UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons Miscellaneous Dagger Forum RAILWAY WATER PROTECTION DAGGER

It's just a thought, I see three daggers of this type for sale in known dealers, 2 are silver and one gold,. However, I see that the silver, there are indications in the most protected parts of the dagger, which retain their golden hand, near the rings of the sheath and the top of the scabbard.

Billy, who was offering?

"88" - yes, I saw that lightly golden tone on CG's dagger. I believe that to be toned lacquer, because the dagger shows no signs of aggressive cleaning ... which I think would be necessary to get all the rest of the gold off.

While this dagger that exposes Solingen88 had in his hands the last winter in Kassel Mr. Marcus and Mr. Weitze more Mr. Thomas M. Johnson. They could give their opinion since been examining the dagger in question ..
Is that the catalog Eickhorn had the option of gold and indeed the side of the sheath It is silver .... Well I hope you continue to comentarior of experts and thank you very much in advance

Back in '86, when I was putting my first calendar together, I was offered a photo of all three Railway daggers. One was gold, so I didn't want to use it. Then I was assured by dealers who had much more experience than I that this particular dagger was original. So for those of you who have a copy of the '87 calendar, take, a look at it.

Dave,

It was locally, a collector who has many high end items that's needs to liquidate some due to a divorce. Not that I was in a position to buy such an item but honestly, the color did put me off.

I think a very important fact in my opinion, is in Original image of the Reichsbahnschutz dagger, together with that of the Reichsbahn-Wasserschutz Polizei dagger,
as shown in the Eickhom Kundendienst.

Obviously the color is different, there is only one silver, the Reichbahnschutz and Reichsbahn-Wasserschutz appears darker

Perhaps, GOLDEN???

The dagger in the (ORIGINAL) picture is absolutely silver.

Interesting !!! Would be important to get this photo.

In  Mr. Frederick J. Stephens report , this photo is contained in Eickhorn Kundendienst

However, I can be wrong, of course

Here is a period letter from E u. F Hoerster offering its line of edged weapons etc for the Railway Police. The Bahnschutz dirk with hangers and portepee are itemised, but interestingly there is no listing of a seperate dagger for the RWP section.

(My thanks to collector/researcher Doug Gow of NZ for this doc.)

Here are some original pictures (used to print the catalog) with the (original Water color artwork) for the cover of the catalog... (I posted this picture on the forum 7 years ago..) part of my catalog and paperwork collection.

Barry cool Horster paper..

First, I would like to thank you for the interest in this topic, as Barry never existed the Railway Water dagger and according Damast existed, but only his silver version


Of course, there are two interesting documents, however, as evidence is inconclusive. That is an order of Horster not appear the railway water dagger does not mean that never existed. We all know that the most important manufacturer of this type of daggers was Eickhorn.

The other photos of the catalog Eickhorn, perhaps have a greater probative value, but not conclusive in my view, that all the changes are not included in these catalogs.



Still, there are two questions in the air,

  1- Were there really daggers Railway Water Protection


2- If we take for good the existence of such daggers were only silver or silver and gold.

Gentlemen, the discussion is still open in my opinion.

Some of these questions are answered in upcoming reference , with to date unpublished factory documents. http://www.eickhorn.com/
I find many(competent) collectors have spent much time and money gaining KNOWLEDGE in there collecting field. That is way some keep there WISDOM to themselves. (James Brown)
I have tried to give a hint on what is really known about this dagger but I guess you will have to wait to see it in print..
I have been working on doing this for years and it is starting to come together.. I have had sort of a crossroads the last year or so but I really still enjoy the hobby..I have had many collectors tell me I should do something Frederick Stephens also (since his name was used in the above post) ..
Regards: James
http://www.eickhorn.com/

I tried to post a photo of a set of Railway Water Protection Police hangers I purchased off Ebay a few years ago but for some reason I can't get it loaded. Anyway, after buying these hangers for the princely sum of $45.00, tried to sell them. It proved much harder than I thought it would be. Eventually a dealer friend of mine sold them to another dealer who had already turned me down based on condition.

Maybe this time it will work.

Brian !!! Your Friend must of given a COA...
Just a little Fun!!

I don't think he did, but I'm sure the buyer added these to a dagger and included them on a new COA.

I think it was wrong section, there is a section called Edged Weapons accountrements in this forum, or perhaps, should be included in the hobby humor corner or clowns.

