UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories SS & SA Uniform Forum Lets see some black!

Mr Lee,
You have my apology if I caused offense.
Seiler

Ryan-
Cheap shots from those who never offer anything from their collection(most don't have one), have little to no reference library and little to no respect for their peers have successfully begun the road of destruction for most of the Forums. Moderators and webmasters who allow such behavior to continue without a cost are also to blame. The majority of the older, wiser collectors see no need to subject themselves to such company. Neither do I. Sad what once was so promising has become a conduit for the rude, the ignorant and the uninformed.
Bob Coleman

Hi Bob you are of course correct in your assessment. You and I have had our differences in the past and we have also concluded mutually rewarding transactions. I have always repected your knowledge and experience. It far out weighs my own in certain areas. I have also admired your loyalty to friends.I would still like to think that I would be able to pause and say hi at your table anytime without need for embarrassment. Seiler has offerred apology and that is all anyone can ask.As long as we are men enough to admit our mistakes than this forum has a future. Disension can exist and opposing debate is healthy, but a lack of civility is plain ignorance and it benefits no one. I still lament the departure of Donald Abenheim and others of his stature. cheers, Ryan

Is there anyone left to comment on my question - of the rarity of the early 30s black SS coffee can kepi vs, the '35 & up new style visor? The SS kepis are priced the same - but surely they must be rarer?

Please note , I am not expert, just stating my opinion. I believe the early 1930's /late 1920's coffee can hats are rarer than the visor caps. Reason for the price is the same. no idea.I believe most collectors like the look of the visor than coffee can look. But who knows. Just collect what your interest are and what you like . You will enjoy in the long run.


Joe Semen

Thanks - that's just what I was thinking - the later "saddle form" visor is more common but in greater demand. It's what you see in the movies - & on "Hogan's Heroes". I've been watching the series on DVD & the uniforms seem right on target - surprisingly I guess.

Brian,
I would agree with the observation that both you and Joe have made. That is, that a black EM visor is MUCH more common than an SS coffee can kepi.
As for price, my belief is that the black EM visors are uniform enough that most collectors can tell originals from fakes (although the fakes are getting better all the time). Since this is the ONE piece of ss headgear that most collectors feel comfortable buying as an 'original' item that they can trust, they are willing to put up to $5,000+ into one.
Although an original black kepi is much more rare, most collectors have trouble trusting them and thus are not willing to put big bucks into one.
Just my opinion.
Doug

MOST SS COFFEE CAN HATS YOU SEE ARE FAKE,I GOT ONE FROM ONE OF THE BIG LONG TIME DEALERS IN GERMANY AND IT LOOKED SO GOOD TILL I HAD A HAT EXPERT DO A HANDS ON AND GAVE ME A ONE PAGE DETAIL REPORT OF HOW FAKE IT WAS.I WAS SO LUCKLY TO GET MY MONEY BACK.FOR MY COLLECTION"NO COFFEE CAN SS HAT,S"

FAKE AS CAN BE!!!!!!!

Im glad to see that this thread is 'back on track'
at least as far as I can gleen..and that those who
feel that may have posted something others took offense
to have apologized for any apparent postings or misunderstandings
that may have taken place..that is always encouraging
to see and is ultimately how people and collectors
specificially on the the forum should treat each other.
I think this particular thread is very informative and
wonderful to view..especially for individuals such as myself
who do not collect Allgemeine items. I dont..nor do I collect
in a whole host of areas..daggers, medals, political. para
military, so its a great thread to learn and admire those
who are so dedicated to collecting these rare and ellusive
areas of our hobby. I must say that I dont share John'
asessment of those who post simply to show and then turn
around and sell their items. Some people collect and hold on
to their items for decades..some people for years..some for
months..or weeks..its simply their perogative..they can do
with their items what they please..and its really none of our
business how and when they dispose of their items, once
they have paid for the items..the could if they chose simply put
it all in a pile..douse with gasoline and set the whole heap
on fire.,.bottom line..its THEIR stuff..so if they want to sell
the items quickly after purchase..so what? There is the argument
that this does nothing but drive up prices..however..when have
prices in every area NOT been driven up over time? If someone
has a problem with the prices..that is not something any of
us can do anythingabout..all but stop buying theitems..which
is always our own perogative.simply put..if the price is too
high..which for many items for myself personallly are becoming
unaffordable..then we simply have to purchase that which is
affordable..or save more over time and purchase less. Prices
in most any serious areas of collecting continue to appreicate
with the internet.. and I well imagine people in other collector
areas are having the same discussion. My point.rather longwinded
is that its really not fair to chastise something that they have
purchased and sell after short period of time..its their property.
Others have also been quick to fault those who collect for 'investment"..
I collect for the love of the history and the appreciation of the items
but I would be remiss and downright stupid if I didnt consider
the investment potential of items...why would I or anyone want to
consider spending 10K or 5K or whatever of an item if they didnt
think that one day they might want to sell the item to AT least
get their money out and a fair return on the dollar at a furture time?
People go through many stages in their lives..wether it be children
college.homes..marriages.and unless one simply is printing money
has a money tree in the backyard..or several million dollars, then
one MUST in my opinion consider purchases of the value we deal in
today as an investment...it dosnt mean the person is any less of
a collector or any less dedicated..so I dont agree with those
who belittle or chastise collectors for looking out for their
money spent. As to the "collector of old"..one must also understand that many many collectors bought substandital quantities of NOW very very valuable items decades ago..30, 40, 50 years ago when these items were worth next to nothing..they could do so becasue of the relative inexpensive nature of the items..and hold on to them because they didnt have a 'siginificant investment' tied up in the items. I also know several of the "older collectors" who are also selling much of their "old" collection, and trust me..they arnt asking 70 80's or 90's prices, they are not stupid, and are getting as much as they can out of their collection. To do otherwise would not be prudent.
Lastly...others have opined that its the "moderators and site
administrators" who allow bad behavior to continue and the forum to
go into a downward spiral. I cannot sit on the fourm 24/7 and act as
a hall monitor to watch every single post and wait with baited
breath for every possible offensive post..I saw the nasty turnof this
thread yesterdya when I logged on..after having spent four days
going back and forth to the hospital for test after test..
getting little sleep and so on and so forth...its also incumbent
upon those who post on the forum to act responsibly and with enough
civility towards on another..no amount of monitoring and watching
is going to change the basic nature of some individuals for a
variety of reasons to act childishly..that is beyond my control, as is
logging on every hour every day to monitor what is trasnpiring..So
enough said for now..and I hope those that enjoy this thread
and forum will continue to post and share their knowledge and fantatic
collections no matterhow big or small so that we all my learn and enjoy
this hobby...its all what we make out of it.

