UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons Miscellaneous Dagger Forum New To My Drawer Customs Land

Hello.
I have not posted in a while though I have been adding to the collection and I will post some pictures for your perusal in the appropriate forum.

This dagger had been seen 15 years ago in a collection, at that time the owner did not want to part with it. He was hoping his son would take up the hobby. The son did not. So my friend was passing and on the off chance popped in to say hello. He offered the owner a good price, the guy was really surprised at how much the value had increased and after a day or two of thought passed it on to my dealer friend. In a nut shell I saw it and bought it.

This has all silver fittings and still retains some of the original lacquer.The blade is plated and untouched. It has never been apart from what I can see.

I post it here for your opinions. This is the first of this type I have owned. Any comments will be appreciated especially on the type of cross guard and ferrule.

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11 and final one.

thanks for looking

Can you -please- sho us a pic from the scabbard´s reverse?
Generally, what I can see from these pics the certain piece looks ok and period to me.
The detailed hand enhancing (ciseleur´s work) of the pommel and the crossguard´s eagle - look especially the circles between the legs of the swaz´, are very interesting for me an look good. Naturally, as in most cases, an in hand inspection would be necessary for any final statement.
Concerning the hangers: They are different from what is commonly accepted as period land custom hangers because all the hardware is army instead of custom (especially the hardware with the leafing - custom have arcanthus leaf instead of army oak leaf and the bottom clips which are mostly either plain or heavily pebbled). A lot of copied water custom hangers were made with army parts. BUT I am aware of imo (due to wearing traces and the fact that they came with an original dagger directly out of the household of the former wearer) doubtless original hangers with these certain army parts. Obviously for some manufacturers has not been easy or ven impossible to get the proper custom parts so they simply used army parts. Imo you alsways have to look at an item in complete. The front-brocate looks good and the hangers (waht I can see in these pics) also make the impression of being honestly worn so I personally would vote for period manufacturing this way. Although especially concerning these hangers I highly would recommend an in hand inspection by an experienced collector.
Regards,

Hello Wotan.

I will get you some pictures of the scabbard reverse, i will also release the knot and get some pictures of the x-Guard. I will also show the reverse of the hangers. It still has the leather washer and i will get a picture of the area where the lacquer has worn. I think this is a very early piece.

Very nice looking dagger, appears to be an early configuration, and not a common maker for Land Customs. Love the hand enhancing... The hangers are unconventional as Wotan mentioned, but a lovely piece, congrats!

Red

I have attached some additional pictures. I took them in side so I could use the flash gun to better effect.

Hope you find them useful.

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11 on this and the previous views you can see where the lacquer is just lifting. I think it is amazing that the silver fittings still retain the lacquer. I have not cleaned this in any way. This is how came from the guy. I have since been told that he bought it back in the early 70's. It was part of a small collection.

12 some close ups of the MM

13 Final shot. Thank you so very much for your comments. They are always appreciated. I do not get much of an opportunity to show my collection. One day I hope to follow war daggers and dedicate a web site to my drawers and their hidden treasures.

Nowt wrong with that dagger in my eyes including the hangers, might not be textbook but they look like they have been with the dagger forever. Great find spock, beautiful.

Gary

Very interesting, Spock I make no judgement on your dagger and would not without a hands on.
The lines running right round the scabbard fittings are considered a big red flag. Now I say that but boy there are a lot of things I like about this one. No all daggers are textbook. Touch a magnet to the scabbard body and tell us if under the leather it's steel?
Even if this is a real one it will be a hard sell in this market. Collectors are demanding textbook.

Forgot to say it was indeed a pleasure to meet you in person at the show last year! :>

Yes it is always nice to put a hand to a picture... It was nice meeting you, I may not be at the show this year as I have other commitments but there is alwyas next year.

I to wondered why the rings were around the entire scabbard fittings but put it down to two things. It is IMO an early piece and made by an uncommon maker for this type. Everything else about the dagger seemed right. I did put a magnet to the scabbard and underneath is steel. I have a 100% guarantee so there is never a problem.

As we see so often with other daggers when makers leap on the band wagon and business being the name of the game, all sorts of quirky things can occur. It would be nice to see another PW example from the same period. For someone to go to the trouble of "FAKING" this with such quality and workmanship I just cannot see them failing on so obvious a red flag. The workmanship throughout is class.

Regards

Frank

Looking at this dagger carefully my confidence level is high that this "Is what it is" a very early quality example by Paul Weyersberg.
All the parts and matl's seems to point to early manufacture.
And passing the "magnet test" with those excellect photos provided, I believe this is a great piece that I would love to have in my collection.
And regarding the lines on the scabbard bands, I don't think the Weyersburg firm would just have them on the obverse. But of course that's JMO and Paul is correct it's not "textbook", but it doesn't bother me in this case. We are all still learning and have to keep an open mind to variations.

Welcome Back Spock and Congrats on this dagger.

Regards,
-serge-

Here is another one Frank currently being discussed on WAA, I know which one I would rather have!.
The scabbard bands are definately 1 strike but the rest of the dagger appears faultless, have you had it apart?.
Dont you dare go hiding this one away in one of your drawers, give it some wallspace and a bit of glass .

Thanks guys. Jon I will indeed try and get this one displayed. I will have a word with Baz. (is the fishing good yet?)

I have trawled through a few books and in most cases references refer to aluminium fitted daggers. I took this information with me and revisited the dealer. I have been told that there is no question in his mind that it is authentic because it was this dagger that started the original owners collecting in the 1970's, not as I had thought, one he purchased.

This was brought back from Germany by his father after the war. The reason he wanted to keep it and pass it on to his son is now obvious. It was a family heirloom. I may try and get the previous family to put something in writing and keep it with the dagger. The colour of the leather looks almost black in the photos but in the hand you can see that it is a very dark green.

As we are all aware this hobby grows with each discovery and the accepted standard is pushed to new boundaries. It was a small period in history that produced some of the finest edged weapons ever, on a mass scale. We all keep hoping and poking around for those oddities that will fire up a discussion and open our minds to new possibilities.

In Degen's picture, apart from the obvious condition of the other offering, it has 13 sections to the grip. So why is there even a discussion taking place. It is wrong!!!

Regards

Frank

Tiny scabbard rings too

Spock agree yours is early and in my mind these silver washed early pieces are very desirable!! I love the hand work.

I am totally with lakesidetrader (it has been the reason for my question for pics of the scabbard reverse to see if the lines are running around).
Normally a big red flag but on this certain dagger by a scarce (for land customs) maker with absolutely all correct materials and other details (what I can see in the pics) for certain worth to be proofed in hand by an experienced collector.
The same goes for the hangers. Normally not ok because of the oak leaf I think to see proper manufacturer and wearing traces. Also worth for detailed in hand examination.

The Land Customs are fine daggers . I love them.

Here is one from my collection.
The knot is "Johnson repro" ( but is off now)

Eickhorn makers mark.

Best regards Lh 600



Closer image.

Just for interest sake. Johnson Vol 1 features a P.W. Land Customs. The reverse is correctly sans the line on the fittings. My guess is that this was corrected soon after production ramped up.
Jarle, love it thanks for showing another beauty!!!
Paul

spock
Just for further reinforcement (not that you need any), Tom Wittmann states in his Summer 1991 sales catalog,p. 57, regarding lines all way around the scabbard fittings: "Well, over the years I have run into many a Land Customs with this feature- and, no question about their originality." He goes on to state: "...the Land Customs I have seen with the lines running around have been Weyersburg and WKC makers."

Hope this adds to your peace of mind regarding a very nice dagger.

Bingo!