UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons SS Dagger Forum Market gone Loopy?

It is also interesting how "Junk" daggers suddenly start bringing high prices too as soon as a certain type is "Hyped up". There always have been plenty of HJ Knives out there, but very few good ones with little or no sharpening a clear motto and a decent original unrepaired grip.
A couple of years ago the market was "Hyped" by a few people who managed to drive up prices on HJs to double the price or more. The good HJs did not increase by as much $$$ as those with half of the blade ground away and a missing or cracked diamond. At these "Hyped" times the poor conditioned stuff will sometimes bring as much money as a good one, driven by some kind of "must have" madness I don't understand.

i am not aware that the waitts honor degens have been sold - when did this happen ?

jonathan

Jonathan,
Most collectors didn't know it either. My source told me that a Major Dealer here in the U.S. sold them for the estate of Mr. Waitt.
P.M. me if you like.
No I didn't get one either
-wagner-

The Birthday Degens were in fact offered and sold mostly quietly after Bob passed away. BM has had a couple at the SOS and MAX.

Having been in this hobby since 1952, I can tell you that you hear the collapse of the collecting TR items market is coming all the time. You had the gas crunch in the early 1980s: No one will buy as the shows are going to go away because the price of gas is sooo high.
You have the gun law fears: Militaria will die with the end of all the gun shows.
You have the end is near because the internet will make collecting too easy and available and the market will fall.
You have the wall coming down and the great influx of all the daggers and items out of the east.
You always have the politically correct crowd telling you that collecting TR items will be against the new laws and the market is gone.
What's next???
All I have seen is a steady increase in interest and some great increases in prices.
So far, its about the only hobby where demand has continually outpaced supply from the beginnig, to include the supply of fakes.
For me, it has been a great ride and I see no end in sight.
My wife has alway said: when you are gone I will have to move and get an unlisted phone number, but I won't have to worry about money.
JMO,
Ron Weinand
Weinand Militaria
PS: I TOLD YOU ALL ABOUT THE RUSSIANS YEARS AGO. As I remember people thought I was stupid about them coming into the hobby. Now, the Chinese are coming, so be prepared for the next jump in prices. We are in the minority and our funds are loosing ground.

One other comment on the current dagger market: When I got into the hobby sooo long ago, condition was a real pleasant part of collecting. Mint and near mint conditioned daggers of all types were available routinely. It was not uncommon to see super conditioned HJ Leaders, Rails, RLBs, 1st Lufts. Daggers below excellent were shunned and hard to sell. Common SAs and Army Daggers were almost impossible to sell in the lower conditions. You could find them at shows for $5 to $10 each and they didn't sell. Even SS M33s in the lower grades never brought more than $25.
So for me, the biggest surprise is the fact that nice conditioned 1st Lufts are selling at a premium today when I remember the old days when near mint was the only condition that was saleable.
Ron Weinand
Weinand Militaria

Oleg;

You have some insight in the russian market. Whats hot in Russia except daggers? Uniforms, helmets, medals or SS?

Felix

Felix, I am not sure. Cannot say if the rest of militaria is hot. Edged weapons sel, even though it is not legal. Go figure...

Ron, Talking about the old days...Bringing up all those old memories.... Here's one Ron. Do you remember how it used to be with the maker marks? How a lot of guys would turn away from a mint dagger because it wasn't an "Eickhorn"! Yes, tell them Ron!
How rare maker marked daggers were considered
"second class". Tell them when there was a day back when there was no such thing as a "rare maker"... A day when the rare maker got less than "the Eickhorn"..
Back when.....once-upon-a-time....
-wagner-

Brad, there is no world wide calculated scam on SS daggers, swords, nor anything else from this organization. Take an SS visor, where is the intrinsic value of the stratosphere prices that these are bringing ? How about 3K for an SS cufftitle........ a piece of cloth ??? $800 for a metal SS visor skull that weights 2 grams,even less than my beer bottle cap. Look at the price of any SS helmet ? It's a $200 Army helmet with a 10K decal for god sakes!

When it comes down to it, collectors really don't care how rare a NSKK plated officer's dagger is compared to an M36 SS chain, nor a Water Protection cap eagle's rarity compared to an SS visor eagle; they want that SS emblem that came from the nastiest meanest most feared organization that walked the face of the earth during 1933-45!

Which is worth more, the $25.00 Carcano rifle that Oswald used 1963............ or the $1000 shotgun that Chaney used on his buddy ??

When it comes to SS items the sky is the limit. When it comes to mint condition SS daggers that's were rarity is defined and all others fall in accordingly.

