Translate German to English - Click here to open Altavista's Babel Fish Translator Click here to learn about all those symbols by people's names.

leftlogo.jpg (20709 bytes)

Upgrade to Premium Membership

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#281341 04/26/2013 03:20 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
ORPO Offline OP
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
Gents,

Since several folks are opening up new threads I thought I would start one on a rather scarce police uniform. This is the Gendarmerie Ski Tunic that was specifically made for German Police mountain troops who were trained for service in the snow.

The tunic is outwardly very similar to the standard Gendarmerie service tunic at first glance but it has very specific features. The dedicated ski uniform was made to be as windproof and snowproof as possible by having functioning button cuffs on the sleeves and a drawstring waist. The back is entirely different as well to allow free movement of the arms to maneuver ski poles and it has no slit in the tail that would allow wind or snow entry.

These tunics are seldom seen and few know that they even exist. Anyone have one of these or perhaps a pair of the specialized police ski pants?

Gend ski tunic.JPG (58.02 KB, 114 downloads)
Gend ski tunic collar.JPG (75.82 KB, 111 downloads)
Gend ski tunic back.JPG (57.8 KB, 110 downloads)
Gend ski tunic interior.JPG (41.84 KB, 108 downloads)
Gend ski tunic eagle.JPG (108.8 KB, 107 downloads)

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
ORPO #281342 04/26/2013 05:09 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
ORPO Offline OP
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
Here is a photo of the wartime Knotel police uniform plate showing this outfit in wear. Notice the specialized ski pants and boots being worn as well.

There follows an example of the police lightweight rucksack worn by mountain troops as well as an example of the Winter Gendarmerie Ski Cap that is padded for warmth. Both of these items are shown in the uniform plate.

Knötel Gendarmerie.jpg (38.32 KB, 103 downloads)
Gend light equip.JPG (30.63 KB, 103 downloads)
Gendarmerie Wintermutze.JPG (22.84 KB, 103 downloads)

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
ORPO #281723 04/28/2013 03:01 PM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,980
Likes: 4
Offline
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,980
Likes: 4
George,

Were these guys attached to Gebigsjäger outfits or actually seperate police units that operated in mountainous areas?

Very nice uniform!

Best regards,

Bill

WWII #281728 04/28/2013 03:41 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
ORPO Offline OP
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
Hi Bill,

These Gendarmerie guys were separate from the Heer Gebrigsjager and the Zollschutz mountain units. They all worked in consort of course but they all had separate chains of command. These Gendarmerie Ski Units were very active in such places as occupied Norway and Austria and had their own training facilities and occupational specialities (MOS).

These uniforms are easy to overlook unless you know what you are looking at.

Here is a photo of some of these Gendarms at a ski training school.

They also wore a distinctive double breasted short coat that I will see if I can get a photo of for you.

George

Pol Kar98a ski.JPG (48.07 KB, 93 downloads)

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
ORPO #281873 04/29/2013 04:33 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
ORPO Offline OP
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
Bill,

I was able to take a couple of photos of the Police short coat for mountain troops. It is made of a fairly windproof police green salt and pepper material and is double breasted and is made long enough to cover the butt.

Pol mtn coat 2.JPG (62.8 KB, 88 downloads)
Pol mtn coat back.JPG (61.35 KB, 88 downloads)

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
ORPO #282079 04/30/2013 04:36 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,682
Likes: 54
P
Offline
P
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,682
Likes: 54
very good thread and great pics!

Your right in that it would be easy to overlook if you didn't
know what to look for!

You have a great eye for detail and also some great things
in your collection!

PVON

ORPO #282094 04/30/2013 07:15 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,122
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,122
Likes: 1
Originally Posted By: ORPO
Hi Bill,
These Gendarmerie guys were separate from the Heer Gebrigsjager and the Zollschutz mountain units. They all worked in consort of course but they all had separate chains of command. These Gendarmerie Ski Units were very active in such places as occupied Norway and Austria and had their own training facilities and occupational specialities (MOS).

These uniforms are easy to overlook unless you know what you are looking at.

Here is a photo of some of these Gendarms at a ski training school.

They also wore a distinctive double breasted short coat that I will see if I can get a photo of for you.

George



George, what wonderful pieces you have added to the collection. The Bergrock is very nice, as is the Windjacke. Is the Bergrock the winter version of regular base cloth or the summer weight version of lighweight base cloth material? All of this was part of the Mountain Uniform (Berganzug) for the Gendarmerie created on Jan 13, 1939. The Skiläufer Uniform was the same as the Winter Mountain Uniform with the change to ski gloves and ski boots. The winter

I don't believe this uniform was intended for combat purposes like the Gebirgsjäger of the Heer and Polizei. It was designed for Gendarmes on domestic single partrol duty in the mountainous areas of Austria and Bavaria where the local police were renamed the Hochgebirgsgendarmerie in August 1941. Some Gendarmerie may have been posted to Norway, but I am not aware of any specific units other than the occupying police Schupo batallions and later regiments.


