the earlier models

Good to know, thanks. Haven't had the opportunity to try the earlier PPKs, but I would bet that you are right.



One reason I got rid of mine in fact! The magazine would sometimes fall out after unloading a round, lol. I even sent it in to S&W and that didn't help. Oh well, Glocks are the modern man's gun anyway.

An earlier model PPK would be very nice for display however!

Weak mag latch spring. If you want to rework a new one, you need to do three things. 1- Get a spring replacement kit from Brownells. 2- Use fine valve grinding compound on the slide rails and work it back and forth on the frame until it moves smoothly. Don't over do this step! 3- Remove the trigger, sear, and hammer. Pull the temper on each piece and polish the bearing surfaces. Then harden the parts and pull to a straw brown temper. Reassemble and it should show a tremendous improvement

A bit of an historical correction Vern. Carl Walther, the firm's namesake, died during WWI. He was succeeded in the management of the company by sons Fritz, Georg and Erich. Fritz was the master designer of the succession of models after WWI. He and his brothers and families were "escorted" out of the soon to be Red Army occupied Zella-Mehlis to the US occupied zone by US forces.

Vern, I have misgivings about these PPs and this one in particular. Notice the size of the font of the caliber designation: 7,65mm. The three numerals are all the same size. Now compare that with any other period Walther pistol, particularly the RZM PPKs and you will see that the size of those caliber designation numerals are of different size. The 7 is larger than the 65. Why? These Walther RZM PPs are fake with rework slides with lazer lettering. It can and is being done.

Yes, that one has been determined to be a fake.

The problem is there are several "proto-type" Walthers in collections which have supposedly been vetted but which all display the different font size in the caliber designation. What are we to make of those pistols?

Joe,

In collections around the world, there are 10-15 genuine prototype SA daggers. There are at least that many fakes with more under construction.

The answer with the SA daggers is deep knowledge of the genuine ones makes the ID of the fakes possible. I suspect the same is true of the PPKs.

Dave

Best we can do is study, study, study, and correct errors as we can. Here is one of the few RZM PPs that is generally accepted as original.