Well I thought its time to add some pics from Max show I took.

I sure hope the stupid stuff from some will cease and allow more postings for others!!!

TW had this at MAX

PVON

2

3

4

I saw a few SS black officers for sale at MAX!

$11.000.00 and a Generals for $22K I believe.

Same guy had a Waffen SS for $5,000.00 I believe and some other stuff!

Hope Jim Arrasmith will chime in as he took a good look at them .

Peter Jenkins had a SS coffee can also that was real!

I did talk in depth with Peter on our smoke breaks.

Always enjoy talking to him and him sharing
some stories on many superb items and where they are.

We both missed Bob Coleman at the Max!

A black single decal came in the show and Norman
got it.!

Here is Bill Rannows blackie!

BR

Price tag on visor NCO

x

This had a super saddle shape owner thinks is a upgrade from NCO.

Hope Jim A will explain what he thought after seeing!

Maybe some others took some pics at Max, or will add some stuff to this thread also that they bought!

Hint!!!!!! Hint! I know who you are and what you bought!

Also a uniform was sold at Max from Chris at Oak Leaf!

that is one nice cap you have there my dream kindregards .

I AM GOING TO START LOOKING AT FM/SS ITEMS NOW THAT I HAVE THIS.

BF.LOTS OF VERY NICE STUFF

HAY!!!PVON DO YOU HAVE ANY NEW BLACK STUFF?

FROM DACHAU,SS BARRACKS DOOR."OUR REICHSFUHRER GUARD FORCE-DACHAU"

Hi Jim

See ya at SOS

PVON

wow jim that would look nice on my door

ONE OF THE HIDDEN JEWELS FROM THE LAST MAX.ITS THE SAME ONE THAT IS ON TOM WHITTMANNS SS BOOK PAGE 392.I GOT IT FROM ARTHUR HAYS,WHO GOT IT FROM HOWARD CROUSE A FEW YEARS AGO.MR.CROUSE HAD IT WHEN IT WAS PUT IN THE SS BOOK.HE GOT IT FROM A VET WITH OTHER SS ITEMS YEARS AGO.THE VET WAS WITH THE FIRST AMERICANS IN TO DACHAU.TOM WHITTMANN SAID HE GUESSED IT WAS FROM A PLAQUE BEARING A DEDICATION.I MET HOWARD CROUSE AS I WAS BUYING THIS,HE CAME BUY TO SEE ART HAYS AT HIS TABLE,AND HE TOLD ME WERE HE GOT IT AT.

looks like its quit heavey do you think you will ever part with it

SOME DAY I WILL,I TESTED MY KID OUT ABOUT YEARS FROM NOW.I WANT YOU TO HAVE A FEW OF MY DAGGERS WHEN I DIE.THE FIRST THING OUT OF HIS MOUTH WAS WE CAN SELL THEM ON E-BAY.I THOUGH "WHY DID I ASK"THEY WILL ALL BE SOLD FOR ME TO HAVE A GOOD TIME LATER ON DOWN THE ROAD.

back up dont wont to lose this

Jim Arrasmith,

I bought Howard Crouse's SS S/D M40 helmet from Dachau that came from the veteran along with your plaque.

I love it.

John

JOHN,HOWARD SAID HE ALSO GOT AN SS HELMET FROM VET,HE THOUGHT IT WAS AT HOME.MAYBE HE HAD TWO OR FORGOT HE SOLD IT TO YOU.THAT WAS THE FIRST TIME I MET HIM.

This fine thread is still around!

Somebody must have missed it!

PVON

Here is my only black tunic,#58 Koln district. Hope to add some day an enlisted,NCO black tunic some day......if I find it!!!

SIDE

The helmet is an SS-RZM,the chinstrap is "home made" using an original carabine clip and vintage leather.....it's a filler until I find an original. The D.E. flag/pole are reproductions....but I like it a lot and it didn't cost me my house and car to have.

I like this angle very much

The officer collar tabs wich are not a matching set, but make a good representation. They where sold as individual pieces but I could not resist to put them as a pair.

I must thank Robert Hassler for the oportunity to add this pieces to the collection.

back of tabs, in the first picture the flash "blow" a little the detail, in person looks very,very good.

And my last black piece of militaria, an NCO visor cap and Deutschland officer cuftittle with paper RZM tag, the eagle is the common tropical version also with paper RZM tag.

I should have take it out of the display cabinet but that is a little proyect in itself!!!

Great looking pics!

So many goodies!

PVON

A perfect nice black tunic display with taste!