UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories SS & SA Uniform Forum feldgrau Diplomatic official's visor by Erel

Can someone post pictures for me and also give some idea of value for an original Erel diplomatic fieldgrey visor. It has the silver piping and silver bullion insignia and is an Erel Privat cap. There is no real moth damage just the tiniest bit of nap wear and the stitching has come loose from the rear sweatband. Thanks and cheers, Ryan S [email protected]

Ryan, I can only remember seeing two for sale, over the past two years. If memory serves, they were both charcoal grey/black. One was at Gerard's site, (no longer), and one at the Guild, which is still shown, but sold. I think that it was somewhere in the $5,800 range...I know that they also came in brown. I've seen pictures of Von Ribbentrop wearing both the feld-grey, and in the black...Sorry can't help with value on a feldgrau visor.

Hi Johann could you post pictures of the visor if I send them to you? Thanks and cheers, Ryan

I'm posting these pics for Ryan.

John

side view

next

rear view

another view

inside view

visor

next view

This cap was discussed on the Werhmacht forum. A surveyor/direktor was a civil service rank of some note (maybe that of a colonel I believe...) and this man likely was on service in the administration of the eastern territories, in the Generalgouvernement or farther East in the Beylorussian lands. That is, civil servants wore this kind of regalia in addition to the diplomatic service. An impressive cap which suffers from one of these crappy ersatz sweat bands from Lubstein of the war period. Nonetheless, an impressive piece. Shea has a cap for the Ministerium fur die besetzten Ostgebiete on his site, rendered in a kind of SA olive drab. The title Vermessungsdirektor requires the key word Direktor, like Regierungsdirektor or something similar. I do not have my rank table for civil service ranks at hand, but I think this is a reasonably senior rank. As you know, the Reich had vast plans for agricultural and urban "renewal" in the East, which went hand-in-hand with genocide. I imagine this man saw some fairly startling things in addition to garden variety surveying.

Regierungsdirektor is present day German civil service rank of A15,which corresponds to lieutenant colonel. Thus Vermessungsdirektor was likely around that, I think. Someone else might know better. The ranks of the time are in Fricks, Taschenkalender fuer den Offizier, to include the Heeresbeamten which likely corresponded with the rank in question here. Leitender Regierungsdirektor is A 16, which is colonel lower half, or normal colonel without the ministerial stipend, aka B3. All knowledge acquired from a long affiliation with these people and many happy moments. Namely in the FRG and not the III. Reich. For those familiar with the US civil service, this guy was about a GS12, in fact. Maybe somewhat more. pi pa po.

Hi Donald thanks I like the cap as well and have purchased. can anyone comment on value and rarity of such a cap? Thanks and cheers, Ryan

My thanks to John Moore for his help and assistance in posting my pictures. I really appreciate it. cheers, Ryan P.S.

Hi guys any thoughts as to fair market value for such a cap? I appreciate all replies. cheers, Ryan

I want to thank those members who have sent me PMs on the value of the visor, your input and opinions are appreciated, cheers, Ryan

Now available for sale at $3500.00, inclusive of shipping. cheers, Ryan

As the Brittish say "I'm flabbergasted"
Start of with pricefishing followed by advertising. These are the moments I thank the dear Lord I'm no longer a moderator

Hans if you are truly interested feel free to email me. I sponser this site with a paid membership, do you? The item will be placed in the classifieds. I meet the criteria. I remember buying a kepi from you that you denied selling to me which you advertised on this very forum. I actually brought the letter of authenticity that you gave me(at my request) to the SOS this past February to show Bob Coleman. He chose not to look at it.Oh, by the way many here echo your sentiments that you are also no longer a moderator. Bye Bye Shadowy dealerman. cheers,

Although I no longer post here, I am questioning why my name came in to any discussions regarding kepis that came from Hans.
I bought two kepis from Ryan-one other ranks and the other a standartenfuhrer. At one point, Ryan emailed me regarding possibly buying back the standartenfuhrer kepi. I responded that I no longer retained the kepi as the tresse had been added to the cap after the hat was initially manufactured. This could have been period done or at a later date. The tresse was period and the thread was not modern.
I never accused anyone of fraud and am wondering after all the years that have gone by why this is an issue. Nothing was reproduction. What's the deal here?
Now, I will retire back to where I came from. Please refrain from the use of my name without first consulting me.
Bob

Hi Bob it was Hans that stirred the hornets' nest not I. Me thinks that he has a guilty conscience. No one was alluding to his Kepi but rather the fact that I located the letter of authenticity that he supplied me, after he vehemently denied having sold me any such kepi. I was once accused of not knowing when to close my big mouth. I would suggest that your friend does not know when to mind his own business and leave well enough alone. Time for him to stop running to big brother when ever something doesn't go his way. Next time he should butt out. cheers and regards, Ryan S

Thanks Bob, for clearing this matter up the way I recall it. I will not respond to Mr.Sellick since it seems common sence is no more the leading factor here.

