UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons The BCN Bayonet Forum Fire Bayonet Thread

Terry,

Beautifully conditioned example with a nicely toned knot. Is that a Klaas pommel?

Bottom is a Klass. All measurements are the same.

From the angle the numbered example definitely looked Klaasy. Some of the pieces you guys have picked up in recent years have really been in superlative condition, very nice indeed.

Here is a maker we've all seen before, C. Gustav Spitzer KG, Solingen. This was a recent pick up for me & the only reason I can think of that I never picked one up before was I just never got around to it. Spitzer has been attributed with producing daggers for the SA/NSKK, SS, Army, Luftwaffe, RLB, knives for the HJ as well as KS98 bayonets & of course firemans' bayonets. Fisher's guide also attributes Spitzer with producing the SA Feldherrenhalle dagger although I don't know how accurate this is.

Just from observation, I don't believe I've ever seen a Spitzer fireman's bayonet with magnetic pommel. This mark, the one Spitzer is probably most known for, shows a prancing lion with flickering tongue surrounded by the firm's name & location. This mark appears on the reverse ricasso of a long model bayonet with nonmagnetic pommel.

Here is the only other Spitzer mark I've observed on a fireman's bayonet, it's a variation of the earlier mark sans company name but still showing the prancing lion & company location, Solingen. This was my first Spitzer bayonet & I dug it because of the variation itself, it came from Eban many moons ago.

This mark is on the reverse ricasso of a short model bayonet with wide blood groove & nonmagnetic pommel.

Here's a very recent addition & one I'm fairly proud of, a fireman's bayonet produced by the firm of Emil Gierling, Stahlwarenfabrik, Solingen. Fisher's lists the firm as having been established in 1934 & besides producing SA daggers & HJ knives, Gierling also produced poultry shears, nail clippers & hair clippers.

The Gierling mark is quite scarce on any edged weapon so I was astounded to see it on a this bayonet. It came to me from fellow collector Remus in Belgium & I thank him for giving me the chance of adding it to my collection. It arrived after 6 weeks of being lost in Customs too, funny but I had just about given up hope that it would ever be located. I'm so glad it did. The mark almost looks like a lab beaker but that beaker has eyes, feet & a beak so I guess it's a throwback to Gierling producing poultry shears. The firm's initials "EG" are centered on the chicken's chest & the firm's name & location, albeit lightly stamped, are below.

This mark appears on the reverse ricasso of a long model bayonet with magnetic pommel.

Simply beautiful Billy! The Emil Gierling TM looks great. What is depicted in it? I can't really make out the details.

Since you have posted a Spitzer, here's a close-up of my TM and the bayonet itself. It's a short version bayo in pretty nice condition. What I have noticed is that the TM does indeed differ a bit in the details. Look for example at the back feet of the lion. They are not as aligned as those on your piece.





JAN

My J.H.W.-E. and W.K.C. (camera work slowly getting clearer)

W.k.c.

wkc

I may have broken the internet!!!

w.k.c. fingers crossed

Nice Emil Gierling TM. Gierling made nail clippers and poultry scissors. So the TM is a chicken. Well a very strange chicken.

My latest purchase. unknown maker long version.it has a magnetic hilt so probably an early one.
I think Billy G might Appreciate this one

m.m

Note the 2 different colours on the frog most unusual i dont recall seeing this before.

This is one of the threads I check out all the time and I'd hoped I could add to it at some time, my latest acquisition a short sawback by WKC, FW Berlin stamped into the rear, magnetic hilt.

Gary

2

3

Seany,

A very nicely conditioned example of a bayonet with a yet unknown mark. Due to the relative scarcity of the L&WM mark & mixture of hilts, I'd think it was a distributor but as we know with this wonderful hobby, "anything's possible".

Gary,

As usual, you never fail to astound. This WKC has all the bells & whistles someone would look for, were they interested in just one fire bayonet. We've seen WKC sawbacks previously but this one is just a bit more special than all the others. Looks to be very early production, by virtue of the wide bakelite pattern & the overall appearance. In most cases, the later pieces don't hold up nearly as well although occasionally a few do.

