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#200055 05/21/2006 04:03 PM
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I took some new pics, and after reading some of yesterdays posts, I decided to hope we get back to collecting!

So lets see some goodies!


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visor-june-001.jpg (67.05 KB, 4264 downloads)
#200056 05/21/2006 04:05 PM
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Sorry thats pic of tab I listed!

I meant to show visor!

Wouldn't let me remove!


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visor-june-017.jpg (72.99 KB, 4137 downloads)
#200057 05/21/2006 04:06 PM
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visor-june-018.jpg (73.08 KB, 3711 downloads)
#200058 05/21/2006 04:07 PM
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visor-june-022.jpg (53.9 KB, 3530 downloads)
#200059 05/21/2006 04:08 PM
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Tag

Laundry?

visor-june-023.jpg (51.02 KB, 3542 downloads)
#200060 05/21/2006 04:10 PM
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visor-june-059.jpg (64.08 KB, 3542 downloads)
#200061 05/21/2006 04:16 PM
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Another visor!

PVON

visor-june-044.jpg (72.82 KB, 3341 downloads)
#200062 05/21/2006 04:27 PM
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Good idea Paul. Beautiful visors. My small group of black uniforms, which are visorless....The one in the foreground, is a 1933 with black & white collar twist, needs an early jawless EM. From Bodensee. (maybe 1935, I can't quite make out the VA stamp). The back one on the full mannequin, (Obersturmfhrer), from Hamburg, is 1938 VA stamped.

allgbuddies.jpg (64.99 KB, 3236 downloads)



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#200063 05/21/2006 06:28 PM
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BTW, Paul your photo portrait there looks like the same vintage with black & white collar twist, as my early tunic, in my photo. I see he also has earlier style tabs. No doubt, a color bordered cuff title as well.




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#200064 05/21/2006 06:46 PM
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You need this black woolen, obviously. Viel Sammlerglueck. This came from Europe via southern California and was at hand. I did not buy it, either, for which I am sorry.

Kevin_cap_black_Bayern.jpg (32.78 KB, 3087 downloads)
#200065 05/21/2006 06:51 PM
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!That was both kind, and mean...! Wink Big Grin




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#200066 05/21/2006 06:51 PM
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Noch ein Bild, obwohl die anderen scheinbar keine grosse Lust hervorgerufen haben....

#200067 05/21/2006 06:55 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Johann:
!That was both kind, and mean...! Wink Big Grin


My dear, I did not mean to cause pain. I am angry I did not buy it myself, and I had the chance. It is still on the Grenadier website, in fact, but as sold...

#200068 05/21/2006 06:57 PM
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The earlier wool was a different grade or courseness, which Donald could probably explain. I see the same texure of wool in this visor as is my tunic. I've also seen it on the early black kepis. Do you know what I mean Donald?




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#200069 05/21/2006 07:03 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Johann:
The earlier wool was a different grade or courseness, which Donald could probably explain. I see the same texure of wool in this visor as is my tunic. I've also seen it on the early black kepis. Do you know what I mean Donald?


Yes, I do. However, it is hard to depict here. The wool in the early caps was of an excellent quality, whereas the later caps were of a lesser quality Trikot. I never actually handled the cap pictured here, but friends did and they tried to sell it to me while I was overwhelmed with the base closing process as well as a sudden upsurge of even more rare caps.

#200070 05/21/2006 07:07 PM
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Some of those differences between early and later made pieces are hard to convey without seeing and feeling the two, side by side. Like early and later button finishes, (gekrnt). I wish that more collectors lived near me, so that I could see more examples close up...Luckily one of my tunics is early, and one later. (start of the war)...




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#200071 05/21/2006 07:11 PM
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Were I a better photographer, it would be easier. The early caps 'til about 1936 or were of generally much better quality than the contract caps made thereafter and which are most often encountered. The cap of Vondrack is an example of the later contract cap, made by the tens or more of thousands and at a time when the incipient war effort made things less luxurious, as well as the finances of the Allgemeine SS were on the ropes because of the general build up of paramilitary formations, &c. The latter fact is essentially unknown. The finish of buttons is well illustrated in the Assmann catalog, in fact. See pp.53-54 of the Reddick reprint. These contrast with the finish of the Wehrmacht and really most other styles of buttons in use in the III. Reich. The matter of the woolens, however, can only be determined by having the thing in front of you and a comparison with many pieces, in fact.

#200072 05/21/2006 07:16 PM
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I would like to see that sometime. If any member has that scan, I would very much appreciate an e-mail. Or a posting...




