UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons HJ Edged Weapons Forum Supposed Marine HJ

Very interesting thread.
I find the first blue diamond posted here very neat. Whoever made it, invested a lot of time trying to make it look like the common ones, but just blue. If it's fake, it is not a crude one at all.

Here are the pictures that I took of the HJ with dark blue diamond a couple of years ago.
The knife was a mottoed RZM only. It also beared other stampings: an eagle with "3M" on the spine and "HAMBURG" on the ricasso.

I did not buy it.

Best greetings,

Herman

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Thanks Hermann. It�s a good adition to the post.
I also like add a question on this kind of knifes. If they are fakes (even using a good one and replacing the pin) why aren�t more in the market??? Anyone faked only one or two pieces??? It�s dificult to believe. Just think on the SS rings; many copys from many places in all the times. Just an opinion of course.

Very interesting Herman, and this one has the early slanted pattern plates. I'd still like to know from Ron and/or Houston whether this type of diamond was first seen at the same time as the various other coloured/white diamonds. With the stampings and gold wash, I wonder if this type is more likely to be marine related?

Regards
Russell

� �I also like add a question on this kind of knifes. If they are fakes (even using a good one and replacing the pin) why aren�t more in the market??? Anyone faked only one or two pieces???�

A good question which is not that easy to respond to I think that a number of factors have to be taken into consideration. Excluding new manufacture, if we look across the broad spectrum of postwar fakes of all types. My personal opinion being that with modified/altered items - a lot of it has to do with the supply (or lack of supply) of original period items that are suitable �candidates� for conversion. For example: you don't see only combat bayonets made by the Eickhorn firm in 1940 with fake �SS� etchings. You see whatever the faker was able to buy from any maker and any year that the bayonets were made. And while the first fake �SS� etched bayonets were made in quantity roughly 40 years ago - they still seem to be turning up newly minted from new sources.

Much more difficult to pin down are the small volume altered original types of fakes. With many items seeming to be singular, or in a very small volume, of swords, daggers, knives, bayonets (etc). On occasion some of these types have resulted in some lengthy discussions both pro and con. With sometimes a clear winner. And other times the readers are left to make up their own minds as to what makes sense to them - either for or against.

While I lost my old data file, a quick look at what is out there now shows at least a half dozen supposed different �Marine HJ� blue diamond knife makers. With three purported makers of the blue diamonds of various types. And a West Coast dealer (who may or may not be out of stock now). Who was selling the blue HJ diamonds for the �princely sum� of $7 dollars (U.S.). FP

Nice Thread,,
here is an other blue HJ i had seen in an collection. I`m not shure, if the whole knife is fake. The blue diamond is.

regards
Medes

I have no doubts that if that white and blue diamond was red instead of that blue + having the fishscale pattern, many of you would instantly say it was fine.

here is the maker of the knife I had post._

the whole knife:

While in the overall scheme of things I think Hitler Youth collectors have a much larger exposure to fraud with the small DJ/BDM/Partyday/Olympics aluminum hilted based knives. That does not mitigate what I consider to be smaller scale frauds like the so-called �HJ Marine� knives with the blue diamonds. Which (unlike the small knives cited) IMO seem to be from a bunch of smaller scale �independent producers�. Versus a more well equipped/professional maker creating fakes.

With the knife Medes posted IMO being a good example of a small scale attempt to create a fake. With what appears to me in the image to be a very obviously glued/epoxied (whatever) blue diamond inside the recess. Filling in the space between the diamond itself and the interior of the recess. FP

The image inverted.

Is the knife good and only the blue diamond fake?

regards
Medes

quote:

Originally posted by medes:
Is the knife good and only the blue diamond fake?

regards
Medes

Medes your hj knife is an early type made by Aug Merten & is 100% genuine but the blue daimond is imo 100% fake!!.....Best Scott.

Definitely not a round swas,,
hungarian hj pin

Same seller has a marine pin, but its purple,,,
purple marine pin

quote:

Originally posted by ESU:
Definitely not a round swas,,
hungarian hj pin

Same seller has a marine pin, but its purple,,,
purple marine pin

Both ugly Hoffmann fakes.

If you want to know where all the fakes are--I can tell you--they are with all the other thousands and thousands of fakes and "parts daggers"--in the collections of the MANY collectors who "want to believe", don't buy books, don't listen to those who have been there from day one, don't go to shows, etc, etc.

quote:

Originally posted by Gold Party Pin Guy:

quote:

Originally posted by ESU:
Definitely not a round swas,,
hungarian hj pin

Same seller has a marine pin, but its purple,,,
purple marine pin

Both ugly Hoffmann fakes.

Does the name Hoffman automatically mean its fake?
ESU