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Joined: Oct 2005
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Those are perfect pictures for reference!



Have you tried any leather shiner to bring out the color? Like where you can buy a little foam brush and just go over something leather to put some shine on it. I was thinking about trying to shine the bayonet a little more with some metal shiner so it sparkles, but wasn't sure if that was good for a historic item.



What I'm going to do is buy the bayonet and belt buckle I showed you in my recent post. That way I only have to hunt down a belt and I can do that later. The buckle is the most important piece on the belt to me. Thats why I can wait on the actual belt.



Who knows, maybe I'll just go to a store and pick up a black leather belt that would fit the buckle (most likely not since I like it ALL to be original).



I'll post pictures ASAP when I get my display together.



Cheers!

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I really don't want to spend $150 on just a belt...:P

http://www.germanmilitaria.com/Heer/photos/H021958.html

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Yeah, that's a little high for just the belt. I would say $75-100. You'll find one when your not looking for it.
I haven't put anything on leather in years. The reason being I once read to put vasiline on the leather helmet liner to preserve it and it ruined it. I don't want to do that again.

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I'm going to do exactly that then. Wait.


That's too bad. Maybe a leather conditioner would of been better. I have some for my car.


Would you say a troddel is overkill? I believe I read in my Waffenrock Parade Uniform book that "usually" they are only on Parade bayonets that have an image on the blade.

I want to make my uniform authentic down to each piece in the way that it was worn Smile.

http://www.wwiidaggers.com/6069.htm

The price is fantastic. $50 and it's in my state.

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A troddel would be correct on the dress bayo. The heat must be getting to me as I can't remember if that's the correct one. I couldn't find the text on it but if Tom Whittmann says it's correct then it is. I know there are ones with different colored parts but those might be earlier. I'll have to look in my books. The blade doesn't have to be engraved, actually etched, it can have a plain blade. these are much cheaper and on a manequin you'd never see the blade anyway.

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Tom Whittmann did reply to my email saying it was correct. I asked him if that troddel was appropriate for my NCO Heer Waffenrock.

I guess it's mine then Smile.


I think the only thing I would apply to my blade is some metal shiner we have. I used it on drum symbols and my car's exhaust tips and it worked very well.

The leather, I will find out about what I have before I use it.

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Bayonet and buckle is en-route, but won't have it on the tunic that fast since I'm still looking for a belt. The troddel is coming soon once I purchase it.

I need something to drape over the piano more to cover up the wires in the back. Smile

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2nd eagle awaz looks poorly done and the design strange.

marker:

w'rocks used 2 styles of eagles:

1. the officer-style, hand-woven aluminum(or silver)-bullion eagle like the 1st one here -
(normally worn by officers on their everyday tunics) and

2. a machine-made one in flat alu. or maybe also silver-thread wire. also: some 'rocks have silver-wire collar and cuff tresse 'sted of aluminum.

again, the 2nd eagle you posted here looks odd - esp. the swaz. let the eagle guys chime in..

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I know the eagle wasn't right. I just just using it for reference to show you what I meant when I said I liked how eagles were "defined". I just got it off of google really fast.

The last pics I just posted was from today. I got my tunic in the mail this afternoon.

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Don't forget to check the pockets in the rear flaps. You might get lucky and find some kind of paperwork. I once found theater tickets in them.

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Hehe I didn't realize parade bayonets didn't come with an edge. Oh well, time to get a combat one Wink.

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A combat bayo doesn't have an edge also. Bayonets are for trusting/sticking not cutting. if you find a combat bayonet with a sharpened edge it was done after it left the factory and probably after the war. I would not want to explane to "Der S****e" why I sharpenend it against orders. It also kills value.

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Marker, you seem to be interested in future re-sale value like any other commodity. I am not sure you have any interest in the historical value of these items. I hope that is not the case because you are very enthusiastic. Good luck.

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Right now I'm 19 and I can't see myself keeping this tunic I purchased for the rest of my life. I can't even see myself turning 21 for that matter haha.

Anyway, as of right now I wouldn't dare sell it because I love what I have and the fact that I have a piece of history behind it. I'm not too sure what my plan is with it, but I'd like to keep it for a very long time. I made sure to get one in good shape because it looked more beautiful and if I did sell it, it would have more value to it.

I think I would only sell it if I was trying to get a higher officials uniform like an SS tunic or something. Given that this is my first uniform, I'm not so sure I could bare loosing it. Just like my K98. It was my first rifle and I wouldn't' dream of getting rid of it


Thank you for your reply!

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Photobucket


I love it so much Smile.

You all are awesome. Thank you so much for the help!

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I don't blame you for loving it, it's a beauty. Are you still looking for a visor hat? I see the tunic has loops for a ribbonbar. Any thought on what you are going to put on it?