"This hobby is a continuing education"
Looking for Walther Model 8 #727649
and Walther PP #975557
ORPO #282098 04/30/2013 08:58 PM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,725
Likes: 1
W
Offline
W
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,725
Likes: 1
Thanks George. As always a pleasure to peak into your extensive collection of items we would otherwise never see.

Regards,
Bill Unland

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
ORPO Offline OP
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
Thanks for the kudos guys. The police forum was a bit slow and I am glad the uniforms are appreciated.

Joe, this is the lightweight Summer cloth version of the tunic. Not specifically an active duty style tunic as you point out. Of course, these were worn before the establishment of the combat uniform made without the brown collar and cuffs. This later active duty uniform is shown under the Windjacke in the photo. Here is a pix of the Officer version of the combat uniform.

George

Gend Off field tunic.JPG (70 KB, 60 downloads)
Gend Off field tunic collar.JPG (64.27 KB, 60 downloads)
Gend Off field tunic back.JPG (60.88 KB, 60 downloads)

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
ORPO #282160 05/01/2013 08:33 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,122
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,122
Likes: 1
George, I can't remember if you got your Schijacke from me at the SOS or did I sell it to someone else. I have forgotten to make a note in the files.

The Mountain Tunic for Gendarmerie you have is basically a M1936 standard police tunic designed for use by Gendarmes on everyday patrol duty as part of the Hochgebirgsgendarmerie. When the rucksack wasn't worn, the Gendarmes worn the cross strap with their belt, along with an S84/98 and portepee and their pistol in holster. Now you need skis or the mountain axe. And don't forget the boots.


"This hobby is a continuing education"
Looking for Walther Model 8 #727649
and Walther PP #975557
JoeW #282175 05/02/2013 05:46 AM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,122
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,122
Likes: 1
Pulling out the reference books provides some interesting development of this service uniform. I can't find the in-depth discussion that took place either on this forum or WAF concerning the dating of the "Die Ordnungspolizei" folio. I cannot remember what dates we assigned to it, but reading the text on the page opposite the Gendarmerie-Skiläufer/Dienst-Anzug page, it is obviously dated before the January 1939 order creating the Berganzug f. Gendarmerie that identified an additional ski outfit for the Gendarmerie. The text opposite the Knotel photo identifies the uniform as the Dienstanzug (Service Dress) f. Skiläufer d. Gendarmerie. The text explains that the Gendarmerie serving in areas with mountains or snowy areas were equipped with snow shoes and received special training in high alpine service (Hochalpinist) resulting in the awarding of an insignia upon achieving recognition as a Gendarmerie-Hochalpinist.

No special uniform is mentioned for his service, but for those high mountain Gendarmes who participate in skiing in police training or competitions at the three ski schools in the , this uniform was created. The ski uniform was further identified in the first February 1938 clothing regulations, which predates the inclusion of Austria into the Reich and the mention of the ski school in the Tirol and the Hochalpinist Abzeichen in the Knotel folio.

So it seems, the skiing uniform was created for sporting purposes in the Old Reich, then continued with the addition of the mountains in the Ostmark and finally changed to a modification of the Mountain Service Dress for Gendarmerie in January 1939.


"This hobby is a continuing education"
Looking for Walther Model 8 #727649
and Walther PP #975557
JoeW #282193 05/02/2013 05:12 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
ORPO Offline OP
OP Offline
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155
Likes: 5
Thanks for the information on the regulations Joe. As I recall offhand Hugh and Jack found the regulations for the ski pants but not for the tunic when I looked this up in their book a couple of years ago.

BTW, I did buy this Wind Jacke from you at SOS several years ago. Your memory is still intact!


"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson

Link Copied to Clipboard
Popular Topics(Views)
2,263,708 SS Bayonets
1,762,104 Teno Insignia Set
1,131,062 westwall rings
Latest New Threads
Overslept a development???
by wotan - 04/15/2024 03:30 PM
Japanese Dagger
by Mikee - 04/14/2024 04:48 PM
Unmarked Kriegsmarine Dagger
by Coyote_Kyle - 04/12/2024 07:07 PM
Das Alte Schutzenscheibe (The old Shooting Target)
by C. Wetzel-20609 - 04/10/2024 09:52 PM
Small pennant question.
by Dutchman - 04/07/2024 08:57 PM
Latest New Posts
Study and learning materials
by Gaspare - 04/18/2024 01:54 PM
Overslept a development???
by sellick8302@rogers.com - 04/18/2024 01:13 PM
Personalized reproduction honor ring source?
by Gaspare - 04/18/2024 12:32 PM
Unmarked Kriegsmarine Dagger
by Coyote_Kyle - 04/17/2024 01:58 AM
Bulgarian Brannik youth knife - real?
by wotan - 04/15/2024 06:46 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums42
Topics31,667
Posts329,025
Members7,517
Most Online5,900
Dec 19th, 2019
Who's Online Now
9 members (Coyote_Kyle, Vern, Nietzsche, Paul, derjager, Gaspare, Jamesol2, Stephen, Dave), 733 guests, and 125 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5