Funny Hans you didn't "recall it" at all until Bob enlightened you. Play the victim but your stirring of the pot is in print for all to see. I guess that the role of victim is one that you know well.You seem terribly worried about your precious reputation. You would do well to better protect it!

quote:

Erel diplomatic fieldgrey visor

I am a bit concerned to see this post as this item "was" located here in New York, not far from my home. I have personally handled it months ago and was the first to post detailed photos of it on the WAF. I inquired with the seller/owner here in New York this morning, 6/13/06 and he has offered to drop the cap off to my home as proof that he is still in custody of this exact visor cap and that it has not been sold.

Zman,
Are you stating that the visor is still in the hands of the original owner and not Ryan?

Can you proove that?
How about getting pictures with you holding it and a newspaper showing the date.

I was informed this morning that Ryan backed out of the deal because he did not know the seller and saw the same visor being listed on ebay as well. The owner is still in possession of the visor as of this morning. Can I prove it, yes I'm sure I could. Question is if I want to spend the time to set up a meeting with the owner and take photos of myself with it along with a copy of the New York Post. If things work out as I plan, in the very near future, chances are I will be able to provide just that.

Yes please let me clarify this matter. I was offerred this visor after it was cancelled by Ebay. I contacted the seller and we consumated a deal on an agreed price. I had the payment ready to send when on the very same day I saw the cap (which I had thought that I had purchased) listed once more on Ebay. Fearing that something was not quite right and not feeling comfortable mailing a money order for a very large sum of money I contacted both the Ebay seller and the person who had alledgedly sold me the cap. The Ebay seller did not reply to my questions. The seller did and requested that I send him the info for the listing. He claimed to have no knowledge of the cap being relisted after we had reached an agreement to sell. I supplied the auction number but did not hear again from the "seller." The listing was cancelled once more. At no time did I "back out" of the consumated deal as has been alledged.I never received another reply or email on the matter. I heard nothing more about this episode until contacted by a well known forum member this mornig stating that he had been offerred the same visor from someone that he had done business with before. I relayed my story and have now seen this thread. This still doesn't clear the matter up for me as something is still not quite right. cheers, Ryan

"This still doesn't clear the matter up for me as something is still not quite right."

I would say that is a fair an accurate statement from my perspective as well. I have been trying to negotiate to procure this visor on behalf of said well known forum member for some time now. I was unaware of any Ebay dealings on the side, which is a cause for concern for me as well.

Hi Zman sounds like there might be a few people involved in this aafiar. Do you presently have the visor in your possession? I have retained all of my emails on this matter and have the names of everyone with the exception of the original Ebay seller/lister. Feel free to PM me if I can assist in anyway. The forum member who emailed me this morning is known to me and is honorable. He is not involved other than to have had the cap offerred to him as well. I would just like to know who presently has the cap if anyone. cheers, Ryan

Yes, apparently so. I have done business with said forum member before and offered to help him procure this item. What I was unaware of were the other avenues the seller was using to hawk this item. The more I learn about it the more I'm inclined to remove myself from this situation. I do not have the item in my possession. If I did it would be a non-issue as it would have been sold long ago, and none of these shenanigans would have occured. I'm sad to see an interesting piece get tangled up in this mess.

Ryan & ZMAN:
This is begining to sound more and more like a scam in the works. Please let us all know how this turns out!
Jim

Hi Zman yes it was your friend that alerted me this morning and I have also done business with him and know him from this forum, a straight shooter. As for the other players involved I have no idea and can not vouch for them. I decided to cancel my money order and took a pass. Too bad as it really does appear to be a nice and authentic cap that does not turn up everyday. Shame really but better safe than sorry and it was selling for nearly market value. Jim I will update you/the forum if I receive any further information. cheers, Ryan

Thanks Ryan. I will see what happens and report back, but I shared my concerns with the forum member interested in purchasing this cap as well. Obviously we were both unaware of your (non) transaction until today. I cannot vouch for the seller either. Good luck.

Just for the record I have decided un equivically to take a pass on this visor. No hard feelings and best regards to you and your friend if you are actually able to procure it. cheers, Ryan Good Luck!