UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons Army, Navy, and Luftwaffe Forum Army Deep Orange grip

I just received my newest dagger, an Eickhorn Army with the deepest orange grip I have seen in a long time. I just love these dark grips. Dagger is completely uncleaned with perfect grip and not a ding on the scabbard. Blade is what most call "mint". The knot is frayed but it is so set in place it wont even move around pommel, the knot adds so much to the dagger. what do you guys think?

Nice looking piece. Can you show a close up of the cross guard? Looks like generic A. I know Eick used WKC fittings late during the war but never seen one with generic A crossguard.

No need for a close up, it's a generic A crossguard. Possible? maybe. I prefer an Eickhorn army dagger with an Eickhorn crossguard.

Danny

Patrick, This dagger is very familiar to me, I almost bought it myself! I just happen to live in the town were this dagger came from. I know the fellow that bought it from the returning Veteran and can vouch for its original state. I did an appraisal on this one for the guy in fact. This is a true example of a generic A guard fitted by Eickhorn to one of their products. Glad you appreciate the portopee too as I truly feel that it has never been removed since the German officer placed it there. Great piece with a great patina, if you decide to move it some time give me a shout! Best, Kevin.

Imho some collectors do look much to much for textbook... We totally forget how thinking was at these times the daggers were worn! I know and understand very well that in these days of excellent fakes the unexperienced collector should look for textbook examples. But when you see such an eaqual patinated dagger with honest traces of wear and age, it should not be shunned!
Just my personal point of view.
Patrick69 thank you for showing this interesting, nice dagger, regards,

We're not shunning this dagger, it looks great. Just providing an informative opinion which collector's can learn from, that's what this forum is all about

Nice looking dagger with a lot of character.

Looking for textbook examples has nothing to do with fakes imo. You don't need to be very experienced to see that the dagger that Patrick showed is original. The high prices are the real problem. I have heard stories of old collectors buying army daggers for $25 or less in the early days of collecting. There were also no reference books or the internet. Even in the seventies and eighties daggers were relatively cheap. The new collector does not get this opportunity anymore. Just look at the website of the most famous dealer in the US and you can see prices of over $1.000 for a common army dagger. Even on shows here in Europe a nice army dagger will easily fetch $500 and more. When the time comes that you (or your children) want to sell the collection, I know it will be easier if the dagger is a textbook piece because there simply are more collectors who would want it.

Wittmann actually has an Eick army with generic A cross guard for sale on his website:
AOD #37948C Army Officer's Dagger – Carl Eickhorn
http://www.wwiidaggers.com/37948.htm

Dear collector fellows, don´t take it personally. In my opinion there is much to much value set on "textbook" (I always dare to ask: "who´s textbook?????) and maker marked.
At best you see the mad side of looking for maker marks: If you have an SSchained dagger WITH mm the worth is LESS, if you have an army WITHOUT mm it´s worth is ALSO LESS....
Be sure that the period wearer of an army dagger without mm has not been a minuteness less proud about his dagger than the one with mm. And the same with the SSman who took his "old" dagger and did put it in the "new" chaned scabbard.
My personal line is, and I don´t want to persuade someone against his will, that when a dagger has been produced/worn during the period that way it is ok. When it is a -postwar- parts assamblance or an assamblence with fake parts it is NOT ok. No need for anyone´s textbook. The period manufacturers did not know (and would not have cared) what "textbooks" are used today. In progress of the war they were glad when they could get proper parts for their edged weapons.
When somebody is writing "...this dagger is not textbook..." or "..I would like to see it with an EICKHORN crossguard..." does implicate (at least in the background) that there is something "wrong" with this dagger where there is nothing wrong.
It is also -very- important for collectors to know when there is nothing wrong even when a dagger does look different to others.
I knew, and I have seen several of them, that EICKHORN did use this generic crossguard, but what is this knowledge worth - it´s not "textbook"...
As said, just my personal point of view.
Regards,

Just like I said, more than $1.000. I agree with Wotan that almost anything is possible when it comes to army daggers. But when you spend $1.000 on an army dagger and you have to work hard for that money it would be wise to consider the possibilities to sell it again if you ever need the money. If that time comes, you will find out that the socalled textbook dagger will sell faster and for a better price. But that is ofcourse just my opinion.

Thanks Kevin and all who responded. I have been in and out of this hobby for about 20 years now and the one thing I learned over the years in this hobby is "buy what you like". As Kevin above can attest to, this dagger is absolutely untouched (in my mind anyways), I paid $595 for it. Now since I just got back into collecting I have been hitting all the big guy's websites and I have seen daggers like this going for well over $800-1100. So in my mind, I kind of feel like I stole this thing at $595...and if I can find more like this, Ill buy every one of them. I am still learning the different aspects of the army cross-guards, so I cant comment on that. After reading the above comments I figured I better get schooled, I ordered Wittmann's Army book this morning. thanks again guys, all comments are appreciated.

Well said Wotan.

Gary

Thank you, Baz69!

Regards,

I have personally come across 2 Eickhorns with Generic A crossguards and both came from non collectors who obtained them from Vets. I really dont think Eickhorn churned out very many, but they certainly used that crossguard for a short time. Would be very interesting to find out when they ran out of stock and for how long they used the generic A? Must have been around 41 some time?

I personally have bought and owned 2 Eickhorn army daggers with Generic A crossguard. And both came from Veterans. In fact, I started a thread regarding this topic many years ago here on GDC.
It would seem that there was a specific period where Eickhorn didn't have stock of their own crossguard and I'm wondering if it wasn't in that period where their type 2 crossguard was used as that seems to be the most rare of the Eickhorn crossguards if I'm not mistaken? Or was it the type 3?

The 3rd type is way rarer then the second type.

Regards
Ger