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#248379 07/11/2011 06:40 AM
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Hello I am from Russia. In my collection were two postal daggers mail protection. There are doubts about the authenticity. Help identify this fake or original?

1

2
3

4
5
6

7
8

Thank you very much.

Last edited by Dimon2002; 07/11/2011 06:46 AM.
Dimon2002 #248381 07/11/2011 07:23 AM
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Im no expert on these, but i dont see anything wrong with them. The numbers are strange (being exactly 300 apart and all using the 0 and 4 and what could be a 6 turned unside down to make the 9) but i dont think thats the case, because i dont see any thing wrong with the daggers themselves.


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I agree with Rick-curious coincidence on the numbering but from these photos I see no issues

Paul


FUR EHR' UND PFLICHT BIS HERZ UND KLINGE BRICHT
Paul #248395 07/11/2011 11:10 AM
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Looks like there's sufficient detail where there needs to be. Very interesting coincidence about the numbers but even a skeptical guy like me thinks these daggers are original.


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Billy G. #248396 07/11/2011 11:39 AM
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I think both dirk copy. For that would not be unfounded. Notice the bird on the grip, and if we get better photos then I think that trademarck is not the best quality. On some Russian forums discussed in detail these post daggers and made a comparative picture. I run them here.

all.jpg (48.58 KB, 671 downloads)
birds.jpg (112.6 KB, 674 downloads)
tang.jpg (35.24 KB, 668 downloads)
Last edited by den70; 07/11/2011 11:48 AM.

Buy Casberg sketches.
den70 #248398 07/11/2011 11:54 AM
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These daggers have enough mass circulation in the collections and dealers the former Soviet Union. When comparing two dirks with normal and this bird you'll notice the difference in the geometry and dimensions of parts.

pomel.JPG (50.1 KB, 667 downloads)
number.jpg (58.63 KB, 670 downloads)
logo.jpg (56.56 KB, 669 downloads)
Last edited by den70; 07/11/2011 11:54 AM.

Buy Casberg sketches.
den70 #248399 07/11/2011 11:58 AM
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I think it's not unusual for one producer dirks unreleased short period of time. Some specimens even have the same number. Close pictures logo with marriage etching.

num2.jpg (112.12 KB, 672 downloads)
PS-PW-FAKE-1.jpg (109.92 KB, 679 downloads)

Buy Casberg sketches.
den70 #248422 07/11/2011 09:11 PM
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To den70
I do not agree! Daggers look original, maybe a repainted scabbard
I do not mean your posts and photos of the author topic

Last edited by alien; 07/11/2011 09:13 PM.

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alien #248450 07/12/2011 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted By: alien
To den70
I do not agree! Daggers look original, maybe a repainted scabbard
I do not mean your posts and photos of the author topic


I do not understand about what daggers you write. About my daggers what do you think?

Dimon2002 #248462 07/12/2011 07:57 AM
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Sorry, but Spanish copies from the late 1960s IMO. Fonts on the letters and number wrong, grip insignias very bad and in the light the composition of the pommel and crossguard should look too golden from wrong metal base. The larger pommel on the one dagger is from an RLB EM and not the right size. Many other problems too much to go into this late.


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Dimon2002 #248464 07/12/2011 09:01 AM
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Dimon your dagger normal

Last edited by alien; 07/12/2011 09:02 AM.

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den70 #248467 07/12/2011 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted By: Ronald Weinand
Sorry, but Spanish copies from the late 1960s IMO.


Originally Posted By: den70
I think both dirk copy.


Originally Posted By: alien
Dimon your dagger normal


Originally Posted By: Billy G.
Looks like there's sufficient detail where there needs to be. Very interesting coincidence about the numbers but even a skeptical guy like me thinks these daggers are original.



50/50 smile
Thank you all. I will add a few more photos
1,1
1,2
1,3
1,4

2,1
2,2
2,3
2,4

Dimon2002 #248468 07/12/2011 09:35 AM
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Clearly different locks
and

Dimon2002 #248479 07/12/2011 05:45 PM
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These daggers would fool many collectors especially the one with the smaller head on the grip eagle--but the funky grip eagle, TM, font stamping of the numerals and letters and the snap are immediate indicators of an improper piece. It's truly amazing that any factory capable of production of such a piece would not make it correctly. They could do it-no question. But for some reason-they have not--Yet.


