UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories Police Uniforms Forum Little Police display!

Just wanted to show a nice display of police! Rural
stuff makes nice display!

I always like putting things together for display!

Lets see yours!

PVON

I have this long clamshell by Eickhorn which has a TR period badge, but escaped cut down and retained its Weimar period frog/knot. No markings on this bayo'. The scabbard leather is black.

Just a beauty! Sure is nice! Glad it escaped the cutdown!

Thanks for showing!

Now that is a super piece Barry. Love the gilt still retained on the entire piece. I had one like that that I sold to Tredwin awhile back. I am fascinated by the frog that is back with the blue material. Usually, such material reflects the material of the uniform of the wearer. Do you think this is an Imperial blue or perhaps a Prussian blue from either the Schupo or Gemeindepolizei?

I find the frog a bit odd. If it is Weimar as you write, while is the center of the knot filled with III Reich colors- schwarz, weiss, rot? I would have thought it would be black as a Weimar era Prussian knot should be. Do you think this knot is Imperial too? But the only black, white, red colors were Imperial and for the Schutztruppen, no?

Thanks Joe. If I have interpreted the historical background aright, I thought that the Prussian Blue felt backing on the frog might be for the Schupo "Blue Police" in conformity with a Treaty of Versailles condition restricting the various Weimar police forces from wearing the "militarised" Feldgrau uniform (also observed in the very early TR period, until they effectively "tore up" the treaty). The knot could be early TR, the early Eickhorn TM certainly places the piece on the cusp of transition from Weimar to TR.
Unfortunately I have no provenance with this bayonet, but in hand it has the appearance of all items being together for many years, perhaps having been set aside as redundant.

Two very nice Polizei-Seitengewehre guys!

Here is one of mine that is like Barry's in that it is also made by Eickhorn with the only alteration being the new Model 1936 grip eagle. Mine has the same polished (Glatt) gold Tombak finish, maker marking, and lack of any other markings. It does have a brown scabbard and a standard NCO knot however. It is shown laying on a Prussian Landjagerei uniform.

Concerning Barry's knot and frog, I notice the following: The knot appears to be a standard Police Officer knot with the red center stripe on the strap carefully removed. I see the stitching holes but no red thread. Joe is right that this could also be a Nationale Imperial Portepee held over into later times. The blue felt backing is really interesting and I have no explaination for it except wear with a blue uniform. However, look at the blue collar tabs and cap band on the green Prussian Landjagerei uniform. They also seem to match up in an unexpected way.

Orpo

Thats why I enjoy starting these threads!

Super items shown and good discussion by members teach us all!

Thanks guys!

PVON

And that is a handsome one George. Barry has a black scabbard and yours is brown. Both Eickhorns. The frogs look to be the same design also. Here is mine. A Clemen & Young, but not modified with the 1936 Police eagle.


Mine has a bit more wear to the gold finish that is only visible in the recesses of the eagle pommel, the underside of the clamshell and other protected parts. The reinforcement rivets on the frog are all brass save for one replacement. And the lower scabbard fitting staple seems to have a marking similar to yours George. But look at this photo.



The scabbard throat and upper fitting are cast as one piece with no connecting screws. The only attachment point is the upper staple. Looking into the scabbard throat, there is only one scabbard spring and it is attached by a hook over the leather then the upper fitting was pushed down. Is that the design of yours, Barry and George?

You can see the back of the frog here with the brass rivets. No markings. This frog has been on forever. No evidence of removal such as pressure cracks from pushing the frog stud through the frog hole.



I know there has been much discussion of different theories about these bayonets. We know from the original orders creating these Prussian bayonets in 1929 that all three branches of the Prussian police used bayonets with nickel fittings. The only differences were the brown scabbard for Landjagerei and black for Schupo and Gemeinden. This was reinforced in the 1932 Prussian Clothing Regulations. But the excessive use of brass has always brought my thoughts to water. The RWS (Reichswasserschutz) was in charge of the German nations waterways from 1921-1931 (I may be off a year either way). With the dissolution of the RWS, the states assumed control with their respective Wasserschutzpolizei. The Prussian Water Protection Police was subordinated to either the Schupo or Landjagerei depending on the particular waterway. In a privately published history of the RWS is a nice photo of an early Prussian Water Policeman wearing a dark tunic I assume is blue with a M1929 Polizei Seitengewehr on his belt. I have been unable to find any regulations governing the bayonets for this branch, but I am fond of the idea of these brass examples being for the Prussian Wasserschutzpolizei.

Nice bayonet Joe! I have seen this construction before but mine has the two-piece throat. There is a gilt steel screw that holds the throat piece on the obverse side.

Yep, I too am unsure about the RWS or later WSP. It makes sense for them to wear gold colored bayonets but like you I have never seen any regulations, or period information, saying they wore anything but the standard silver color. I learned a long time ago to never say never but I also hate the way some folks hype police items to attempt to make them sell for more money. The whole terminology of "SS-Police" comes to mind in that regard.

For instance, the use of gold colored enlisted belt buckles. They are always listed as Water Police rather than Traffic Police because WSP folks are seen as being sexier than traffic cops. Since we also know that the gold color buckles were also authorized for the Emsland Prison Police where do they fall on the sexy scale? One never sees these buckles listed as prison warden buckles.

I have two long clamshell police bayonets, both in silver. One has the double oval serrated tail TM and the other has the 35-41 seated squirrel mark.

Gents,

Thanks to all of you for sharing your great collections and expert observations with us. Super info for anyone with a sincere interest in German police sidearms.

Best!

Bill

Thanks to all who have posted! Great stuff



PVON

Fire Police visor!

I have a soft spot for these! Got one from a vet when I was a youth! And HJ flag from trunk when I was helping at flea market!

They were sharp looking!

Pvon,

Here is your cartrouche box in wear for Police Officers. Also, an Officer example of your FW cap.