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#198229 06/18/2007 02:08 AM
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Dave Cameron
Posted 06 November 2003 17:05
As suggested by another member, Im going to start branch specific uniform threads. It seems that great uniforms are scattered across are 6,750 postings on 18 pages and to cover all branches on a single thread could be cumbersome. It is a mutual feeling that this consolidation of branch specific uniforms into one thread will perhaps provide an easier reference for visiting collectors.

I'm sure Pat will recognize this picture of a great tunic he sent my way!

[This message was edited by Dave Cameron on 06 November 2003 at 17:21.]


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6423083557_Zugf1.jpg (44.05 KB, 1138 downloads)
#198230 06/18/2007 02:08 AM
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Ernst H


Posted 06 November 2003 17:37
My Zugwachtmeister tunic from the city of Dortmund. Dated 1940.

Ernst
GDC-Silver#0316



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5753083557_samen2.jpg (46.36 KB, 1122 downloads)
#198231 06/18/2007 02:09 AM
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Ernst H


Posted 06 November 2003 17:38
My Major tunic.

Ernst
GDC-Silver#0316



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6853083557_samenklein2.jpg (48.48 KB, 1085 downloads)
#198232 06/18/2007 02:10 AM
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Gary8
Posted 06 November 2003 22:43
My private purchase winter greatcoat for a major


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#198233 06/18/2007 02:12 AM
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Gary8
Posted 06 November 2003 22:45
back


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#198234 06/18/2007 02:12 AM
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Gary8
Posted 06 November 2003 22:47
collar


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4673044557_Collar.jpg (24.37 KB, 1069 downloads)
#198235 06/18/2007 02:13 AM
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Gary8
Posted 06 November 2003 22:49
board


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#198236 06/18/2007 02:14 AM
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Gary8
Posted 06 November 2003 22:51
tag


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#198237 06/18/2007 02:15 AM
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ORPO

Posted 07 November 2003 11:33
A tailor made SCHUPO Revierleutnant tunic with Hellgrun piping in parade dress.

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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2053035557_ORPO_parade_tunic.jpg (28.59 KB, 1014 downloads)
#198238 06/18/2007 02:15 AM
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ORPO

Posted 07 November 2003 11:40
Bright aluminum shoulder board with brown and green double piping.

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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7753035557_ORPO_Ltn_shoulder_board.jpg (26.6 KB, 1000 downloads)
#198239 06/18/2007 02:16 AM
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ORPO

Posted 07 November 2003 11:46
Bright aluminum machine sewn collar tabs on brown collar with two hook closure.

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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9463035557_ORPO_Ltn_collar_tab.jpg (37.92 KB, 947 downloads)
#198240 06/18/2007 02:17 AM
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ORPO

Posted 07 November 2003 11:51
Bright aluminum sleeve eagle.

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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4963035557_ORPO_officer_eagle.jpg (30.82 KB, 935 downloads)
#198241 06/18/2007 02:17 AM
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ORPO

Posted 07 November 2003 12:03
Back showing Bandeliertasche in black leather and bright aluminum Bandelier. The open claw parade belt is white leather but a bright aluminum belt with round police buckle was normally worn on parade.

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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7673035557_ORPO_parade_back.jpg (25.76 KB, 938 downloads)
#198242 06/18/2007 02:18 AM
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ORPO

Posted 09 November 2003 13:46
Great textbook uniform examples...let's keep puting them up. I believe these threads will make nice reference pages for anyone looking for exemplars. I will post a period color plate by Kntel for each topic that has examples.

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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#198243 06/18/2007 02:19 AM
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Gary8
Posted 12 November 2003 13:17
Orpo that is a very nice set up. Here is my piece of green to please your eyes.


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#198244 06/18/2007 02:19 AM
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Gary8
Posted 12 November 2003 13:21
Tarnished but outstanding collar patches


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5633065657_general_collar.jpg (49.29 KB, 900 downloads)
#198245 06/18/2007 02:20 AM
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Gary8
Posted 12 November 2003 13:26
shouldernoards are also quite nice


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#198246 06/18/2007 02:21 AM
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Gary8
Posted 12 November 2003 13:30
Runes

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#198247 06/18/2007 02:21 AM
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Gary8
Posted 12 November 2003 13:35
Nice looking eagle with both bullion and cellion wire


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#198248 06/18/2007 02:22 AM
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Gary8
Posted 12 November 2003 13:40
Back


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#198249 06/18/2007 02:22 AM
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ORPO

Posted 12 November 2003 14:47
Gary,

I am duly impressed! Is your Generalmajor tunic identified or have provinance? Interesting sleeve eagle. I have seen this mix of bullion and cellion on the wings of the police eagle before. Now that I think about it, I believe I have one on a Gendarmerie tunic.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
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#198250 06/18/2007 02:23 AM
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Gary8
Posted 12 November 2003 17:24
Here is the name tag, do not know if it os correct or not but the tag is made out to a Brunner


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#198251 06/18/2007 02:23 AM
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ORPO

Posted 12 November 2003 23:42
SS-Brigadefhrer u. Generalmajor d. Polizei Karl Brunner. Promoted to Pol Oberst 19 April 1941 and Pol Generalmajor 21 October 1942 I believe. Since your tag is dated 1941 is there any sign he upgraded the tunic when he was promoted to Generalmajor in 1942? He had the IC 1st and 2nd class as well as the KVC 1st with swords and the gold sports badge pinback awards.

