UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories Miscellaneous German Uniforms Armband Guide

Added a few more to the Guide

I would just like to say that a few armbands in the armband guide aren't original IMO. I started a thread on it on WAF...
http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/showthread.php?t=679456

Post your comments here, please, Kyle.

I would also like to see your comments and the references you used to determine that the armbands are fake. A little documentation would be greatly appreciated.

After researching other forums and such, there are a few that seem to be fantasy such as the water police, NSFK, NSKK, Legion Condor armband and a few more. From my understanding the NSKK wore a standard party armband and no such NSFK existed. Also, this type of stitching on a party DAF from my research hasn't existed. They wore a printed DAF symbol on white cotton that was stitched into red cotton like a party armband. If it wasn't this then it was a regular party armband with the DAF symbol stamped into the armband. The water police I don't think would have a armband as no regular police had an armband. Also from a seller who sells fakes discussed on WRF by someone who showed me this list. That is also why they had a different arm insignia. The RAD wore a standard party armband except the leaders which wore the brown one you have. The NSDAP Race and Resettlement Office armband is from a seller known to sell fakes and wouldn't be as crude. The War Blinded Military, Railway Station Guard Officer, and Luftwaffe Railway Station Guard Officer are repros sold on ebay for about $8. I will continue a bit later... If you feel I am incorrect on something could you explain why so I could use this as a learning experience too. It is nice though that you built up this reference guide though as no other forum has this.

Here are the items that I mentioned are on ebay....
http://www.ebay.com/itm/German-ww2-Bahnh...=item256ff2a14b

http://www.ebay.com/itm/German-ww2-Blind...=item256ff22f24

http://www.ebay.com/itm/German-ww2-Bahnh...=item256ff28c55

Just found another....
http://www.ebay.com/itm/German-ww2-HILFS...=item256ff2a924

I started with Brian Davis' book and used photos I took at the shows to build the gallery. And have most of John Angolia's books to use as a reference. The Water Police and Resettlement armbands are new, sent in by a member. I haven't fully researched them yet but I'm working on it I'll go back and check the ones you listed and we can exchange ideas. If they are bad, they'll be removed! I wanted to put up some galleries that collectors can use to identify their items. In future, I hope to expand the galleries to include info on identifying originals versus repros.

Sounds good! I'll give you the link on the water police and resettlement armbands....
Also I will list some more information I think aren't good tomorrow as it will take a while. Hope I'm not being a pain in the neck!

Definitely not. I welcome all the help I can get to make the guides as useful as possible. Thanks for anything you can post!

Definitely not. I welcome all the help I can get to make the guides as useful as possible. Thanks for anything you can post!

Ok, I will continue to post some that I'm not so sure about. The SS volunteer I have read on some forum that it was a fantasy piece. I will find that ASAP. The NSKOV Veteran Armband I'm not saying isn't original it's just that they way the white circle is made is very odd. Also just wanted to point out that I beleive that the armband you have listed as a army parade steward is actually recruiting service. On the air crew member, on others I have seen the eagle is a different pattern and the text font is sightly different. On the Army Womens Auxiliary Service the printing looks more like a stamp which is concerning to me. There are a few with blurry pictures that are really impossible to tell if real or fake such as the the black printed text Feld Gendarmerie, Waffen SS Security Patrol, Police Interpreter and the Railways Station Officer Service. The green and white with purple stamp Luftschultz Auxiliary Armband has once again what looks like a stamp instead of printing which concerns me IMO and looks to be the same material as the fake holocaust armbands sold on ebay. The one labeled RLB Air Raid Warden I believe is actually a Werkluftschutz. These are the ones that concern me the most. The others besides the political because I know nothing about them are good IMO. Hope this helps!

This is what I was thinking about on the luftschutz armband I was questioning. Looks the same as this....



http://www.ebay.com/itm/German-WW2-Krieg...=item460f5aecb8

First update - DAF armband replaced with a correct version (first photo was probably made from a cut down flag). NSDAP Race and Resettlement (bad) replaced with the NSDAP Press Editor armband. Water Police and NSV Railway Station Service removed, probably bad. Customs armband replaced with early metal badge type. NSKOV removed pending further research, replaced with another local NSKOV armband. The Luftschultz Auxiliary Armband was seen at a show and checked by several cloth guys. Opinion is that it is a good, locally produced armband for a municipal air raid warden. Replaced the Luftwaffe Air Crew arm band. The 2 Volkssturm armbands were accepted as original at the show where I took the photos, and the eagle/lettering styles are supported by period photos.