Sawbacks always attract attention & you can see this in the asking price which hasn't risen a lot in the last 10 years but has usually generally been 4 to 5 times the price of a nicely conditioned but plain bladed example.

This is the first unit marked sawback I've ever seen, it's also the first short model unit FW Berlin marked example I've seen & also the first one I've seen that did not have an inventory number. The FW Berlin font conforms to nearly all period originals of that department I've seen (maybe 15 overall). One departure from this font was the Alcoso marked FW Berlin example I found in Germany a few years ago. It was super early which could explain the difference, the others that did not match all had some questions about the stampings. All told, a very nice & desirable bayonet IMHO. Well done my friend.

My recent purchase.L.Zeitler, Wien .Nonmagnetic hilt , long blade.

hilt view

Andrei,

A subtle variation from the Zeitler mark I have since yours has the first name initial "L". Zeitler examples are not often seen in any condition & this is certainly a nicely conditioned piece. Had I seen the initial, I may have bumped the price up some

Thanks Billy,
I was very happy to have such a good deal,it is much nicer in person. Very good addition to my collection.

Billy

There are way to many bayonet collectors out there. What are we to do. Nobody wanted them when I started collecting.

Carl Grah, Solingen-Ohligs. Short blade, nonmagnetic hilt.

close view

Andrei,

A rare mark on any bayonet, particularly on a fire bayonet. The one I have is also a short model & very well made, I suspect by the looks of it yours is too.

By any chance, is this the short model that had some sort of item in the center of the obverse grip plate?

Billy,
yes, it has hole filled with glue, somebody try to make "improvement" adding grip insignia. It came from eban, but for this rare maker I will keep it in my collection, before nice replacement shows up. Blade is about Ex.+++++++

Despite the grip problem, I think you got an excellent deal on a rare maker marked piece, well done.

What seems like a new distributor for fire bayonets, Ferd. Erdt Kaufbeuren. Not in my 5th edition of Fisher's so I can't say anything about the particular distributor although I've seen this one once or twice on a KS98. Never on a faschinenmesser.

Reverse ricasso is marked with the Eickhorn '35-'41 mark. The shame of it is some tool sharpened the heck out of it, probably to cut tomatoes or some such nonsense.

Very nice Billy! Ferdinand Erdt isn't an often seen distributor. Certainly the first faschinenmesser I've seen. They must have had a close relationship with Eickhorn, as I've not seen another manufacturer with the Erdt logo.
Here is the only one I have - '35-'41 Eick with the most popular 3219 etch. Unfortunately, mine has been lightly sharpened too. Maybe we can start a rumor that the Erdt firm provided a rare, extra-cost option of a sharpened blade?? Sort of like the Black Widow Luger approach to marketing!

Hey Denny,

A great piece! Doesn't matter the etch is somewhat common, still a thing of beauty to most collectors. By the way, what possesses some people to sharpen a ceremonial weapon? I'll never figure it out myself.

Mine has a real beater blade, but that's the mark of an addict. I see it, I identify the damage (even though the seller didn't mention it) & I buy it anyway. German Daggers Anonymous anyone?

He Guys, here's another bajonet...the best there is i think..

An interesting piece! I think detailed closeups are needed before anyone will be able to comment.

Peter,

Now we're talking. An intreresting piece indeed, looks like it's to an Oberbrandmeister from the City of Solingen's Volunteer Fire Department. Many thanks for posting it.

I was actually going to start a different thread relating to etched fire bayonets specifically & may still do that. Can you post some better pictures of the pommel details & inscription? What is the maker/distributor mark on the ricasso?

Tha'ts a nice looking bayonet, my guess on the maker would be Paul Weyersberg??.

Gary

Gary,

Weyersberg may in fact have made the hilt but the obverse ricasso mark is definitely not for PW. It's a 2 line affair, I'm thinking a distributor like Carl Henkel.

This bajonet whas a gift from the Solingen community
to W. Evertz, the commander of the Solingen firebrigade for his 50 th birthday.
The maker is Horster, the blade is blued and gilted
fantastic piece.

Another picture..