UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories Miscellaneous German Uniforms political leaders in the D.A.F. question ?

hello gents. I already talked to Mr. clark on this question, got some good info .
BUT, missing a "list" of the titles of political leaders in the D.A.F. does any one here know what I'm talking about ?
this idea came out in 1939. but seems a lack of interest in some circles to push this forward.
as I under stand there were 8 diffrent armbands used (which I know of), but for each armband there could be several different collar tabs that could be worn = depending on the person's pay grade.
1) no idea which tabs might go to which arm bands
2)I know of only a few of the titles given ,per tab. but, these titles do not seem to match up with the daf titles OR the original political titles.
I just need the list of these titles.
need this for my book, that I'm working on.
thank you ! jeff h.

Jeff

You are stating that Ley in addition to the new uniforms, insignia and some titles he introduced in 1939, that he also created an independent scale for those having duty in the DAF? That would have included him as Fuhrer of the Deutsche Arbeitsfront. I have an early Organisationbuch for the DAF, but it predates 1939 I believe.

Hello Joe. In the book "labor organizations of the reich" , there is 4 pages on this topic. having werkscharen as political leaders in the factories. idea was approved 4 may 1939.
werkschar leaders who were party members will become political leaders. the newly created leaders will have dual NSDAP/DAF membership...
this was for orts gruppen level ONLY.
the basic DAF uniform was still used but, the new political arm bands & collar tabs were to be used.
I talked to Mr. Clark , he gave me some more info. , so I now under stand the idea of this.
in the book it showed only 8 armbands used (of the normal political ones used). and only showed 4 low level collar tabs.
my assumption is that not all of the tabs would ever be worn.
so , 1) trying to see if anyone had more info = in general on this topic.
2) wanted to try to figure out which tabs MAY HAVE went with each of the armbands.

I now understand the arm bands are "positions" & the collar tabs are pay grades. BUT, if 4 armbands were Not intended to be used , then that implies specific tabs would Not be used too. But , no clue which.
Sound like other rivals at the time, helped to not allow it to grow into what it was intended plus lack of insignia , war going on , ect.
I'm working on a third reich rank insignia book. just 1 of many organizations that is difficult to find info. on.
jeff

Jeff, I was confused by your initial post and I think you might have been a bit by the Bender book as it seemed to indicate that new armbands were created for the DAF. But that paragraph only intended to state that Ley introduced the new PL insignia earlier in April. The DAF armbands are identified in the 1941 5th printing of the NSDAP Organisationsbuch with titles on the Orts level armbands below the PL titles. An additional source material I have is a chart of new PL collar insignia that I printed from a NARA microfilm roll I have. In addition to the standard PL districts from Block up to Reich in five columns that match to a final column of 29 different collar tabs, there are two separate columns under Betrieb listing various positions and 13 corresponding rank tabs from Einsatzleiter to PL Anwarter non-party member.

Joe. thanks for your coments. I will have to read your post again later , been very busy lately.
I did not intend to say the arm bands were for the DAF. you are correct that they were for the party. but the idea was to create daf leaders into political watch dogs in the plants.
which was orts level titles / positions. each plant ,depending on size , ect. would have "X" amount of men in these positions.
since this WAS suppose to be implemented, I was trying to find info. (assumed it existed) on which possible tabs (pay grades) may have went with which armbands (position / titles).
not all of the armbands of the orts level system were to be used , hence , not all the tabs would be used.
again , I'll read all of the posts again (very tired now).
jeff

Hey Jeff have you tried looking in the reference book "Uniforms and insignia of the NSDAP, by Rudolf Kahl? There is a break down of tabs and armbands that might answer some questions. the photos are in black and white, but I believe the book is out of print. I have 2 out of the 3 that is a set. If needed i can scan those pages for you and email them. let me know. Larry

Larry. yes ,If you can p.m. me , I'll give you my e-mail address. do not recall the title of those books. and definitely do not have the info. you mentioned.
the info. will help me on 2 fronts. jeff.

I don't believe there are any "black and white photos" in Kahl's books. It is a very early reference work and everything is hand drawn illustrations in black and white. Only of the most rudimentary value as a reference.

Hi Joe your right!! bad choice of words on my part,, it is hand drawn black and white work, but its near perfect for illustration purposes,, thanks for the correction.
Jeff email sent! Larry