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#200073 05/21/2006 07:46 PM
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Other items of black woolens already posted, but which garnered no comments whatsoever.

#200074 05/21/2006 07:52 PM
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The most recent that I can remember, which were discussed in very much detail, were Hooper's "Happy Easter" and Hans' green bordered 6 sturm. I know of a recent purchase of a black cavalry tunic, but it's up to it's owner to share it. Wink




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#200075 05/21/2006 08:57 PM
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I examined the early black visor cap at Bruce Herman's table at the last SOS. It was (is) a magnificent piece and I was tempted to buy it. I wish I had. At this time I am seriously considering the acquisition of a black outfit to stand guard in my office/den. Let's see some more of what you fellows have.

Cheers,


Darryl
#200076 05/21/2006 09:27 PM
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I am glad the cap with the early badges via Herman got the approval of brother Darryl, a man of great taste and refinement in black woolens and black helmets. Actually, I had posted some images of authentic black officer caps elsewhere, but these were greeted with a yawn. My computer is bollixed up at the moment and I am having issues with attachments, which are always too big anyway. Sapere aude. Postscriptum: oh, the computer digested this image of a cap I examined from Maederer. Unlike the the one on the Herman site, this cap had all the runes, tags, &c. It is of the era 1934 or so. Also here visible is the quality of wool of which my colleague in so. California has written above.

DSCN1087.jpg (36.41 KB, 2817 downloads)
#200077 05/21/2006 09:31 PM
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Here is its inside.

cap_interior.jpg (30.45 KB, 2738 downloads)
#200078 05/21/2006 09:32 PM
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It had this kind of tag, i.e. the earliest one in use in RZM regulated items after about 1933/4. The tag illustrated here, however, is from an officer's cap of similar vintage. The Hamburg maker is an absolute rarity for black SS headwear, but the cap in question, which I recently saw, was stunning and quite authentic.

HG_36a[1].JPG (21.47 KB, 2636 downloads)
#200079 05/21/2006 09:39 PM
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Another early cap, a Pekuero, which has seen the passage of time and which passed through my hands in the intermediate past. It has a kind of poetry to it. Plainly, its owner modernized its badges as the regulations changed from 1934 until 1936.

DSCN1094.jpg (36.12 KB, 2608 downloads)
#200080 05/21/2006 09:45 PM
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Yet another early cap, a Clemens Wagner, of exceptional quality, the property of one of the many medical doctors or professors in the SS. Look at the rank lists. This one has a leather peak. The badges were updated on this cap, too. One can plainly see where the other badges had been and these cap badges at hand are the 1st generation of their kind. The later Clemens Wagner caps are much inferior to this rare piece. This piece was defecated on by some on the other website who decried it for not being "...textbook." That is, it had none of the runes, tags, stamps &c. Wie dumm! sapere aude.

SSvisor.jpg (41.36 KB, 2553 downloads)
#200081 05/21/2006 10:00 PM
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Finally, to overcome the ennui of a rainy Sunday in May, one of the caps from the Wilkins book, that I was also able to examine. Eine absolute Raritaet ersten Ranges, an early Mueller for an officer circa 1935. The saddle shape in its most refined expression. Its cousin is still for sale on the Maederer site, but of much later make, but wholly echt....zugreifen! Servus.

HG-76b.jpg (12.19 KB, 2492 downloads)
#200082 05/21/2006 10:02 PM
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Johann,
A lovely collection you have there thank you for letting us peak into your bunker.
And many authentic and rare caps from Donald's images and the nice shaped one from Paul,,all pleasent to see on a late Sunday evening,,,, Smile

#200083 05/21/2006 10:24 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Donald Abenheim:
Noch ein Bild, obwohl die anderen scheinbar keine grosse Lust hervorgerufen haben....


This did not work, obviously....

#200084 05/21/2006 10:29 PM
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Yes, thanks Donald for taking the time to post these visors. I like the early ones with the pinched crest, but I LOVE the saddle-like shape of that last officer cap. High crown, and drooped sides. Perfect shape...Each has it's own character, same as the tunics.

What makes the one visor from an SS medical personell?




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#200085 05/21/2006 10:43 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Johann:
Yes, thanks Donald for taking the time to post these visors. I like the early ones with the pinched crest, but I LOVE the saddle-like shape of that last officer cap. High crown, and drooped sides. Perfect shape...Each has it's own character, same as the tunics.

What makes the one visor from an SS medical personell?