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Lol..I stand corrected.From the orginal photos they looked good to me. Im hoping this is one of those cases where if in hand and closer (like in the later post)you would be able to tell. Good post. This is a post people can learn from.


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Vitali(alien), can we hear your arguments about the originality of dirks topic starter?

Dmitry(Dimon2002), I put pictures in your theme as not all the American colleagues can see them in the original themes on the Russian forums. I think that your new pictures only confirm my opinion. Just trust the words of the original or a fake is not worth it. Let those who tell you that these daggers originals argue their position.
I clearly reasoned my opinion, Ron and Houston gave his opinions on some things indicating that he did not like. But defenders of the items were of the opinion only with no arguments.

Perhaps the first photos could be misleading, but the last of your photo to help make a final verdict this dagger.


Buy Casberg sketches.
den70 #248505 07/13/2011 02:19 AM
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Based on the better subsequently posted pictures & certainly the opinions of some of our most experienced members, I'd also have to rethink my thoughts. With the better pictures I can see one of the maker's marks that certainly looks off as well as the larger of the 2 grip adlers. I didn't pick up on the crossguard numbers being off but am glad for the info to study. Many of the Postschutz copies I've seen were not this well done & with the addition of 40+ years of age, they do look convincing.


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Billy G. #248510 07/13/2011 06:33 AM
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Den70 has shown us different daggers from the topicstarter have. He also gave false info.
Thread ignored because of trolling.

Last edited by anlvd2; 07/13/2011 07:20 AM.

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anlvd2 #248537 07/13/2011 02:52 PM
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Some additional information--when we saw these daggers in the 70's-along with many other repros-in my memory-the fake Postschutz daggers did not have chains -also when seen in hand they did not have good definition of parts,and had, as Ron said- the wrong finish. Originals have bright nickel plated fittings while the fakes have yellowish or dull colored fittings. Also you might notice that the fake grips are a bit too thick in the center. It is also interesting to note that these 60's-70's fakes are very seldom seen today-and there were hundreds if not thousands on the market at one time. Where are they? In collections-all over the world.


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I am a young collector, and such discussion itís good help to guys like Iím. And guys like Ron, den70, Houston thank you for you help. I can not so easily as you define those copies, as far as its real dagger or not. I read the forum carefully, this is one of the best and detailed discussions for last time. My collection is very modest and somewhat daggers SA and family bayonet of my grandfather, who he brought back from the WW2.
I do not understand these guys like, "anlvd2Ē and ďalien" if they think staff is real, let him give his opinions, each time to see if the original or not. And so it is only "blah, blah, blah" I know some guys. I think maybe, someone sold the daggers to Dimon2002, and now trying to make the original. Or are you trying to be his "lawyers" seller.


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Originally Posted By: Ronald Weinand
Sorry, but Spanish copies from the late 1960s IMO.

I'm sorry but I'd like to see photos of these "Spanish copies"

Anybody can show the photo "Spanish copies"?

crusader #248586 07/14/2011 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted By: crusader
I think maybe, someone sold the daggers to Dimon2002, and now trying to make the original. Or are you trying to be his "lawyers" seller.



This is nonsense! You can not accuse people without knowing them. They do not sell knives to me!

crusader #248589 07/14/2011 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted By: crusader
I think maybe, someone sold the daggers to Dimon2002, and now trying to make the original. Or are you trying to be his "lawyers" seller.



This is nonsense! You can not accuse people without knowing them. They do not sell knives to me!

Dimon2002 #248591 07/14/2011 02:39 PM
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Wow ! What a dust up ! Hard to tell who is who and what is what.

By the way, "Crusader", if you are from "Camberland,MD", how did you sign up from the Ukrane? laugh laugh

Dave #248594 07/14/2011 04:03 PM
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Hi,w up?i travel all over this wy!!!!!

crusader #248599 07/14/2011 04:58 PM
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That's daggers in parts submitted Dimon 2002
See no reason for concern, the original






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alien #248632 07/15/2011 04:45 PM
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Greetings a forum. I will answer, why I consider that daggers in a theme-fake. To begin with some photos.
1-Brand of the manufacturer not the correct.