JR

t2

YEP, SS stuff is the most infamous branch of the TR. People know about them, buy books, movies, watch the history channel. Not much is know (by most folks) about the NSKK, NPEA. RR, Teno guys, thus the SS stuff is in VERY high demand. Always will be.

I was talking to a SR collector, he stated back in the 1960's you could buy a High Leaders dagger for $150.00 at a gun show. Geeeeee better than the stock market!

You're right Eric, and a lot of other collectables follow the same trent.

Which do you think would bring more???

Former Pres. Fords favorite chair.........
Or Ted Bundy's "chair, ole sparky" ???

Yes, But how many here remember what $150.00 "was" in the 60's?
You could buy a good used car for $100.00!
-wagner-

I'd rather buy Ted Bundy's knife.

I really do appreciate all of the perspectives that everyone expresses, and I really didn't intend to sound so morbid!

I only chimed in with my opinion. I may be some day be proven wrong. It's just very hard for me to see the current "hyped" interest in this stuff lasting forever. As the more closely-linked generations of WW2 pass along (Vets, sons/daughters of Vets, and even Grandchildren of Vets), I really believe the interest in collecting militaria of this particular generation (WW2) will greatly dwindle. I honestly feel that I am beginning to notice this lack of interest in the younger generations already!

Sure, there will always be a small crowd that still feels the same excitement about these things as we do right now, but I think that crowd will perpetually become smaller as time continues to progress. Younger generations do not have the same chance to "connect" so directly with this past as we do right now, and definitely will not so well as many of you here have in the past 60 years!

I know some younger fellows here will respond and deny my belief, but then again, it's only my opinion . . . This is my reasoning for why I say that the "hype" can't last forever.

Brad

P.S. Yes, the Russians are here now (I myself have sold a few things to them!), and MAYBE the Chinese are coming, but I really feel they are only here for investment - not for interest in collecting (at least as a whole society). This argument must be true for the Chinese - I don't really see any link in todays generation in China finding a collectors "connection" with the Third Reich?!! Ultimately (and by the way, this whole thread is REALLY about this . . .), the only thing making collecting TR militaria so loopy right now is the current status of World economic relations and money-making investments. Sad for me to believe when it comes to thinking about something I enjoy, but I don't think anyone here can honestly argue the point . . .

So true Brad about the new collectors, and what's especially killing it for them, is unfortunately the price of many items today.

I am not sure why everyone is limiting this discussion to third Reich items. In the last couple of weeks we have watched a common (use to be $75 Chinese AF dagger) go for $1,800. Reproduced Hungarian AF just went for more than $1,100, and that was a modern reproduction. Snyders Treasures just forked out over $1,100 for a common MVSN with chain.

I say who ever is driving this, Welcome to the hobby.

Jim

quote:

Originally posted by JR:
So true Brad about the new collectors, and what's especially killing it for them, is unfortunately the price of many items today.

Yes JR, I agree.

I often tell myself that should I ever come into a instant windfall of cash, that I'd buy up ALL of the SS daggers that I could find at ANY asking price, and then turn around and sell them outright at DIRT-CHEAP prices to make it fun for all again . . . flooding the Market would be so much fun - even if it would be expensive!

Brad

I really do not understand all the complaining about the prices. When any of you visited a high end department store in NYC or in any major US city. I am not even talking about "good old Europe" where the prices are about 30% higher than in US. A brand name T shirt cost about 200$ or more dollars. Pair of decent shoes cost 400$ or more. Everything becoming more and more expensive every year. And these things do not hold any value. You wear them a few times and that is it. All high end items are becoming more and more expensive every year. Daggers and other collectibles are also high end. We do not buy them out of necessity. It just feels good to have them for some strange reasons. So no matter what the price is or will be, there will always be folks who would buy them. Just my opinion.

I agree with Oleg. Good point!

I think this hobby doesn't need the little collector anymore. Big fishes have entered the game. Unlike us they don't seem to care about price or condition. Those are the people dealers are after. It is becoming a rich people hobby.

Just my opinion of course.

Yes, indeed a very good point stated, by Stephane.

Thanks Joe Semen

Interesting first post from a brand new member. Tell us about what you plan to dump. Better yet, show us photos.

Yea, me too. I'm with the Skyman.. Show us the stuff you wana dump kid..
-wagner-

I have removed a post by a new member with a phony email address who seemed to want to sell without a premium membership ... or maybe it was someone just pulling your leg

If the younger generations are showing lack of intrest it may be due to Dealer Prices. I cuold'nt sell a original eickhorn chained NSKK marine to any Dealer in area for more than 2500.00. Needless to say I still own said dagger. Yet any collector looking to Dealers would have a hard time buying such a piece or even a standard chained NSKK at such a price. LOOPY?? Just an opinion. Randal.