UBB.threads

Longer time ago there was a very good discussion on the GDM about the F�rth Daggers, sadly it was getting lost.

My local hometown is close to the city F�rth (I am actually also born in F�rth) and the building was build in 1902. It was in the pre war time one SA Sports school and the SS took it over for a very short time. The SA took it then over again and shortly as the war ended it was used as a accommodation and was then used as a hospital. Enclosed some photos of it's actual representation and one researched SS F�rth Dagger. Thanks to Ross and one of my best friends I got the dagger from. See also the chapter in the T.Wittman dagger book.

front view

reverse of the grip

F�rth dedication

rear view w scabbard and hanger

research from Ross

part member booklet, rsearch Ross

my own finds I

II

III

Very impressive Robert!

A researched Furth dagger is indeed a rarity.
Added bonus is the additional documentation.
Doesn't get any better.
-Congratulations!-

Regards,
-serge-

Very impressive SS dagger. I like the etching

LH

Superb, it is indeed a wonderful historical dagger.
Thanks for sharing !

Hey Robert, I just noticed that I will be only a few miles aways from Furth, as I'll be in Regensburg in May for a couple fo days.

Pat, be earlier there in March and we could take a good dinner in a small city 60km east of F�rth.

many thanks for your views and replies.

Robert:

Here is mine. It is not attributed, but maybe could be researched based on the Furth etch?

Dagger obverse

Dagger reverse

Trade mark and dedication:

Trade mark and cross guard

obverse etch

Grip obverse

Grip reverse

And, finally, the Furth dedication:

John

very nice and a little later dated dedication as on mine. I went already to the archive in F�rth to look what they have and there was not much at all from the military perspective. Not sure where to find more, I checked also out a larger national archive in Germany. Not sure maybe a professional researcher might could find more in the US archives. Fakt is these dagger existed, the school existed and already faked etches are also out when I remember right.

Superb dagger with great history.

These are great daggers. I would love to own one someday.

quote:

Originally posted by Robert H.:
very nice and a little later dated dedication as on mine. I went already to the archive in F�rth to look what they have and there was not much at all from the military perspective. Not sure where to find more, I checked also out a larger national archive in Germany. Not sure maybe a professional researcher might could find more in the US archives. Fakt is these dagger existed, the school existed and already faked etches are also out when I remember right.

Hi Robert.
Do you have some pics of fakes Etch of this type of blades ?

LH

No sorry I don't, another original one is currently on the market offered.

There is a different version of the Furth etch here:

http://www.lakesidetrader.com/pics/Ss-227d.jpg

It is a Hammersfahr and the Furth etch is unlike the two that Robert and I posted in this thread.

That being said, I believe that it is real and very collectible...maybe for a collector who wants Furth variations.

John

For sure real and this is the only other "one lined version" I know about. Hard to find for sure. Over all I wonder how many are out in collections. but very hard to term the value to such pieces. Example a HH or Roehm dagger are over rated when it comes to the rarity of an original F�rth dagger.

Robert:

I wrote too soon.. an example of this etch is seen in Tom's SS book in the Furth section, albeit on a Klaas blade.

And, in the book, I see a third variation of the Furth etch.

Wouldn't it be great to have all three types? Or are there more?

John

I have heard - a while back - a theory about these daggers:

That some of the SS Furth daggers were actually the man's original dagger, not a new one, to which the dedication was added at graduation.

Does anyone have thoughts on this ? I don't own one so I can't say much.

Dave

Dave,

Wholeheartedly, I agree with the theory that you've heard in the past.

The guys were in the SS and then went to a course(s) at the SS Sportschule where upon completion or graduation they received a certificate and then took their personal dagger to either a qualified blade engraver or to a dagger manufacturer for inclusion of the respective school's name and corresponding dates. Any other theories would be impractical and invalid in my opinion.

Regards,

John

Yes, in every case you will see that the dedication etch was added later. They were definitely NOT done at the same time as the motto.

that is absolute right and the etching was also somewhere local done, but from who
The time period for the school was very short even not for a year in the hands of the SS. So all was done from the same source, what is also visible from the etching quality.

I happened to stumble onto this old thread, but I thought it would be interesting to note the following:
My Furth-etch dagger is identical!
Robert Klaas with "III" numeral, except my crossguards are earlier nickel.
My dates are the exact same �15 .7 � 25 . 8 . 34"
Even the SS button is the same variety!
Very interesting as it seems the original owners were probably in the same class!!
Consider for a moment the odds!!!!

Jerry

Came across these photos while looking for Rohm examples and thought it might be interesting. Photos have been enhanced to show the inscriptions....