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
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#198252 06/18/2007 02:24 AM
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Gary8
Posted 13 November 2003 12:52
Hi Orpo. Looks like the tunic has had a few changes in the past to include the manufaturer.

If you look at the shoulderboard yoy can see a loose thread.

The lining looks as though it has also seen a few changes. Here is a picture of the other markings for a Bremen taylor while the tag is a Berlin taylor


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#198253 06/18/2007 02:25 AM
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Gary8
Posted 13 November 2003 12:53
Hi Orpo Looks like there has been one or two changes to include the manufacturer.

If you look at the shoulderboard you can see a loose thread. Some of the lining looks as though it has been altered professionaly. Here are the additional markings.


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#198254 06/18/2007 02:26 AM
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patrick
Posted 13 November 2003 18:55
Gary if you wanted to get ride of that Genl's tunic I don't need my left arm.

I have a few more SchPo tunic's but have not gotten the film developed yet.

Pat

"I only had two beers officer, I swear."

"In GOD we trust, everyone else keep your hands were we can see them"


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#198255 06/18/2007 02:27 AM
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patrick
Posted 13 November 2003 18:55
top

"I only had two beers officer, I swear."

"In GOD we trust, everyone else keep your hands were we can see them"


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#198256 06/18/2007 02:28 AM
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ORPO

Posted 14 November 2003 11:15
Very nice tunic Pat...get the rest of your film developed, those are nice pix! It looks like he was afraid he would lose that ribbon bar doesn't it?

Gary, let's see if we can do some detective work on your tunic with deductive reasoning. Can you read the month date on the Berlin tag? Brunner served in Berlin at the RSHA Personnel Office from March '41 while he was a Pol Oberst. His other service was in the South, in Munich, the Tyrol, Salzburg, and Italy where he was captured in '45. He was not stationed in the North (Bremen), so one would not expect to see a Bremen tailor marking in his tunic. He did receive the Spang to the IC 2nd and wore it on his SS tunic in the same manner as on your Pol Generalmajor tunic. He had three breast badges, which would equate to the three sets of loops on your tunic, but he did not receive the third one (IC 1st) until 1945, so there should only be two loops until that time. You might check to see if there is any reworking of the badge loops. I hope this helps.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
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#198257 06/18/2007 02:29 AM
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Gary8
Posted 14 November 2003 17:32
Hi George

I wondered about the Bremen markings myself. I have his complete records from 1934 until 1945 and some orders but I still did not find anything that mentions Bremen. I am purplexed to these markings, maybe a favorate holiday destination?? maybe a big chain of taylors with the main office in Bremen?? who knows. I dont, wish I could go back and ask him.

Also noticed that the collar has been comletely reworked, looks like this one has been added probably to accomadate the collar patches. All the buttons on the front have been restitched which cannot be seen from the outside but there are one or two different colour green threads on the inside.

All-in-all even with the Bremen anomoly I still think it is a spectacular original upgraded piece, and I would not part with it for all the tea in China.

I think it is dated November,I will have to get it out and check it.
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#198258 06/18/2007 02:30 AM
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patrick
Posted 14 November 2003 19:20
A few more SchPo tunic's. All of my enlisted tunic's need a cleaning.

Pat

"I only had two beers officer, I swear."

"In GOD we trust, everyone else keep your hands were we can see them"


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#198259 06/18/2007 02:31 AM
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patrick
Posted 14 November 2003 19:20
side

"I only had two beers officer, I swear."

"In GOD we trust, everyone else keep your hands were we can see them"


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#198260 06/18/2007 02:31 AM
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patrick
Posted 14 November 2003 19:21
Another meister rank BLA BLA

"I only had two beers officer, I swear."

"In GOD we trust, everyone else keep your hands were we can see them"


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#198261 06/18/2007 02:32 AM
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patrick
Posted 14 November 2003 19:23
another side1

"I only had two beers officer, I swear."

"In GOD we trust, everyone else keep your hands were we can see them"


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#198262 06/18/2007 02:33 AM
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ORPO

Posted 04 December 2003 21:24
Pat,

Here is a nice enlisted greatcoat to go along with your EM SCHUPO tunics. Unlike Gary's tailor made officer greatcoat, this one is a heavyweight that has a full blanket lining. It has the brown collar with green piping that was worn before the collar cloth was made in the same color as the coat. You will also notice that the coat tails hook up under the pocket flaps and the belted back to get them out of the way. I presume this is so the fellow could ride a bicycle, but I have not seen this on other coats. It appears the hooks and eyes were put in when the coat was manufactured as they are covered with little pieces of matching cloth.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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#198263 06/18/2007 02:33 AM
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Posted 04 December 2003 21:34
Sewn in Schutzpolizei Wachtmeister shoulder boards. The greatcoat has a tag with the owners name and number, but no maker or issue date.