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Yes, I'm looking for a visor hat.

I think since I'm on a tight budge I'm going to settle for this -

http://www.jssmilitaria.com/data/inspect.asp?Item=1247&Filter=German+Militaria

If you look at the inside pictures, the sweatband is ripped a little, but I think I can deal with it since the outside looks presentable.


Ribbonbar? I have no idea what kind would go with it or what would look nice. Not to mention I'm not sure if the sites I know of have any Smile.


Feel free to chime in! Smile



-Mark

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Mark,

Your US uniform has what appear to be:

- US Army Combat Infantry Badge in the incorrect position

- Pilots wings on a staff NCO uniform

- US Marines marksmanship badge

Either the guy got around quite a lot or someone added a lot of detail

Dave

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I put the Infantry Badge and marksman badge on myself. That would explain a lot Wink.

I had them laying around and thought it'd better if I just put it on my US uniform.

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I wouldn't be bothered about the small tear to the sweatband. There is a small moth hole on the top in the rear but, for the price i could live with it.
For the ribbon bar since this is a high ranking NCO he would have at least along service medal and maybe one of the "flower war" medals (Austria, Czech or Memel). What is the distance of the loops from one another?

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I'll get the hat in a few months when I have more money.

As for the loops. It's roughly a half an inch away from the other loop.

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The loops will fit a single ribbon bar nicely. A multiple ribbon bar would be a little loose but just sitting on a maniquin should be fine also. I believe singles only go for $5-10.

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I'll find a nice single ribbon bar to put on it.

http://www.ww2-militaria.co.uk/Headwear.htm

Look for item "HM11A". It's $488. Too bad that there is marker on the inside hiding the owners name.

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Hey Raymond,

Which hat do you think would display nicer?

The one I just recently posted looks nice, but it isn't as "peaked" as the other. Maybe thats something that can be changed with by pushing up the inner lining or something.

Looking forward to hear from you again!



-Mark

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There are two styles of visor hats. There's the saddle type which has the high peak and the saucer type that isrounder and not as high in the front. I believe the saucer style is earlier than the saddle style but either would look fine. I personally like the saddle style but that's me.

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Hehe you got me!

After studying the saddle style for the last few days, I think I determined that I liked it a little more.

Plus it has no mothing at all (first one has a 2 small ones).

One thing I can't seem to understand... How come some visors have an RZM tag and some don't?

Obviously the saddle one from that site I posted is authentic since it has a date on the inside liner and you took a look at it...but why no RZM tag?


Oh and I just realized that the pilot wings on my US Ike Jacket is incorrect... Grrr I had no clue. I put the marksman badge and infantry badge on myself, but the pilot wings came that way.

I'll worry about that after I get my visor Smile.

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Only "Party" organizations come under the control of the RZM. Wehmacht organizations (Heer, Kriegsmarine & Luftwaffe) don't. If you seeany item from these organizations 99.9% it's a repro. There is one exception I know of and that's a Heer(Army) buckle marked RZM M4/44. This is the only original item I know of marked with an RZM code. There could be more but be cautious.

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Very Nice !!!

I love the Waffenrock tunic !!!

Sebastien.

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Grr I just realized it's 325 pounds...Not 325 euro's.... Hundred dollar difference for American money... Frown and I liked the 2nd saddle style hat.

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I found some visors I like, but it seems like I can never get the right combination...

I want it with the "saddle style", dated, and named Smile. I found a saddle style dated, but no name.


Each link is a different pic of hat even though the link looks the same.

This hat is $625...

Doesn't look like it has a maker though.

http://www.militarynut.com/imagelib/sitebuilder/misc/sh...a.jpg&target=tlx_new
http://www.militarynut.com/imagelib/sitebuilder/misc/sh...b.jpg&target=tlx_new
http://www.militarynut.com/imagelib/sitebuilder/misc/sh...c.jpg&target=tlx_new


-Mark

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There's no makerer's name because this is not a private purchase hat, it's an issued hat. It's a nice hat and Andy (Militarynut) is a great guy. If you are dead set on a private purchase hat just be patient. If you can get to the local shows you'll be able to see and handle them.

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Okay, sorry for the triple posts! I just couldn't makeup my mind!


Thanks for chiming in again Raymond. I really do owe you a lot. Maybe there's someway I can express my gratitude?


I need everyones help please. Especially Raymonds Smile.

I like both of the hats I showed you. The one from Militarynut and ww2-militaria.co.uk.

The only problem I have with ww2-militaria.co.uk, is that the inside of the cap looks like this:


I'm trying to figure out which hat is going to be more valuable. Is the marker on the inside going to decrease anything?

