UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons Army, Navy, and Luftwaffe Forum My first Heer !

Just wanted to share my first Heer dagger
with you guys. This is my absolute first one and I can honestly say that I almost dont know anything about Heer�s since I only collected SA & SS daggers so far but I have ordered some reference books and hopefully I will learn something about them.
Anyway this is an Alcoso with 100% crossgrain down to the tip, a pommel with 14 oakleavs and a wonderful patina. Thats basicly what I know of this dagger but I am sure you guys will fill in the blanks for me
What do you think of the MM position ?
This is my first Heer but not the last one for sure, I�m getting to love these babies
Hakan

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Hello Haken:

Congratulations on a beautiful dagger!
Heer daggers were made with a great ammount of detail.
If you look at yours under a magnifying glass (especially the scaddard bands) you will be amazed at the level of craftsmanship.
The more that you look for, the more that you will see.

As to the location of your maker's mark, many collectors believe that daggers found in this configuration have been taken apart at some time.
They would suggest that the maker's mark belongs on the reverse side of Heer (and 2nd Luft) daggers.
I tend to agree with this view, but some collectors do not.
I hope that this is helpful.

a very nice dagger for your 1st. heer daggers are still my favourites!!.

Thank you guys for your replies!
I am getting to like the Heers a lot,
and I have an Eickhorn Heer in NM condition on the way in that I will post here on the forum in a near future.
Have a great weekend all of you !!
Hakan

Nice looking Army. I think the blade is on backward. Look at the Alcoso MM. This is an easy fix though.

Tom

Nice dagger with nice hand work to the pommel & ends of the scabbard bands. I would leave the blade alone you see this early mark in this position quite often.

Yep! You found a real nice Army and congratulation. Thanks for showing to us.

Really? Interesting.

Taking apart a dagger does pose some risks, especially to the pommel. If it's on correctly, then right on.

I've got the same bird as Hakan. Came with MM on the reverse side of the blade. I had to get 'er out for photoing and inspection.

PS- Hakan, nice job photoing. They are great looking photos!!

T

Obverse side.

T

Hakan my friend!

This is a beautiful and very interesting Army.
Besides having the maker mark on the front it�s also interesting to see a 14 oak leaf pommel which is mostly seen on earlier made examples.
All patina seems to matching smooth overall, very nice..
Endless variations makes this hobby to a never ending lesson and that�s makes it so fascinating!!

Congrat!

Top quality photos indeed Bro,

Sam,

Out of curiousity.....do the pommels turn on either of these examples?.

Please dont force them if they dont!!.

Both great daggers and fabulous pictures, now you just have to find the other 4 Alcoso marks .

Thank you all for your coments !!
Much appriciated
I can flip the MM on either side of the dagger,
fits perfect either way but it came this way when I bought it and I think it dosen�t realy matter because the dagger is beautiful as it is.
I am very pleased with my first Heer, it has a beautifull matching patina, flawless handle and a stone mint blade, the pictures wont even do the dagger justice.
As I said before hopefully many more Heer�s will come into my collection
As far as it comes to picture quality,
thank Sam here instead he tought me everything,
thanks bro
Thanks, Hakan

Hakan, Congrats on a very Beautiful early Alcoso!! I believe you have one more suprise with this one though!! A GOOD one! I believe these are the GDC named "EISENKOPF" fittings!They seem to be exclusive to these early Alcoso's and are made if Steel or Iron or some heavy "Ferrous" metal that is magnetic! Get a magnet and try them out. Let us know what you find.I have a Alcoso like this and ALL the hilt fittings(Pommel,Crossguard,and Ferrel)are magnetic. It is neat to have something different from ALL other Heer daggers! Good Show! Kevin.

Hakan81,
first let me congratulate you to such a nice dagger.
As said several times before, the mm s came BOTH ways, I got several daggers directly from the former wearer or family of the former wearer and the mm came this way or the other. So personally I am a true enemy of turning any blade...
To me, what I can see from these SUPERB PICS (!) this dagger looks more like one with siver plated lightwight fittings from PACK. These "iron" fitted ALCOSOs are true rare finds. I am curious how the magnet test works on this specimen.
Regards,

Thank�s Kevin for your reply,
I have now tested with a Refridgerator Magnet
which is quite strong and the pommel, crossguard and Ferrel are all magnetic.
You can see it hanging from the crossguard on the picture taken just now (bad pic. though).
The fittings have a gold/brass colored metal
under the plating, hard to see from these pics
but I post one more of the crossguard.
I dont know how much different Heer�s weigh but this one is 258 grams excluding the scabbard.
This is my first one and have no others to compare with. Are these "EISENKOFP" fittings rare in your opinion ?
Thanks, Hakan

Gold/Brass tone in the fittings !

On my Eickhorn Army Dagger the pommel and the guard are also strongly magnetic, while the metal underneath the silvering looked more like brass to me.
I just tested it after this story.

Thanks Wotan for your reply.
As you can see I have now made the test,
what is your coments of the result.
As I said before I know nothing about Heer�s
so all your feedback Is very valuable to me
Thanks, Hakan

Hakan, Once again,Congrats on owning a rare and unusual type of Heer dagger! I was educated about these Years ago through GDC and was suprised to discover my Alcoso was a Eisenkopf!

Kwaken, Very interested in your Eick Heer because I have never heard of any other type of Heer having magnetic fittings if they arent the Alcoso type! Are they typical Eick fittings or Alcoso like? Love to see pics!

Wotan, The toning/patina under the eye on this crossguard does indeed make it resemble the Pack guard but I think it is the Alcoso Bird. Kevin.

Great news Kevin ! I just love GDC
More coments are welcome !
Hakan

As to the comments of brass looking metal under the silver plating,I believe that the steel/iron was plated with brass before it recieved its final plating of silver.
Hakan,it looks like a spot on the edge of the pommel on yours has worn through both layers of plating to the base metal?in one of your pics? Yes? Kevin.

There is a small nick on the side of the pommel with a thin stream along half of the edge of a brass colored metall and some darker metall
inside the nick. The thin stream along the side could be a brass plating but it�s very hard to say. Hakan

Hakan, Thanks for reply,I love playing with my toys dont you? Ha! Kevin.

Mr. Postman will provide me with two new toys tommorow , one Eickhorn Heer in NM condition
and an Malsch & Ambronn SA dagger in fair condition but with an inscripted blade, that would be a nice addition to my NM Malsch
Will post the Eickhorn as soon as I get some pics.
Thanks again ! , Hakan

WOOHOO!! Early christmas! Look forward to seeing both! Kevin.

Well done, an exquisite Army dagger in a great condition.
I must also admit that your photographic skill is "out of this world", you guys in Sweden ( including Sam ) surely take amazing pics.

Well I am kind of surprised of the comparable outstanding quality of this dagger with it�s magnetic grip fittings. The "iron" ALCOSO daggers I have seen did lack somehow in quality of the grip fittings due to the fact that casting the "iron" is not easy and much more ciselling those fittings is not easy at all. Also often the silvering is mostly gone as it seems that it did not hold well on such fittings. I also think that there is a layer between the casting material and the silver finish, whatever it might be (normally it is a kind of nickle or copper combination).
So imo you do own a very nice AND interesting and scarce dagger!
Regards,