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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#198264 06/18/2007 02:34 AM
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Posted 01 January 2004 10:20
Summer weight wool Schupo Mantel for Oberarzt Medical Doctor. This lightweight greatcoat is made from hard finished summer weight wool and has a brown sateen lining with a sword slot. It is made in the standard cut for Police Officers coats, but it has no piping on the brown collar. When found, it had yellow powder residue in the pockets that turned out to be antiseptic sulfa powder.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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4853000467_Pol_Arzt_greatcoat.jpg (27.74 KB, 444 downloads)
#198265 06/18/2007 02:34 AM
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Posted 01 January 2004 10:36
Sewn-in Shoulderboards for an Oberarzt. The Oberleutnant style shoulder boards have bright aluminum tops and Komblumenblau underlay bottoms. The pip and aesculap are gilt indicating rank and service.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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#198266 06/18/2007 02:35 AM
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Dave Cameron
Posted 01 January 2004 12:12
Hello George!
That is a most interesting Schupo Mantel for Oberarzt you posted! The blue colored underlay shoulder straps have been a subject of interest in several past threads. Glad to finally see some of this subject material as Ive often wondered if any of it was around! Thanks for sharing!
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#198267 06/18/2007 02:35 AM
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Posted 01 January 2004 17:17
Gary, I think the medical branch uniforms of the police are very rarely encountered as there were obviously very few police medical personnel. Most photos I have seen show docs in white lab coats, although stretcher bearers are uniformed wearing the red cross armband. There is one photo of a Polizei Division doc in uniform in Angolia's book on SS insigina I believe, but you cannot tell the color of the boards, tabs, or piping of course. Same thing applies to the Veterinr branch with black Kragenspiegel.

Dave, I think the Mantel is interesting both because it is from the medical branch and because it is a lightweight greatcoat. In my experience, the lightweight greatcoats are few and far between. It seems the medical collar tabs and shoulder boards were perhaps, at different times, both green and blue backed according to published regulations. I think the tunic piping was always green, but I would certainly love to find a blue piped one that is not related to the Kommunalpolizei. It is also interesting that the brown collar of this coat is made without any piping. That certainly elimates the question of piping color. I think the regulations were pretty vague and perhaps not fully understood by the doctors and tailors as well. I will let Joe or Ernst comment on regs.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
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#198268 06/18/2007 02:36 AM
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Dave Cameron
Posted 01 January 2004 22:53
Oh, I didnt notice the brown collar was made without piping until you mentioned it! Wouldnt blue piping be something!

If memory serves me correctly, Joe has been most helpful in the past with regulations/thoughts pertaining to this subject. In fact, I believe he posted a pol. tunic with blue collar tabs before?
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#198269 06/18/2007 02:36 AM
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JWotka
Posted 02 January 2004 02:09
I searched my albums for a shot of a medical officer and found this in an album of the 302 Pol Btl on the way to Austria to form GebJgRgt 18. I hope the shoulder board is visible from the scan.
The doctor is talking with two other officers and the shading indicates to me the two others have green collar tabs while the doctor has blue. This is according to previous threads. The shoulder boards would be Schupo green underlay.

Which leads to a question about your overcoat George. Aren't the boards basically Heer Oberartz? At least according to all the published regulations. But this seems at odds with your obvious officer quality mantel and evidence of medical use. Any evidence of the sleeve medical insignia having been on the coat

"Whoever dies with the most toys wins!" Anonymous


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#198270 06/18/2007 02:37 AM
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ORPO

Posted 02 January 2004 09:55
Joe,

You are correct that these shoulder boards are no different than the Heer medical Arz boards. They do seem to be original to this coat and have wear and tear commensurate with being contemporary to the coat. The greatcoat itself shows no sign of ever having a sleeve eagle or medical patch. The other interesting thing about this coat is the absence of any collar piping. The coat was manufactured in this manner and has not had any piping removed. The Mantel simply is what it is as a material culture artifact.

Here is the picture that I found from Jack Angolia's "Cloth Insignia of the SS (updated)" page 467. (Utilized here for scholarly review/discussion Jack) These boards appear to have dark underlay, but the photo is not as distinct as yours Joe. Can you see if there is any piping on the collar or down the front on your tunic photo Joe?

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson

[This message was edited by ORPO on 02 January 2004 at 10:03.]


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6863041467_W-SS_Pol_doctor.jpg (32.78 KB, 413 downloads)
#198271 06/18/2007 02:38 AM
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JWotka
Posted 02 January 2004 15:44
George, here is a frontal shot of the doctor. He is identified as the Stabsartz of the batallion in the photos. You can see he has a private purchase Feldbluse with brown collar and
cuffs of tunic material. It is difficult to reproduce the contrast of the tabs with the collar, but the two officers he is with definitely have green tabs and his are dark blue. This would make the boards green with the doctor insignia according to regulations.