The hat from militarynut has a date, but it's not a private purchase hat.
I wasn't certain if I should get the one from ww2-militaria since it has a maker. I was thinking that would cancel out the marker decreasing any value...

Militarynut description -
"New -- New -- New
Army E.M. visor hat
nice condition
dated 1938 under leather sweat band
shows a few lite moth nips
great war time condition"


ww2-militaria description -


"Thanks for the enquiry, item number *** is a good 'honest' infantry
NCO cap which i obtained from a mans wife in Portsmouth. He obtained from a German prisoner in an internment camp just outside Southampton after the D-Day landings.

Inside the cap his name and regiment have been blacked out which i have seen before on prisoner items.
The cap itself is in overall good condition and has a nice worn shape."

I think I'm leaning more towards ww2-militaria since it was actually issued....

What would you say is going to have more value?

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The one from ww2-militaria looks like the visor has been reattached. See what looks like black thread to the right of the ink stamping on the sweatband. If it is reattached this will have an effect on value. Some guys wouldn't mind others wouldn't bother with it no matter how low the price. If your only going for one item get the best you can afford even if it means waiting. Being your Waffenrock is a high grade NCO I'm sure he would have had a private purchase hat. Also the condition of the tunic and hat should be as close as possible.

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The visor from ww2-militaria is 340 Pounds... That's around $675. The visor from militarynut is around $600 something. I think with all the info I've been presented with I should go with the militarynut visor.

ww2-militaria told me the visor was not altered in anyway. I still don't like the marker on the inside...



Here are the pictures from militarynut. You can see a tiny moth bite. The hat is new, at least that is what it says on the site. So that means it was never issued?

Photobucket

Photobucket


Photobucket



Photobucket


Photobucket


This has everything I want in a hat. I can live without a name.

Raymond, do you believe the color and fabric quality of this hat will match my waffenrock? If it's not the right color I will pass on this one. Matching it to the waffenrock is important like you said Smile.

I'm pretty sure this is the last question I need answered and I'm good to go!


-Mark

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A slight shade difference is normal. Matching the condition , color and fabric can get tedious. From the photos Andy provided I think it would match up nicely.

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As long as you think it will be close enough and I shouldn't wait, I'll get it. I don't want to put down $600+ into something that is a little more than off and won't match.

Should I request additional pictures for you?


Side by side for you:

Photobucket

Photobucket



Here are some links/pictures of other hats I was looking into as well. Most of them aren't in good shape.

These are all the choices I have pretty much. I'm finding it hard to find a visor online.

http://server16.pronicsolutions.com/~ahjessen/item385.html

http://klaus-butschek.com/index.php?sid=c1bf01815dd4e6d...ff13.88658170&pgNr=1

http://www.collectorsmilitaria.com/German_Army_NCO_Visor_021407.htm

http://www.johncasino.com/Heer%20NCO%20Private%20Purcha...or%20Cap%2011392.htm

http://www.stewartsmilitaryantiques.com/display.php?pro...getcategory=Headgear

http://historybygeorge.com/catalog/index.php


By the end of the week I think with your help Raymond I'll have made a purchase Smile.


-Mark

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It's hard to tell color wise because photos are taken with different cameras and also seen on a monitor instead of in hand. Besides the one from Andy I really like the one from John Casino , who is also a great guy and forum member. John almost always does the Meadowlands show if you wanted to see it in hand. But that's not untill Sept 20 and a months a long time to wait when you got the itch?
Which one has the closest match, material style wise.

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The one from johncasino.com is nice too.

Here are some pictures of my Waffenrock to give you a better idea of color.

I asked Andy (militarynut) for more pictures.

I don't want to rush into anything... I'm feeling a bit confused and I'm not sure which one to get...

What do you think is important here? You have a lot more experience than I do.

Photobucket


Photobucket

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It's a real hard choice. The one from Andy has the same material (Trikot).The one from John is doeskin. Both are of a high grade material with doeskin being the better of the two, I believe. Being that I'm insane, I'd buy both and also get another Waffenrock. Problem solved Roll Eyes Big Grin. With only one choice, John's wins out only because of the high saddle shape. The ultimate choice is yours.

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Seeing as though they are both the same in value, just different in peak... This does make it hard :P.


The peak not being as high as John's isn't going to hurt any kind of historical value right? If not, I think I want Andy's because it's the same material.

Is the hat Andy is selling supposed to be as low as it is? Maybe I can shape it to stay higher?

It looks like Andy's main color band (in the middle) is darker and therefore matches my waffenrock better.



My gut feeling is to go with Andy's because the color matches best and the material is the same. It's what I want for a display item. Since they are equal in value (even though there is one moth hole on Andy's, I shouldn't be worried about getting something less than what I wanted.

Sound about right? Smile

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