UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories Helmet Forum Helmet reference book signature scam

This is on eBay (of course). Have a look at this scam...a signed 1st edition of Ludwig Baer's famous reference book on German helmets. However, look at the signature...spelled Bear instead of the correct B-a-e-r. Also, the number "1" in the edition number 196 is incorrect. Europeans write the number 1 with a fairly large upstroke at the top.

Man, the fakers and scammers are everywhere.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6546...category=103999&rd=1

In case it gets pulled, here is the image of the signature.

Thank you for bringing this up Darryl. That is a sad story. The way it is signed reminds me of the way Kelly did in the first 500 copies of 'SS Steel'. Your observations about the spelling of the name are correct, but the upstroke on the '1' is not typical for European writing. In fact, I always write the '1' without an upstroke, as most European people do whom I know personally. It is the '#', which is very strange for Europeans. We are used to write 'Nr.' or 'no.', instead of '#'. These are minor details though, and I am more curious about the way the adorned page ended up in this book.

Cees

It's amazing the lengths someone will go through to make a couple of extra bucks on something.......

Cheers
Don

Probably from someone who dished out $150 for the book just before it was re-printed. And now trying to get his money back......

I agree with Cees.

Erik

It never ends, does it....?

hi all, as i`m sure most of you know, e-bay don`t scan the auctions for shady items to pull, they are reported on by other members, so, say, if someone here were to report this......cough

In the early 1990s I was attending one of the old Greenbelt, MD shows. I turned around and saw and infamous dealer signing Dal McGurk's name to perhaps 20 copies of the latter's Afrika Korps book. Needless to say it was McGurk doing the signing.
John

unbelievable ! what a joke..
Isn't Ludwig Baer still living? I bet he would get a laugh out of this..

What scum

These a**holes will stop at nothing to make an extra buck.

Here's the plate from my old first edition that I believe I bought directly from Roger twenty years ago.
Derek

[QUOTE]Originally posted by darryl:
. However, look at the signature...spelled Bear instead of the correct B-a-e-r. [QUOTE]

These scammers are ceaseless as well as quite obviously stupid, thankfully.

After seeing the second signature I couldnt be positive the top signature isnt his also.

Anybody got one with it spelled "Bare"?...those are really fake

Robert

quote:

Originally posted by Dave T.:
After seeing the second signature I couldnt be positive the top signature isnt his also.

I might agree. I think that first might be his also. Everything looks pretty close and the a and e might just be a quickly written on thefirst and looks like "bear". Just my thoughts.

Bryan

Bryan and Dave,

Yes, you could both be right. The style is the same and perhaps it just appears like "Bear" with a hurried signature. In any case, it pays to be wary these days with the multitude of scammers on eBay and elsewhere.

The signatures are different. I can't tell SS decals apart but I've read enough about forgery techniques over the years.

Someone essentially copied a real signature. Look at the lack of dotted "I" in Ludwig, and the "E" and "A" are reversed because someone tried to write this quickly to capture the stroke pattern. In doing so they spelled B-E-A-R as they normally would.

Hi Darryl, could you please call me or send me an email at [email protected] (905)420-1291 My PC crashed way back in June and wiped out all of my saved files to include your number. I have tried to email you several times but they have been returned as undeliverable.Have a gentex helmet that might interest you. Thanks Darryl, cheers, Ryan

As an author and one who signs my books, when you sign these over and over, sometimes you make an error on the signature when you get in a hurry and tired and you just let it go on through.
I wouldn't be too quick to claim this is a fake. On Bender's books, he had you sign a role of stick on labels for the books remote and anything could have happened.
Ron Weinand
Weinand Militaria
PS: I have found that in these reference books, the original signature adds little to the value. Mainly it is "Is it still in print and is it in demand?"

I removed a couple of posts that seemed intended to cause an argument.

Mr. Leach, plus check your email and respond to me if you wish to continue posting on GDC.