"Whoever dies with the most toys wins!" Anonymous


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#198272 06/18/2007 02:38 AM
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Posted 02 January 2004 16:42
Joe,

That is the clearest photo of a Pol Arzt I have seen yet. I certainly believe that this fellow has green backed boards and blue collar tabs (they appear to me to have dark stripes in the collar tab Litzen in the Heer style) if that is what you can make out. Those colors are what the regulation plates seem to indicate. The fellow in your photo seems to have no discernible piping (probably had none) just as with the Pol Division Arzt picture from Angolia. Of course the problem with the W-SS Police Division is their constant mix of Heer, W-SS, and Polizei insignia. Another picture from Jack's book, on page 311, shows a group of police officers who are wearing both Heer and Polizei collar Litzen on their collars as they constantly did. One even has a Waffenfarbe V on his Polizei style side cap and the fellow across from him has on a Heer style side cap. The Pol Division doctor could simply be wearing blue backed shoulder boards because they were regulation for both the Heer and Waffen-SS. Heck Joe, now that I think of it this could in fact be a 4th W-SS Polizei Division coat instead of a SCHUPO coat.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
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#198273 06/18/2007 02:39 AM
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JWotka
Posted 03 January 2004 00:32
George, I wouldn't worry about using the photo of the officers with mixed insignia from Jack's book. He "borrowed" it and others without credit from the unit history of the 4th SS Polizei Divison. The officer with the soutache on his police officer overseas cap was Oberst Brenner, commander of the 4th SS-Polizei Artillery unit. All of the staff officers there are Schupo officers and they are no doubt wearing private purchase Feldblusen, not the Heer design tunics as Jack suggests, modified with SS sleeve eagles.

I checked a couple of albums for officer overcoats and those I found had no piping like the NCO variety. George,the Oberartz in my photo is wearing a private purchase Feldbluse so it has no piping either.

"Whoever dies with the most toys wins!" Anonymous
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#198274 06/18/2007 02:39 AM
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ORPO

Posted 03 January 2004 09:30
Here are two varieties of the Police Medical specialty patch as authorized for the lower sleeve. The one on the left is green thread embroidery and the one on the right is green cording. I don't know if this particular specialty patch was embroidered in aluminum wire as well, but I have the aluminum, thread, and cord embroidery on other Pol specialty patches.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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4773082467_Pol_medical_sleeve_disc.jpg (29.91 KB, 408 downloads)
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patrick
Posted 05 January 2004 07:49
I've just returned from Germany and I see that I have missed alot. I must have had a page full of yellow folders.

George, Kick-*** great coat. SPEACHLESS

Here is a bullion medical spec patch that I have.

pat

"I only had two beers officer, I swear."

"In GOD we trust, everyone else keep your hands were we can see them"


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Posted 05 January 2004 12:52
George, I checked a couple of other albums and found some closeups of officer overcoats and piping is evident on those. So, the other shots may have been too far away for the piping to register. Sorry for the confusion.

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ORPO

Posted 06 January 2004 20:17
Thanks Pat. That is the specialty patch I need for my coat. Actually, I think I just need it because I don't have one. I hope you picked up something nice in Germany.

Thanks for looking at your albums Joe. I have seen some police greatcoats without piping, but most seem to have them. Does your Medical tunic have piping or is it a field tunic? I think the discussion we have had about the Medical uniform can be pretty much the same for the Pol Veterinary service, don't you? I have a TENO Polizei greatcoat with black piping, but I know it is TENO Pol and not Veterinary Pol because it is so marked inside.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
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Posted 06 January 2004 22:27
George, the medical tunic is a M36 with green piping like they are supposed to have, with blue tabs and green boards with medical attachment. The Vets are the same, but with black tabs and green boards with respective attachment.

Beautiful Teno overcoat. Check out the earlier threads for a shot of the medical tunic.

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Ernst H


Posted 20 January 2004 09:52
This figure represents a member of the Schupo des Reiches

Ernst
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ORPO

Posted 14 February 2004 12:07
Pre-war Prussian Schupo Umhang. This cape is Prussian blue with green piping around the blue collar. The cape is dated 1925 and is marked to the Elbersfeld (Prussia) Polizei. It has arm slits that button in front and lining in the shoulders only.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson

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ORPO

Posted 14 February 2004 12:12
Umhang worn open showing the blue collar that is a denser weave of wool than the body of the cape. The collar is the same color as the body and is piped in green; the same as the tunic. The partial shoulder lining is also visible. These Prussian blue uniforms continued to be worn by NS Zeit Hilfspolizei during the war, although I have not seen photos of the cape being worn after 1936.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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Posted 24 March 2004 14:15
Here is the latest from our friend Bill Shea. This one is in minty condition just the way I like em.


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Posted 24 March 2004 14:18
Side


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Posted 24 March 2004 14:27
inside


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Posted 25 March 2004 10:29
A very nice saddle form cap Gary. I really like this high saddle shape on officer caps. It looks like it has the one piece silvered officer eagle as well. Nice find!

