UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories Helmet Forum M16 SHELL UNKNOWN HANDPAINT INSIGNIA

Gents,
let me share with you this M16 Imperial German Shell with hand paint insignias I just add to my collection after a trade with a best collector and friend.
I am looking for any informations about this insignias. On one side we can see an eagle and on the other side a triangle upside down.
What thinking about? Novelties insignias paint by a soldier during WWI? Freikorps? Reichsheer?
I wait for your replies and please help me to identify this one of a kind german shell.
Pics attached show a close up of the eagle and the triangle. I add a PhotoShop job too.
Many thanks for advance.
Respectfully.
UWO.

Other side.

Eagle close up.

Photoshop job...

Upside down triangle close up.

Photoshop...

Any idea????

I think a GI might have painted it -

Tom,

No, I do not think at all that this is a GI which have paint these insignias on this shell.

This assumption could be true as regards the insignia which represents an eagle. But why the GI have would paints the other badge which does not correspond to nothing known?

Generally one reproduces well known things.You speak about GI, I must understand American soldier of the First World War, then I think that the image most representative of imperial Germany is more a Maltese cross rather than this eagle.

This eagle seems to more resemble of the Weimar Republic Reichswehr "chickens".

And if one speaks about GI about the second world war, then the soldier would have painted this eagle with a large swatiska.

No, I does not believe at all in this assumption of these badges painted by a GI.

If a GI paint this shell why he not bring back home with him? This shell was found in a gun show in West of France 2 or 3 years ago.

Thank you for your Reply.

Respectfully.

UWO.

Another idea?

uwo,
I share your view on this hat. I certainly hope someone can identify the triangular, obscure badge. NH....

Norham,

many thanks for your reply.

Add this new pic (very bad pic sorry) of the shell after a light cleaning.

90 percent or close of all original paint appeared under a layer of dust and rust.I also hopes that somebody will be able to add informations on this triangular insigna.

All the informations and replies are welcome.

Respectfully.

UWO.

I just find in this forum this another same topic.
Look at this link:

http://daggers.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/258302.../487102782#487102782

Just add two more pics.

...

About the only thing one could do is guess. But add a few pieces to the puzzle. Was the helmet bought in France? Did it come from Eastern Europe. That would help narrow it down. The eagle doesn't look Polish or Austrian, or Russian. But who knows. Could be anything.

But if it is from France, that is where your friend found it, then I'd venture the following:

1) Storm Trooper Helmet from WWI. Possibly the eagle was painted by the soldier and the triangle some kind of squad insignia? But I'm only guessing.

2) Some form of Free Korps in Germany after the war. Is it possibly a police helmet?

I think we'll have no way of knowing. I'd go through books and look for triangle insignia and see if anything looks even close!

I almost wonder if kids enhanced this after the war, as I really doubt this has any kind of historical relation. Or as Tom mentioned there is a good chance a vet may have done this, which was big business during the war.
Best Wishes,
Bob

No, I really do not think at all that it is a child who painted these insignias. If there was only the eagle, then this argument would be possible, but there is this up side down mysterious triangle. The child would have painted something of well known not this geometric insignia that nobody has never seen.

For the argument of the veteran, I imagine still that you think of an American veteran. Then so indeed wouldn't these insignias had been from the "souvenirs" market, why have been not brought back to the United States by a veteran?

This shell has been bought in a gun show in France.

On the contrary, I think that these insignias have an obvious raport with the History.

WWI Sturmtroppen or Freikorps.

I've seen a "Skinny" eagle like that before....

I'm trying to remember what book it was in..
I'll have a look around.

But can recall the triangle..

No the picture i gad in mind but :....

Have a look at Baer's "The history of the German Steel Helmet" (1st Ed) Page 107 ... not quite the same... but hand painted eagles...DO exist

Mark

Interesting helmet. Going on the fact these were hand painted on the helmet the speculation can go anywhere.

The eagle to me looks like an early Italian Fascist style.

Also between 1923-35 they had a rank insignia that looked like an upside down triangle (or Chevron) but it had three stars on the bottom and not a solid line accross the bottom.

Did Germany sell surplus helmets to Italy between wars, and was this an individuals personal touch to his???? Who knows.

Just more food for thought on your helmet.
I love that style of German Helmet.

OPPS, Scratch all of that about the triangle, I was looking at the wrong thing. The eagle does indeed look like the one I described.
I will look further and see if I can find anything like the triangle.

I think these are "Freikorps" Insignia...

Donnie--
You got me thinking... were there German Fascists in the early 1920s? Not the Nazis (I know about that almost forgotten group ), but an actual fascist party?

Germany didn't sell helmets to Italy, but it could have been a captured helmet. Possibly used by an early Fascist.

Or what about a French Fascist? The British Fascists had eagles, so maybe the French did as well.

.

Well I think its a movie prop. Made in the 40's 50's. Audie Murphys movies inthe 50's had some eagles like this and so did some American propiganda movie made in the 40's did also. Only a guess. But if you have seen period movies these eagles are very simular. All this IMOP. Jerry