|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
Gentlemen could this be a period piece ? I have bought this under the impression that this is a post war piece so I wont cry myself to sleep if it�s not period :-) It�s made of bronze and weighs 1,2 kilo and is 28cm high. The photos dont do this piece justice at all, it�s an awsome display piece. Do anyone of you guys have any ideas about this piece ?? Any comments is much appriciated ! Stay safe, Hakan
1.jpg (30.9 KB, 419 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
pic2
2.jpg (43.98 KB, 417 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
pic3
3.jpg (48.76 KB, 409 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
pic4
4.jpg (35.74 KB, 402 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
pic5
5.jpg (48.04 KB, 409 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 563
|
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 563 |
looks pre-'45. nice item. you don't see many "standers."
inimicus
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 563
|
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 563 |
inimicus
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
Thanks for the reply David, no I cant see any markings. I actually think this is a period piece but cant be sure, but if it�s a repro of any kind they have made a damn good job making it look old. Hakan
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
Have tried to take a few more pics with better light. Does anyone else have any thought of this statue ? Anything whould be appriciated. Thanks, Hakan
19.jpg (76.4 KB, 358 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
pic6
20.jpg (67.28 KB, 352 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
pic7
21.jpg (61.38 KB, 345 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
pic8
22.jpg (62.76 KB, 347 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
pic9
23.jpg (65.76 KB, 338 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81 |
Hello Hakan. It's 100% original. It's made in what we french call "un petit bronze" which means that it is hollow on the inside. You can find it sometimes in Italian beautiful black marble base. This little statue was also given to Party Members as an award and in this case a small solid silver or even a "vermeil" plac is attached to the base. It is very fragile, be careful. I have seem only a couple more in almost 20 years collecting. it is very rare and VERY expensive!! Congratulation. Dennys.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
Hello Dennys ! Thank you for your answer, so it�s original then ! Thats great news ! You are correct about the statue being hollow on the inside, you can hear it�s hollow if you knock on the body with your knuckles. Denny, how much in your opinion whould a piece like this be worth ? Once again thanks for your reply ! Best, Hakan
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81 |
Hello Hakan. Yes, it's original for sure. The value for this item in this condition would be arond 4K to 5K, may be more, I am not so sure. The ONLY one I saw for sale in a dealer a long time ago (Hermann Historica in 2001) the starting price was 3K. The same statue as an award with the plac and black marble base will cost a LOT MORE. I have only seen once in a collection. Regards, Dennys
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,774
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,774 |
- and I sold the statue to H�kan for $300 Good thing he's happy !!! Jesper
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 609
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 609 |
Hello, I was wondering how one would go about trying to determine if a bronze statue was an original pre 1945 casting or later post war reproduction. Is there some way to tell, something for us to look for? Thanks for any advice on this.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,774
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,774 |
This bronze plague comes from the same household.
Value ?
Thanks !
Jesper
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,774
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,774 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81 |
quote: Originally posted by Jerry: Hello, I was wondering how one would go about trying to determine if a bronze statue was an original pre 1945 casting or later post war reproduction. Is there some way to tell, something for us to look for? Thanks for any advice on this.
Hello Jerry. I do understand your concearn. To this day I never found one that is, without a doubt, a reproduction, which make me to believe that this particular item has not been copy yet. This statue is not like the famous N�rnberg NSDAP desk eagle for example, which you can find originals and repros everywhere. My comments are based on what I have seen, "hands on" or by pictures, with special attention to everything, from the curves of the uniform, the details of the decorations to the resulting condition to the painting. However, experience is always a good tool. Thank you. P.S. I will post bellow, with the OK from the owner, a picture of the best Third Reich, Adolf Hitler "petit bronze" I found.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
Thanks for that pic. Dennys and for all your help !!!!
16.jpg (43.93 KB, 192 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
another
17.jpg (50.99 KB, 191 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418
|
OP
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,418 |
last pic
18.jpg (46.09 KB, 188 downloads)
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 444
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 444 |
I took some pictures of my AH statue and the detail of the first one posted is verly low compared to mine and the one posted by Dennys Jorett (looks identical to mine).
I believe Hakan81's statue is a cast copy of an original.
Best regards,
Kris Simoens.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 444
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 444 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 261
|
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 261 |
Very good thread and discussion!
It's clear from the photos that the statute shown by Hakan81 does not have any of the casting details of the statues shown by Dennys Jorret and kris simoens.
Furthermore, the plain base is nothing like the other ornate bases.
In my opinion, it's a copy and not worth "4K to 5K, may be more". It's probably worth something in the hundreds. So the $300 sale price seems ok.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,774
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,774 |
I'm glad you wrote that, Carinhall, cause then I don't have to cry over the loss Jesper
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81 |
quote: Originally posted by kris simoens: back of statue
Hello kris. I cannot make any comment because I cannot see your pictures. Can you post those again please. Thanks.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81 |
quote: Originally posted by Carinhall: Very good thread and discussion!
It's clear from the photos that the statute shown by Hakan81 does not have any of the casting details of the statues shown by Dennys Jorret and kris simoens.
Furthermore, the plain base is nothing like the other ornate bases.
In my opinion, it's a copy and not worth "4K to 5K, may be more". It's probably worth something in the hundreds. So the $300 sale price seems ok.
Hello Carinhall, I cannot comment that because I cannot see the pictures from Kris. However the statue offered by Hermann Historica never had a "ornated" base and I am sure it was authentic, so as the auction house. If this is a repro they have just started producing those. I'll tell you that it was a good start. The price for it is RIGHT. To give you an idea, I offered 9k for this one I posted and the ownwer didn't let it go. I wouldn't let it go either. Thanks.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,286
|
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,286 |
Dennys, in North America, even for original items such as the AH bronze, no one, and i mean no one, pays the kind of prices you quoted.