Here is a soft form NCO for comparison. This one has soft padding in the peak and is dated 1940. Interestingly, the chin strap buttons are pebbled aluminum like officer buttons. This is probably as close to a "crusher" as the wartime police got.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson

[This message was edited by ORPO on 25 March 2004 at 10:39.]


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Posted 25 March 2004 10:33
Front view showing the aluminum enlisted insignia and the padded peak.

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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Posted 25 March 2004 10:38
Interior view showing the sweat shield and markings. Notice that the cap has screened vents on the top. This is often seen on early police caps and sometimes on those later police caps that are tailor made.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson


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Posted 03 May 2004 18:07
A new item I picked up a few weeks ago.

It has a nice maker mark.

pat

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"In GOD we trust, everyone else keep your hands were we can see them"


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Posted 03 May 2004 18:07
2

"I only had two beers officer, I swear."

"In GOD we trust, everyone else keep your hands were we can see them"


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Gary8
Posted 23 July 2004 12:42
Summer tunic recently received from Patrick.

Thanks Patrick


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Posted 23 July 2004 12:45
Collar


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Posted 23 July 2004 12:51
Eagle


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Posted 23 July 2004 12:54
Back


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Posted 04 August 2004 18:17
I guess this now belongs here


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Posted 07 August 2004 15:21
Schutzpolizei side cap


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Posted 07 August 2004 15:22
side

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Posted 07 August 2004 15:24
other side, notice how the piping butt joins. This is what i would expect from all side caps etc, and this is the only way I would buy one


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Posted 07 August 2004 15:27
Inside


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Posted 07 August 2004 15:29
Markings


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Ernst H


Posted 11 August 2004 13:27
Here is my set of summer clothing

a Summer greatcoat and a summer Feldbluse with original applied Bevo sleeve-eagle and litzen.

Ernst
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#198301 06/18/2007 02:58 AM
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Ernst H


Posted 11 August 2004 13:30
Both tunics are made from the same type of cloth. Color is allmost a perfect match....difference probably only due to fading.

Ernst
GDC-Silver#0316


[This message was edited by Ernst H on 11 August 2004 at 13:43.]


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#198302 06/18/2007 02:59 AM
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ORPO

Posted 11 August 2004 23:15
Ernst,

Very nice summer weight tunic and coat. The tailoring is just what I would expect to see on both of them. Visible partial lining stitching on the tunic and stitched false cuffs on the overcoat. I also like this summer twill material as it seems to hold its color much better than the HBT cloth.

George

"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
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Ernst H


Posted 12 August 2004 16:20
George,
indeed the colors are still very good.

here's a picture of the partial lining. Also has removable buttons

Ernst
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#198304 06/18/2007 03:01 AM
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Gary8
Posted 28 September 2004 18:07
Here is my new taylor made tunic


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Posted 28 September 2004 18:07
Collar


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Posted 28 September 2004 18:07
Board


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Posted 28 September 2004 18:08
Eagle


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Posted 28 September 2004 18:09
Tag


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Posted 28 September 2004 18:10
Back


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#198310 06/18/2007 05:40 PM
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My new addition need to be addes to this thread to keep it going My officers M43 in other ranks quality wool. Collar patches have been machine sewn, with no other evidence of other collar pathes being worn. Arm eagle has been hand applied, there is also no other evidence that another eagle had been previously applied. There is a little tracking which can only be seen in the correct lighting, so I believe that the collar patches and arm eagle are original to the tunic.

#198311 06/18/2007 05:41 PM
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Collar

#198312 06/18/2007 05:44 PM
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eagle

#198313 06/18/2007 05:46 PM
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Back

#198314 08/10/2007 03:19 PM
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Online Content
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Bill,

I really like this coat and the collar is very stylish. I have only seen high quality tailor made coats with this amount of detail.


"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
#198315 11/13/2007 06:20 PM
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Here is a very nice jacket and trouser set that I got in today after going missing in the post, it finally arrives.

This jacket is for a named police doctor, there is absolutely no moth or any damage to the jacket or trousers

Dr Gnther BAUER
Born on 29.4.1892
He was Oberfeldarzt der Pol
Member of Allgemeine SS as Obersturmbannfhrer
He was from Magdeburg.
party member # 1 588 917
SS number # 393 365

I hope you like this as much as I do

Police_Doctor_Front.jpg (80.91 KB, 442 downloads)
#198316 11/13/2007 06:21 PM
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Very nice collar insignia machine sewn

Police_Doctor_Collar.jpg (77.35 KB, 439 downloads)
#198317 11/13/2007 06:23 PM
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Board

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#198318 11/13/2007 06:24 PM
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Eagle, sorry about the bad image, it is dark here in the UK so this was done with a flash which did not take very well

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#198319 11/13/2007 06:25 PM
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Taylors Lable

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#198320 11/13/2007 06:26 PM
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Mans Name

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#198321 11/15/2007 07:23 PM
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Another very special jacket in. Customs had this one for 4 months and it finally got here today.

This one is for a Berlin police with a very nice Belin eagle, it also has a few other very nice items.