The 1st cap I posted and 2nd to the last are named to Professor Dr.'s inside. Medical doctors were very over represented in the SS as a whole and for members of the social elites in Germany of 1933/34 membership in the SS was much preferred over the plebeian SA, the Crown Prince notwithstanding. As to the shape of the caps, they are what they are, and I like them all, of course. There are lots of officer's caps with the Tellermuetze shape, and the early caps without the rigid structure have a certain pleasing aspect too, so long as they are one thing......authentic. The saddle shape was borrowed from the cavalry of the old armies (i.e. prior to 1918...), and the crown prince's cap of this kind in the period 1914-1918 speaks to this fashion.

#200086 05/21/2006 11:25 PM
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It's always terrific to see to see black cap images being posted. Donald, I have a couple of questions, which hat does the the RZM tag you posted come from? Can you date the tag from the hat?
The material used in the early SS uniforms was one of three grades available: tuch, trikot and gabardine. The gabardine was intended for summer use.
Hats from this early formative period do seem to be mostly made from the very smooth black cloth, (tuch), although I do have a couple of early hats that are made from a fine trikot.
That almost polished quality of the material in many of the early caps is a good indicator of authenticity.
Derek

#200087 05/21/2006 11:42 PM
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Dear Colleague, The Opolka and Mueller officers cap I cannot illustrate, because the photos are too big for the rules here. It is a cap from 1934/5, granted when its owner got commissioned, I guess. The Officer's cap is of this very fine melton wool, similar to the cap I pictured first. It has the inscription "Stirndrueckfrei durch Gummipolster" and looks similar to this cap,illustrated below, with thanks to the owner of same in the great state of Texas--- but the one I have seen is without the RFSS tag. I examined said cap before it found its new owner. It plainly had the original badges ('29 eagle and Hussarentotenkopf originally...) but got upgraded....if colleague Chapman would send a note to my email, I shall enclose images of it for you.

officer's_cap_interior_mit_Gummi.jpg (35.36 KB, 1298 downloads)
#200088 05/22/2006 12:58 AM
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Donald, thanks for sharing this exquesit pictures.

#200089 05/22/2006 01:14 AM
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Dear Robert, thank you. I am a very eager collector of images, especially if I have been able to examine the caps in person as they travel to their various homes. I wish to stress that the image above is courtesy of Texasueberalles, who posted this image a couple of years ago. The Opolka & Mueller cap I saw was nearly its twin. It was not unlike the cap pictured herewith, which I have illustrated in another thread in the last couple of weeks. The cap here is an Isken/Koeln, the property of a member of the Rasse- und Siedlungshauptamt, and a former naval officer from a renowned naval family of the Kaiserreich. Perhaps these images aid this site to achieve some of its old polish.

shea_cap_front.jpg (37.68 KB, 1265 downloads)
#200090 05/22/2006 12:45 PM
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MR.ABENHEIM,WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THE S.S. EM VISOR WITH THE EARLIER TOTENKOPF AND THE NEWER STYLE EAGLE.THAT IS ON BRIAN MAEDERER,S WEB SITE?I HAVE BEEN LOOKING AT IT FOR AWHILE.

#200091 05/22/2006 01:17 PM
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Hi Don:
I know you always enjoy viewing this one:

Front.jpg (46.28 KB, 1195 downloads)
#200092 05/22/2006 01:19 PM
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Another view:

Right_Side.jpg (43.71 KB, 1193 downloads)
#200093 05/22/2006 01:19 PM
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label:

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#200094 05/22/2006 01:36 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by JIM A:
MR.ABENHEIM,WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THE S.S. EM VISOR WITH THE EARLIER TOTENKOPF AND THE NEWER STYLE EAGLE.THAT IS ON BRIAN MAEDERER,S WEB SITE?I HAVE BEEN LOOKING AT IT FOR AWHILE.


Without seeing these things in person, one has trouble making a final asssesment. I have seen the officer cap in black on his site (he asked me to examine it...) and it is a later production Mueller. The newly posted Austrian cap, i.e. from the Salzburger Standarte is also an interesting piece. Enlisted black caps are expensive, but not especially rare when compared to these officer's caps or the early caps generally. Maederer and Shea consistently seem to unearth these pieces. Thus, if one does not suit one's fancy, another is likely to emerge. This syndrome applies less so to officer's black caps, as well as black caps for OR and NCO made before about 1936 or so. These are more rare and lure the collector with greater magnetism than the contract caps of the later period, i.e. after 1936 or so...

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