You can find this item, and better, for much less money due to the number of high quality artifacts brought home by American servicemen.
I have a bust that is one meter high and weighs 25 pounds, that came out of a municipal building in Berlin, and cost me last year, all of $400.00
Even for original items of the one's shown, no one will ever pay $9000.00 for it, there is just too much to be had..
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81 |
quote: Originally posted by Doug Kenwright aka "KURSK": Dennys, in North America, even for original items such as the AH bronze, no one, and i mean no one, pays the kind of prices you quoted.
You can find this item, and better, for much less money due to the number of high quality artifacts brought home by American servicemen.
I have a bust that is one meter high and weighs 25 pounds, that came out of a municipal building in Berlin, and cost me last year, all of $400.00
Even for original items of the one's shown, no one will ever pay $9000.00 for it, there is just too much to be had..
Hello Doug. I am sorry to not agree with you. I am fully aware about how prices works in America and how that is hurting collections and collectors! In America my 100% original 1933/1936 transitional SS dagger worth 2k but in no time the price rises to 8K and I had offers for 11K. Something, somewhere is very wrong. Hermann Historica set this price in 2001! I believe I am not the one to blame, but anyway everybody, but me, likes a bargain despite ethics and honesty. I know how that works specially at GDC. But I must say you are a lucky person! You bought this Hitler head for $400.00! I offer you right now $1.000.00 if original as you say. Thank you!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 444
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 444 |
It seems the pictures in my previous post weren't showing.
Here's a second try.
Kris
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 444
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 444 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 6,304
|
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 6,304 |
Woaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, what a fantastic bronze figurine. Great details and crafmanship, a real piece of art. Yours and the one sold by Jesper are indeed, very different and have nothing in common.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81 |
Hello Kris. Your statue is very good and of course one of a superior quality. But the best is, by far, the one I posted. Thanks for the pictures. Dennys.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 81 |
quote: Originally posted by Pat: Woaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, what a fantastic bronze figurine. Great details and crafmanship, a real piece of art. Yours and the one sold by Jesper are indeed, very different and have nothing in common.
NOTHING IN COMMON? Both statues are identical and original. Some have better quality wich does not mean the other is a repro. May I remember that even decorations had their pattern of quality extremly deteriorated as the war progressed. You'll have to excuse me but everytime I read something from you I desagree, that when you are not saying "gee...that's a nice item" with nothing tecnical to add to any discussion. At least to this thread you said Woaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Something rather new I guess. Are you an expert on everything or may be an expert in nothing? But congratulation you earned another post! Thank you.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,774
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,774 |
EXCUSE ME Dennys - but there are ABSOLUTELY NO REASONS to be RUDE towards Pat !!! NO ONE here are experts - and NO ONE has the right to call themselves that and behave ARROGANT towards fellow collectors PLEASE keep a good tone on this wonderful site Jesper
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,147 Likes: 286
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,147 Likes: 286 |
there is definitely a big difference between the first one posted and the next 2, [you can't even make out the swastika on the armband!],,and you don't have to be a expert to see that.!.
Guys like Pat and others collect quality,,anything of superior quality whether it be a blade or a jacket,, after a while you develop an eye for it.. So while no true experts here as none of us were there or have seen how period pieces were manufactured we give our opinions. Knowing that pieces like these were not made thru out the war,,and in fact most were not being made once the war started they would/should have the good detail and quality that the first one clearly lacks,,,hence the comments the guys don't like it or think it reproduction...
oh yeah,,everything and anything made during the 3rd reich has been reproduced from life size Hitler head bronzes to condoms...
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 39
|
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 39 |
quote: Originally posted by Dennys Jorret: quote: Originally posted by Pat: Woaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, what a fantastic bronze figurine. Great details and crafmanship, a real piece of art. Yours and the one sold by Jesper are indeed, very different and have nothing in common.
NOTHING IN COMMON? Both statues are identical and original. Some have better quality wich does not mean the other is a repro. May I remember that even decorations had their pattern of quality extremly deteriorated as the war progressed. You'll have to excuse me but everytime I read something from you I desagree, that when you are not saying "gee...that's a nice item" with nothing tecnical to add to any discussion. At least to this thread you said Woaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Something rather new I guess. Are you an expert on everything or may be an expert in nothing? But congratulation you earned another post! Thank you.
The first piece photo'd appears to be a cheap trinket, maybe period but 300.00 seems like a fair price. The second does look the best but the photo is very dark and can't see the color of the bronze well at all. The third is not bronze from appearance and has the look of many reproductions that have come to market, so if the second one is identical to the third than there is a chance that the first piece is original and just cheap manufacture and the other two possible reproductions or just low grade 3rd Reich items. An offer of 9k for the one photoed is insane really as it is way too high and these are probably 3-5K for a nice original example. So why don't you re-shoot your best piece, and the Nuremburg eagle next to it as that looks funky and maybe we can get to the bottom of these pieces. And I am sure you have the recorded auctions from Hermann's on hand with final sale and description right?. These are 3rd rate pieces, the one that has promise appears to be the dark one, but hit that with a flash and lets see how nice it is then. Want to be obnoxious?, no problem. Photo your piece and show your auction results as I do not believe these are worth anything near your #'s and two are probably fake. Not everyone know's everything, if a guy comments on how nice a piece is so what?. Now put your cards on the table and lets play for real.
|
|
|
Forums42
Topics31,667
Posts329,079
Members7,523
|
Most Online5,900 Dec 19th, 2019
|
|
2 members (Vern, Luftbud),
280
guests, and
42
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|