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#198322 11/15/2007 07:26 PM
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Closeup of the collar

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#198323 11/15/2007 07:29 PM
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Lovely embroidered eagle

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#198324 11/15/2007 07:33 PM
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A magnificent cross of the south traditions badge in silver BeVo weave

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#198325 11/15/2007 07:35 PM
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An exceptional Reiters badge that has powdering

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#198326 06/26/2008 08:02 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by W.Unland:
Gary8 hi my soldatenfreund taschenjahrbuch 1941 shows the generals boards as silver, gold, silver Then 1942 gold silver gold but with ss type patchs is this correct? Posted 12 November 2003 13:26
shouldernoards are also quite nice


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#198327 06/26/2008 09:08 PM
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Lovely tunics!

#198328 06/26/2008 09:19 PM
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I only have 2 Schutzpolizei tunics...a Berlin NCOs and on Officers with SS membership.

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#198329 06/26/2008 09:21 PM
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The Officers.

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#198330 06/27/2008 12:43 AM
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Hello,

Thanks for contributing. Very nice looking displays. I particularly like the officer's.

Regards,
Bill Unland

#198331 06/27/2008 01:08 PM
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The Southern Cross Traditions badge on a previous tunic is very rare...I have only seen photos, and not that many.
This is one I came across in a Chinese edition of 'Grossdeutscher Reichskriegertag Kassel 1939' showing Colonial Bund members wearing it.

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#198332 06/28/2008 01:05 AM
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Tristan, excellent looking uniforms and I would have to agree with Bill, especially the officer's!

The Southern Cross is a tough one to find on a police uniform photo, although more and more are showing up with awareness and interest in the subject area. Below is one of a few examples I have.

SC1.JPG (82.65 KB, 328 downloads)
#198333 06/28/2008 01:49 AM
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Dave,

White caps with green uniforms......What's up with that? Also looks like the guy is carrying a sword to a sports event????

Bill U

#198334 06/28/2008 04:26 AM
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Hi Bill,

Neat looking eh? An interesting picture and it didn't take long for someone to comment on other interesting features! Not sure of the exact regulation or circumstances, although it seems like I recall seeing a few other random photos of white visors with green uniforms.

Offhand I don't remember what or when the event was, although this is part of a large grouping (1,000+ photos) to Major d. Schutzpolizei Wilhelm Kleibaum (He's the one on the left).

#198335 07/09/2008 12:15 PM
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ConfusedTashenjahrbuch 1941 shows generals shoulderboards as silver /gold/silver is thia correct and when did thy change to gold/silver /gold?also did the ranks of Zugwachtmeister and Hauptwachtmeister in the Wasserschutzpolizei have the silver tresse as well as gold on the sleeve?

#198336 07/10/2008 04:06 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by dw:
ConfusedTashenjahrbuch 1941 shows generals shoulderboards as silver /gold/silver is thia correct and when did thy change to gold/silver /gold?also did the ranks of Zugwachtmeister and Hauptwachtmeister in the Wasserschutzpolizei have the silver tresse as well as gold on the sleeve?


Perhaps it is an illustration error, those do happen as seen in other period publications. Otherwise I've not know generals rank straps to be constructed any other way than what's pictured below (gold/silver/gold).

WSP cuff rings were supposed to be gold...as far as I remember offhand. Is this another illustration issue? Below is a link to a restarted WSP uniforms specific thread:

http://daggers.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/1653059744/m/7110042655

005p.JPG (99.97 KB, 288 downloads)
#198337 07/10/2008 07:47 PM
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thanks for the excellent photo of the generals` strap its a real beauty the silver /gold/silver however was used by the diplomatic corps and ministeries i believe

#198338 07/13/2008 04:37 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dw:
the silver /gold/silver however was used by the diplomatic corps and ministeries i believe


That could be, although I'm not familiar with dipo corps and others (I'm just a polizei nutt!). Perhaps a good question to ask in the political uniforms forum.

#198339 07/22/2008 10:25 AM
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O.K.Dave did the gemeindepolizei and gendarmerie generals have green collar patches or weinred and orange accordingly,thanks

#198340 07/22/2008 11:28 AM
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Hello,

All general officers were SchuPo so all wore green backed tabs. There were no SchuPo. D. Gemeinden Polizei Generals, and as I recall only pre-war Gendarmerie generals.

Regards,
Bill Unland

#198341 07/22/2008 06:21 PM
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Thanks for the info. What about the belts of the polizeibeamte were they brown or black as I seem to remember seeing brown being quoted somewhere?

#198342 07/23/2008 01:13 AM
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Brown belts & leather goods were primarily used by the Gendarmerie...take a look at the Gendarmerie Uniforms thread. Schupo utilized black. Hope that helps!

#198343 07/23/2008 10:02 AM
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thanks again Dave:Here`s another, the polizei portepees in the angolia sword book it describes the knot silver with green stripes as Schp.d Reiches & the silver knot as Schp.d Gemeinden,yet others say that the striped one was for the bayonet n.c.o.& the silver for the officers degen.Do you which is correct if any?