Mr. Damast your link does not work you can check it? thank you

Well Brian I guess we are Clowns..
That is the beauty of forums people of many collecting levels can post here and ask for free information be it right or WRONG!!
I find many not all people who post some of this stuff do not even own many reference books on daggers. I show you period material and you do not understand even what you are looking at.
And of course there is a language barrier here also. As in my post it is plain as day that I'm working on a new project, reference, Document,book what ever you want to call it..This is way the link says COMING SOON. You will have to buy this reference book when complete..
People spend $25,000.00 + on daggers or try to sell daggers like this real or not and they do not even have the basics of reference,basic period catalogs or there reprints.. There is no excuse for this..Buy good reference books and catalogs!! As I can tell a few posting here have none or maybe a few and you know who you are..
And then you call Brian and I clowns.

I do respectfully disagree with a few posts that the educated collectors have on this thread. The above statement on my soap box is not directed at them.
As far as Gold daggers paper documents none have surfaced to my knowledge. So does that mean they did not make one? I can tell you the one pictured above is not one of them..

Mr. Damast, I could put a rough copy of all false daggers selling on E-bay, just have argued that doing this does not seem a serious argument.

I only said that this practice does not seem a serious argument, rather it is a comic plot.

I think anyone who put a dagger in this forum for analysis, then go up all the bad copies on the market to try to discredit the piece.

Clown is this technique, not you.

Gentlemen, we could restart this issue seriously and concentrate on the initial theme, the analysis of this dagger

Dear Sir:
I am typing slowly so maybe you'll understand why I posted the photo of the hangers. I assumed that with the dagger being as rare as it is that the hangers would be even more rare. I also thought that they were related to the dagger in question and that collectors might like to see them. I guess I was wrong, silly me.

Using your line of thought, if I had written proof of the existence of such a dagger, I should post it in the documents forum and not here.

OH well, it's back to the three ring circus for me.

Brian Rich

think you're right, I see this dagger exactly like one that is for sale, not the color, but appears to have a silver background

Well guys, I see no product reviews more about this special and much sought dagger. I think it would be time to give each of us our finding or opinion. If you want kids myself I start giving my opinion on the dagger in question. Thank you all for sharing the knowledge that everyone has. Regards Toni

Well It Began I to give my conclusion:
Sr.Solingen See that anybody to been able to contribute any proof to be able to say that the daga that you exposes was false.
( They do not cost the photos of photocopies to white and black framed neither a letter of purchase of another manufacturer put that the manufacturer that are studying is Eickhorn
What if we know was that in the catalog of Eickhorn habia the obcion Gold ... In fact all those that have seen have even visible strokes gold that over time seem to have disappeared ..
I repeat that it is my conclusion and the fotografias that you contributes are equal or better even and this in better been his that those that have seen on sale by the web...
Only say him ... That ... HAPPINESSES!! For possessing this piece and thank you very much for having taught and have opened this thread...
A greeting
Toni

Really nobody will pronounce taking evidence on the table ??
Well you'll have to leave your conscience. A gentlemen greeting

Mr. Damascus .... I pray that when your opinion ... elsewhere ..... professional opinions daggers like this .... How many have you had in your hands? .....

I'm late to the discussion, but as they might say, better late than never. In Atwood as the so-called 1st Model Railway dagger, it has been as of this September discussed at some length with the aid of a documentation specialist, and been found to have no period basis. With a primary "expert" in favor of the gold 'Water Protection' examples - none other than the late James Atwood and maybe some of his cronies. With the gold General Officers daggers discussed in the not too distant past also with no basis - but there is evidence in regulations for a specific type of gold hanger for the Army/Luftwaffe. Many often mistaking a gold colored zinc chromate in period use as a preventive layer to try and prevent a type of corrosion on zinc. With what looks like zinc chromate seen next to the bands on some of the daggers that are now for sale that did not wear off because it was protected by the bands.

Agreeing with Damast that with the image from the 1938 Eickhom Kundendienst it's proof there is no way that the dagger pictured is gold. And using the net sum zero technique from the 1st Model discussion - agreeing with Barry (and others) that while it's in the Eickhorn Kundendienst, that by itself is not conclusive. Because there should also be some period proof that it was actually commercially manufactured. Best Regards, Fred

Mr. Fred , I understand that says no models in this gold dagger ? ( in all the internet are ... Price : 48.000 € ) ... I understand also that the catalog Eickhorn .... This in black and white? or is hot ..... wonder why I understand your answer ... but I do not understand anything at all .... They have not contributed anything in my modest opinion that exclude this dagger original ..... greetings