Removed 3 RAD armbands as post war pieces. Replaced the NSKK armbands with better examples. Found a website that shows the difference between the good and repro SS Volunteer Armband. The one in the guide is good.

Just wanted to add in my way the NSDAP Press Editor (silver)still has the Race and Resettlement armband. Does anybody else see this? Good job with editing the guide. Looking better now. Also learned something new about the SS volunteer armband. I though all were fantasy!

Also found a uniforms that are NSFK wearing a party style armband. 1 in a collection and 1 period worn.

Also information from a NSFK collector on WAF...
http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/showthread.php?t=674692&highlight=nsfk+armband

Refresh your screen and the armband will change Still digging through and verifying.

Now it worked! Looks good. Emails sent btw...

Great and thanks very much. I'm saving the bad armband photos and thinking about adding a "Fantasy" section at the bottom of the guide.

It would be funny to see that! It would be good for the joke section too. I can think of about 6 fantasy armbands right now.....

Yes, and it would keep people from sending them when they didn't find one in the guide

Didn't think of it that way!

Removed Blinded Personnel, Condor Legion, Waffen SS Security Patrol, and bad Feld Gendarmerie armbands. Blinded Personnel armband needs further research as I have several dealers saying that it is period. Added good examples of the Air Crew and yellow Waffen SS armbands. Verified Waffen SS Interpreter armband as good. Added a few examples from Kyle. THANKS!! Eight armbands left to research.

Another update - DLV and NSFK armbands removed, different NSFK armband added, period photo on the way of the armband being worn with the flying coveralls at a glider competition. War Wounded arm band replaced with correct WW2 version, verified by period photos. Armed Forces Interpreter armband verified good. Some 35 or so armbands added to the guide (Thanks, Kyle!). Work Crew Leader verified as good. Waiting on verification on the final 2. Armband guide now contains 214 armbands

As a side note, verification consists of finding the armbands illustrated in reference books/period photos and getting conformation from knowledgeable dealers that they have handled original armbands of that type in the past.

Luftwaffe Railway Station Guard Officer misnamed, correctly identified and moved to the Reichbahn section.

Finished verification of armbands. Added several more including a Miscellaneous section. Red armband labeled as "Luftschutz Firefighter" moved to Miscellaneous section and correctly labeled as "German Communist - Red Brigade - Armband. Armband ID Guide contains 230 photos. Anyone with questions or original armband photos to contribute, please contact me

Great info guys lets keep it up

I believe the VDA armband is for the Verein f�r Deutsche Kulturbeziehungen im Ausland (VDA; "Association for German cultural relations abroad") especially when seen with that particular font/script. I don't believe it has anything to do with the automobile industry.

In addition, I have seen period pics and have owned a war blinded armband. I have seen two types: one with the iron cross between the 3 black circles and one without. In my experience the very early ones will be made of a very soft polished cotton with machine woven insignia.

You are correct with the VDA armband. I have never seen a machine woven war blinded. I would think that the woven would be later then the printed because on the HJ research forum the argument over late war printed and early war printed has been decided there. Printed armbands are earlier then the woven types. Not sure if this is for all but this goes for the HJ armbands as all period photos of the printed armbands have other signs like early HJ buckles and early shoulder straps to prove they are early.....

Also wanted to share this post on WRF saying that this armband is a fake as the text never existed in TR times.... Pretty interesting

For what its worth, the woven armband was shown to me by the bother of a man who lost his eyesight in Poland in 1939 and worked for the German Railway service from 1940 onwards, wearing that armband on his service tunic.

Then it is believable. I will have to do some research on them! This will be something new for me!

Just a question but did this type have the cross or the circles only?

Kyle, are there period in wear images of printed HJ armbands that can be posted without copyright infractions? I have never seen one. Have seen some that were purported as such but the images were not very clear. Do you have an example?
There are some collectors that are vehement that they never existed and quote regulations.

--dj--Joe

I will post the link to the thread on there. You should be able to see pictures. If not I will try to post them...

Here is one. Let me know if the link works for you. If it does, note the SA buckle....
http://www.hj-research.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=2459&d=1248379595

maybe of interest....


http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/showthread.php?t=548603&highlight=hj+sheet

photo for reference and it is from a vet lot so 100% original!

Kyle, thanks,

I do recall having seen uncut sections before. Seems like on a dealers site. Not too long ago.

I'm not a member of the HJ forum so can't see their images. You should probably not post any images from there to here.