#198344 12/23/2008 07:42 AM
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BTT to keep alive

#198345 03/24/2009 02:42 AM
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Schupo Erel Officer's Privat:

scupo.jpg (45.29 KB, 308 downloads)
#198346 04/05/2009 05:11 PM
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Since Dave had shown his Police General's shoulder board , here the sgl.one I got for the rank of 'Generalleutnant'.

MVC-042S.JPG (75.73 KB, 272 downloads)
#198347 04/05/2009 05:12 PM
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..and a close-up.

MVC-044S.JPG (97.65 KB, 270 downloads)
#198348 04/05/2009 05:13 PM
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..and one more .

MVC-045S.JPG (94.19 KB, 269 downloads)
#198349 04/05/2009 05:14 PM
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..and the thick end side .

MVC-048S.JPG (36.97 KB, 276 downloads)
#198350 04/05/2009 05:38 PM
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.and underlayment side .

MVC-046S.JPG (34.51 KB, 274 downloads)
#198351 04/05/2009 05:40 PM
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.. Note the nice reinforcement stitching around the slot for the button shank !

MVC-047S.JPG (38.66 KB, 273 downloads)
#198352 04/18/2009 02:19 AM
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Both of these have been posted before, but never together (thanks, Bill):

IMG_7337.jpg (55.26 KB, 238 downloads)
#198353 06/03/2009 11:42 PM
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Wanted to include my Schutzpolizei M 44 BLUSE / tunic here .

MVC-002S.JPG (73.21 KB, 195 downloads)
#198354 06/03/2009 11:43 PM
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Upper front.

MVC-013S.JPG (70.3 KB, 195 downloads)
#198355 06/03/2009 11:44 PM
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Sideview.

MVC-003S.JPG (60.37 KB, 194 downloads)
#198356 06/03/2009 11:45 PM
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Backside .

MVC-020S.JPG (61.66 KB, 192 downloads)
#198357 06/03/2009 11:46 PM
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Bevo sleeve eagle .

MVC-008S.JPG (87.06 KB, 192 downloads)
#198358 06/03/2009 11:47 PM
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Slip-on shoulder board .

MVC-012S.JPG (44.04 KB, 192 downloads)
#198359 06/03/2009 11:48 PM
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EM collar tab.

MVC-016S.JPG (61.99 KB, 190 downloads)
#198360 06/03/2009 11:50 PM
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Closure neck strap under the left side collar.

MVC-017S.JPG (90.98 KB, 190 downloads)
#198361 06/03/2009 11:51 PM
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.. and an other shot of it .

MVC-018S.JPG (59.88 KB, 187 downloads)
#198362 06/03/2009 11:52 PM
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Reinforcement stitching under the collar .

MVC-019S.JPG (56.28 KB, 186 downloads)
#198363 06/03/2009 11:56 PM
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Close-up of the waistline stitching .

MVC-022S.JPG (43.02 KB, 184 downloads)
#198364 06/03/2009 11:57 PM
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Cuff slot with adjustment with hidden plastic button on inside of cuff.

MVC-021S.JPG (58.36 KB, 182 downloads)
#198365 06/03/2009 11:57 PM
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Dear Bernd,

Thank you. Very impressive piece, and nice to see the machine woven eagle in use.

Bill Unland

#198366 06/04/2009 12:00 AM
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Interior has partial front liner with 2 upper interior pockets , that are not lined , and reinforcement at the sleeve joint .

MVC-033S.JPG (33.46 KB, 179 downloads)
#198367 06/04/2009 12:01 AM
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Close-up of the sleeve joint with reinforcement at the arm pit .

MVC-030S.JPG (39.33 KB, 259 downloads)
#198368 06/04/2009 12:02 AM
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Interior backside has no liner at all !

MVC-035S.JPG (34.73 KB, 258 downloads)
#198369 06/04/2009 12:12 AM
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Liner of the left hand front closure panel has the following black ink markings between two button holes :
" RBNr.0/0320/0001 "
and size numbers :" 103-68-47-90-"
and what should be the issue year of "44"
and further down what could be the 'Bekleidungsamt' or a district number
" IV " .
--All very interesting !

MVC-034S.JPG (40.62 KB, 258 downloads)
#198370 06/04/2009 12:14 AM
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Reinforcement at the waist with liner section with a hole for the belt ramp .

MVC-031S.JPG (36 KB, 255 downloads)
#198371 06/04/2009 12:16 AM
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This close-up shows that there is a white linen reinforcement material at the waist line joint .

MVC-032S.JPG (33.4 KB, 257 downloads)
#198372 06/04/2009 12:18 AM
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Close-up of the upper section of the Bevo sleeve eagle .

MVC-010S.JPG (109.31 KB, 255 downloads)
#198373 06/04/2009 12:25 AM
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...and the lower section .