Dave

Fascinating thread ,it looks like the Authors signature to me .I have 30 or so BOB pilots autographs Douglas Bader etc and if you compare these to other autographs they have done they all are slightly different .Rob.

Damn ! Now we'll have to take care about posting original militaria author's autographs in forums, because fakers are watching us for that too ! I feel depressed...

Well, I hope the one below is an original ! Gosh, I have doubts now, what do you think guys ? I just took a good close-up in natural light :

I think I may have goofed on this particular signature...it probably is Baer's original hand however, I am no authority on signatures. A friend had sent this to me and pointed out the spelling error which I then posted here as a warning to others. My intentions were good but I didn't really research the signature thoroughly enough. Lesson learned!

At the time I didn't have my own signed note from Herr Baer to compare it to...

Cheers,

Darryl,
"Hi Mr Pajot here are your two helmets have fun, Ludwig Baer"

Wonderfully simplistic and to the point!

I dont know if they bring the books value up slightly,I would guess that a personized one would perhaps lower it,but its still a nice note to have with it.
Here is one of mine Im very grateful to Gary ,,,,,,Stephen

Its also nice to sneek a pic too,,
from the left Me,Gary,Bill Shea,,,,,,

Stephen,

Very nice indeed...I like the personalized books. You are in great company there in that picture. I assume this is in Bill's "office"?

Here is my most treasured signature personalized to me...

Cheers,

Darryl, is that who I think it is?
Malmady, et al? Retired to France?
OMG...
Paul

I have this copy about 15 years...DAVE H

Paul,

I believe you are thinking Joachim Peiper...it is not his signature. My signature is that of Reichminister Albert Speer.

Cheers,

Nice Darryl one of the most enjoyable guys to learn about from the third reich era, I love 3rd reich Architecture, very interesting indivdual. Tell us more of how you aquired it please. I've got Panzer commanders that wrote me letters thats as high of rank offical I've got. To have a Reich Minister cool. I knew someone who guarded R. Hess before he died in '87 at Spandau, closest I get is the connection to the past . Dang Darryl I just noticed you got that in May of '81 just 6 months before his death

Of course...the Architect and survivor..must have been a treat. Very rare to speak to one of the principals..amazing.
Impossible now, of course.
regards,
Paul

Darryl,
Well done on obtainng Herr Speer's signiture with his published memories.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Regards Stephen

Actually, I never met Herr Speer. A friend of mine had discovered his address so I sent him a letter asking if I could send him my copy of his book, "Inside the Third Reich" so he could autograph it for me. He kindly wrote back saying that books sent to him for this purpose had recently been "lost" in the mail so instead he enclosed a signed dedication card. As Adam mentioned, he died shortly after my correspondence with him.

I put his letter in a frame alongside a photo of him and AH making preparations for the 1934 Reichsparteitag. Here's a pic...

Very Cool Darryl great addition to any collection having something from a minister writen to you . I done alot of research on him, he lead a interesting life for sure. He wrote Inside the Third Reich, The Spandau Diary's, What was the third I would love to read?

I am sorry I missed so much being in Mexico with Tom Johnson the past two weeks, but felt it necessary to comment on this thread.
Signing books, sometimes hundreds at a time, can be tiring and lead to mis-spelling one's own name and mixing letter order as one signs numerous items.
Also, your hand cramps and the signature doesn't often look like the first one or your own. So I would imagine that it is NOT a fake as I view the handwriting. Just My Opinion.
Ron Weinand
Weinand Militaria

Ron,

I believe you are correct and that Baer's signature probably is an authentic one. Yes, I am sure after many signings the signature no longer resembles the first ones signed.

Adam,

The third book that Speer wrote is called "Infiltration - How Heinrich Himmler schemed to build an SS Industrial Empire". My copy is by MacMillan Publishing Co. Inc, New York, 1981. Hardcover with 384 pages.

Thanks darryl!