!5.jpg (64.87 KB, 297 downloads)
ivan 66 #248633 07/15/2011 04:46 PM
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2-eagle not the correct.

Greens on all knifes-rubbish(fake).


!6.jpg (93.41 KB, 296 downloads)
Last edited by ivan 66; 07/15/2011 05:24 PM.
ivan 66 #248634 07/15/2011 04:48 PM
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3-Number, garda-not the correct.

!7.jpg (105.79 KB, 297 downloads)
ivan 66 #248635 07/15/2011 04:52 PM
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You at a forum have this theme.
http://phpstack-500133-1583587.cloudwaysapps.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=101801&page=4
Compare numbers which are led round by red colour and look at theme date.

111.JPG (86.98 KB, 293 downloads)
ivan 66 #248636 07/15/2011 05:02 PM
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Now a photo for comparison of an original blade and other counterfeit wedge as in a theme

132f1013ced5.jpg (57.06 KB, 375 downloads)
Last edited by ivan 66; 07/15/2011 05:03 PM.
ivan 66 #248637 07/15/2011 05:08 PM
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Still a photo

fake+orig-2.jpg (68.71 KB, 368 downloads)
ivan 66 #248638 07/15/2011 05:15 PM
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Tails are larger.Original and a fake.

I ask to pay attention to length of a carving, that the letter-H th to a fake is brighter, better than on my original. Other photos original daggers are welcomed. Thanks.



ghghghgjjg.jpg (80.74 KB, 368 downloads)
Last edited by ivan 66; 07/15/2011 05:16 PM.
ivan 66 #248640 07/15/2011 05:42 PM
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Now I will put 6 photos of an original brand of the manufacturer which I took without the permission on different resources.
Difference see between 7 and one brand?

http://www.wwiidaggers.com/32309.htm
http://www.therupturedduck.com/WebPages/Edged/e532.htm
And so on.

992d9a2a19ee.jpg (92.07 KB, 353 downloads)
ivan 66 #248648 07/15/2011 10:03 PM
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Please tell me Im not the only one who has completely lost the plot on this thread............??

Paul


FUR EHR' UND PFLICHT BIS HERZ UND KLINGE BRICHT
Paul #248649 07/15/2011 11:52 PM
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Paul,

Dimon2002, from Russia, posted two Postal daggers. Shortly thereafter DEN70 said they were fakes and being discussed on Russian forum and that they are common there. He posted pictures that are convincing.

Alien, also from Russia, said they were OK but offered no reason. Dimon2002 said he did not understand and Ron Weinand said they were known Spanish copies. Alien said that he daggers were "normal" .. again with no supporting argument.

Dimon2002 added more pictures and Huston Coates said they would fool many people.

DEN70 asks Alien and Dimon2002for proof. anlvd70, again from Russia sides with Dimon2002 and alien but offers no proof. Huston Coates adds more detail about the fakes.

Crusader signs on, saying he is from "Camberland, MD" and posts a somewhat difficult to understand opinion from ... somewhere in the Ukrane laugh

Dimon2002 makes three posts protesting. Alien posts Dimon2002's pictures saying there is no cause for concern.

Ivan 66 posts a good photo analysis showing why he thinks they are fake. Very convincing, I might add.



That's it so far.

Dave





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It would seem that there is a new crop of fakes-Made in Russia? Teno Officers also. What else? I have not seen these in the US-yet. How about the UK ? Germany ? Anywere else?


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In a photo where I showed shafts I was mistaken a little, I will try to explain why I will show one more fake and you will understand that shafts identical.
Spitzer-RLB.Orig+2fake


3824793e4801.jpg (82.64 KB, 282 downloads)
Last edited by ivan 66; 07/16/2011 05:13 AM.
ivan 66 #248656 07/16/2011 05:15 AM
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Here shafts from post daggers.

e2d356e33f2b.jpg (96.83 KB, 278 downloads)
ivan 66 #248657 07/16/2011 05:17 AM
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Now all together, 2 fakes and one original.

I consider that shafts on fakes identical on manufacture, letters H-counterfeit, a carving long.


e25a0734fb2b.jpg (98.83 KB, 279 downloads)
Last edited by ivan 66; 07/16/2011 05:22 AM.
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