MVC-12.JPG (110.75 KB, 253 downloads)
#198374 06/04/2009 04:39 AM
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Bernd ... CONGRATS! What a spectacular 'late war' Polizei Tunic!
Your Super Photo Skills really fill in the details nicely for us.
The Condition just couldn't be any better... Txs, Dave/dblmed


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#198375 06/15/2009 04:13 PM
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Thanks , Dave .
I thought I would place my Dad's dress tunic on this forum next .
My Dad had this tunic tailored by Thiele / Munich and wore it to Hitler's Birthday parade on 20th April 1942 as he stood with drawn sword in front of a ' Hundertschaft ' of Schutzpolizei men .
First a drawing showing my Dad.

MVC-032S.JPG (55.15 KB, 205 downloads)
#198376 06/15/2009 04:18 PM
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The dress tunic of Oblt. Heinz Ostermann.
I also have the fitting flared pants with doe skin leather seat area , done by the same tailor .

MVC-007S.JPG (30.64 KB, 205 downloads)
#198377 06/15/2009 04:19 PM
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..and aclose-up .

MVC-015S.JPG (40.59 KB, 203 downloads)
#198378 06/15/2009 04:22 PM
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.. and his decorations . The last one to the right is the Croatian Bravery Medal ; I also have his award document for it .

MVC-014S.JPG (42.48 KB, 203 downloads)
#198379 06/15/2009 04:23 PM
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.and a view from the side .

MVC-010S.JPG (40.13 KB, 235 downloads)
#198380 06/15/2009 04:39 PM
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..and a view from the other side .
The Officer's sword is by Eickhorn and has the SS-runes in a box on the underside of the cross hand guard and atop the scabbard throat.
I added the BALKAN arm shield to his sleeve , since from summer 1942 on he served with the Police Volunteer Battalion No. 8 Croatia .
There is the notion that this shield was never awarded , however , there is also the account by an SS Officer of the 'Prince Eugen'
7th SS Mountain Troop Division , that he handed out a 100 of these shields to his men in 1945and close to the end of the war .

MVC-012S.JPG (31.87 KB, 233 downloads)
#198381 06/15/2009 04:49 PM
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..and an other close up .
By-the-way, Dad's Iron Cross 2nd class , was handed to him in person by famous General von Pannwitz who was in charge of the Russian Cossak units that fought for the Germans in the Balkans at the end of the war .
My Dad's unit was attached to von Pannwitz to fight Tito's partisans .

MVC-013S.JPG (38.06 KB, 230 downloads)
#198382 06/15/2009 07:21 PM
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Bernd - What a Spectacular (& so very Special) Polizei Uniform for your Father! Collecting makes History come to life for all of us, & for you especially, there is this wonderful connection with your Father. (A 'Perfect' Post as we are now very near to Father's Day!)

Regarding the Balkan Shield - like so many other Late War items - Collectors should keep an open mind & perspective! So much was happening & the "spare Administrative time" to properly document presentations (as was in early war), no longer existed. Plus the supply & distribution system was greatly impaired - some essential item reached the Front - others did not. I'd much prefer to give credence to the Soldiers who were there, at the time - than to those who rely upon only by very limited documentation.

A wonderful 'time capsule' of real history! Txs for Sharing! Dave/dblmed


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#198383 06/15/2009 09:12 PM
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Again,thank you Dave .
Here now the 2nd part of my story .
As Dad and I looked in 1965 for his dress tunic in his footlocker at his home in Hamburg , Germany , we found a 2nd tunic ! He had forgotten about this one .
This tunic was issued to him when he got his promotion to Oblt.and the tunic liner has an black ink cancel that reads :' Lapo -Muenchen '
He had never worn this tunic and the Officer's sleeve eagle had not been sewn on .
On this tunic all insignia is subdued and the buttons have a gray-green paint finish .

MVC-033S.JPG (39.59 KB, 221 downloads)
#198384 06/15/2009 09:14 PM
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..and a closer shot .
The leather map case and the gray-green felt line leather belt were also still in the footlocker .
I shipped everthing home in that foot locker !

MVC-034S.JPG (46.42 KB, 217 downloads)
#198385 06/15/2009 09:23 PM
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..and a close-up.

MVC-035S.JPG (44.56 KB, 216 downloads)
#198386 06/15/2009 09:24 PM
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.. this shows the subdued insignia .

MVC-036S.JPG (40.69 KB, 217 downloads)
#198387 06/15/2009 09:25 PM
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..and a side view .

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#198388 06/15/2009 09:26 PM
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..and just tunic side view .

MVC-042S.JPG (48.54 KB, 213 downloads)
#198389 06/15/2009 09:27 PM
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..and from the other side .

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#198390 06/15/2009 09:32 PM
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..and my M43 Officer's cap which has false
ear flaps.

MVC-044S.JPG (66.23 KB, 260 downloads)
#198391 07/07/2009 10:47 AM
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BTT to keep alive

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my jacket (1944). jeff h.

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and my hat. had other photos of the jacket but, issues on size, would not allow. jeff h.

police.JPG (72.19 KB, 202 downloads)
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Schupo vented white-top by Erel:

schupo.jpg (33.62 KB, 161 downloads)
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Wow!!! Outstanding collection, I wish to have only one of this fantastic police uniforms smile

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