--dj--Joe

It was posted on WAF so I found it. Notice the SA buckle....

Interesting but you know there will be naysayers that will say that it is a two piece and not printed.

--dj--Joe

I know but I don't see how it can be any thing else besides printed because it is all the same level and no outlining like your would see in a photo...

Hi Joe, this has been proven over on the Hitler Youth Forum. Primary literature shows that the printed armband was not only made but was, for a time, officially approved. The photo of the HJ boy shown by kylesbullets belongs to the admin over there by the way.

Didn't know the photo belonged to him. Found it posted by a completely different person on WAF

Nork, thank you. Should the Admin. of the Hitler Youth forum want the image removed or an added acknowledgement to his ownership let us know.

--dj--Joe

A promise filled. Images of my printed HJ arm band. Note the differences.
One pic. per post for details.

--dj--Joe

Close up obverse.

--dj--Joe

Reverse.

--dj--Joe

Inside view. (Color is off - too bright - same camera same light).


--dj--Joe

Last image.
Close up inside.

--dj--Joe

Thanks for the picture as you said Joe! It looks like it was a normal length then shortened and then the adjustment was removed correct? Pretty cool. Thanks again!

Yep. It's hard to say when the threads were pulled out. Post war for a collectors display would be a probable. I've had it for a looooong time, as is.

I would post it here
http://phpstack-500133-1583587.cloudwaysapps.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=286709#Post286709

But since it's controversial to many think to hold off.
Kyle, have you seen any like mine in your research? Somewhere I saved one image that matches it. Not an inwear, just another example.

--dj--Joe

I haven't seen another with the stitching like this on an HJ armband if this is what you mean. There was always the rumor of the printed HJ armbands with stamps inside were fake but they also said printed HJ armbands were fake so we will never know. I think it looks good though...

just wondering if it is possible to find the variation of the volkssturm armband with the right eagle's head facing left. Most of them have the head facing right on both eagles....

Found one first link is the backwards head variation....
http://www.germanwarbooty.com/item-cloth/cloth%20c2393.htm
then the normal....
http://www.germanwarbooty.com/item-cloth/cloth%20c1665.htm

Here is one from 1935. No Idea what it is.

Dave

Maybe a SA troop leader armband of some sort? He is SA right?

Armband Guide updated

YAY!! the guide is huge now. To fix something, there is a type on the midwife. It says widwife. Also to be fore specific on the black KDF armband it is a tour guide...

Got it

Also to be more descriptive on the red wehrmacht armband, it is for snow uniform ID. It was used to tell if a person in uniform was german or not. It was put in a cycle and different colors were used on different days. I know they also came in yellow and orange as of now....

Added the description, and armbands for the Swedish NSAP, and 6 various resistance groups

Vern:

Here is an armband from the Norwegian NS Rikshird, the equivalent to the SA.

John

Another update

Vern:

Is there a reference to SS cufftitles or will there be one?

BTW, the black Norwegian armband is for the Rikshird (the adult equivalent to the SA), while the green one is for the Unghird (the youth equivalent to the Hitler Youth).

John

Thanks John. I made the correction. No SS cufftitle reference yet but I can build one. I have a good SS cloth reference book. Let me see what photos I already have

A cuff title guide would be great too. there are as many of them as armbands though :s

Initial counts are approximately 190 cuff titles authorized for all SS components. Now to go through the photos and see what I have

What about the Heer and Luftwaffe cuff titles lol

plus cufftiltles for the allied units (ie. Germanske SS Norge, plus the ones for the Hird districts in Norway).

John

I would guess there is over 300 cuff titles and there is campaign cuff titles....

Just have to build them one at a time The Campaign cuff titles are in the "Awards - Shields/Cufftitles" gallery.

Never looked past the shields! Makes sense to have them there. Thanks for pointing that out....

Since having shoulder surgery last week, I haven't been doing much beyond clicking a mouse or hitting a key on the computer keyboard I did use the spare time to build an SS Cuff Title Gallery that can be seen HERE! I didn't realize that the SS had approximately 170 cuff titles! I want to give a special thanks to the members who sent photos of cuff titles from their collections, and to a few who sent in-wear photos, especially for some of the more obscure units like the British Free Corps. Please take a look and let me know if you see any errors or find any missing. As far as I know, these are all the cuff titles that were issued and worn but do not include approximately 18 Honor Titles given to some Standarten.

Dannng that's a lot! There is still more armbands somehow though lol.....

Another update, now have 396 armbands posted and identified

Yep there is too many lol

Replaced a coupe with better photos.