UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories German Military Uniform Forum SS Palm Smock Questions

Acquired a palm pattern SS smock three years ago from a well known author/collector. The seller has been accused of selling some items from his collection that are fakes.
Having some doubts,now,that my smock might not be orignal because of those accusations.
Can anyone tell me when or if the palm pattern SS smock has been reproduced? If so, when were these copies made? Will be taking it to the SOS. Thanks.

SM Wholesale is currently making reproduction palm camo, to include smocks and caps.

DonR

Hello,

Post a picture if you have one. Above all else, try to match the pattern against known originals.

Also look at the material and compare against period cotton duck.

Mike

Thanks for the input. Don't have a camera but a few years back Mark Bando posted a photo here on GDC at which time Bob Hritz said it looked ok. But in fairness to him a single photograph might not tell the entire story.
The material feels "thin" and washed out but the colors remain crisp. Will try to match out the pattern through photogrpahs.

For what it is worth, about 7 years ago I purchased a palm smock from a well known author that I returned (without any problem but with some protest from the original owner). In my opinion, it was wrong - the pattern was well off the standard palm pattern and the material did not resemble the proper cotton duck. Perhaps a variation but I strongly doubt it...

Hope this is just a coincidence.

Mike

Even well know collectors/authors make mistakes.
The only way to be sure your smock is authentic is to post some pictures we can look at.

Mike,
By any chance was the smock you returned reportedly belonged to SS Untersturmfuhrer Armin Sohns?
On pins and needles,
gary.

Unfortunately yes - complete with letter to the author.

I have owned 3 palm smocks in my time and have examined several others. If this is the same smock, it certainly was not a standard issue piece and was, in my opinion, not pre-May '45.

Please get some images made and place them on this site so my opinion can be confirmed/ denied. As I remember, a full image of the autumn back side will tell all.

Sorry.

Mike

I believe I remember in the last few years reading from one respected author that the Palm Tree was one of the rarest SS camo smocks made..and that fewer than a dozen were known to exist in collections, yet, they seem to be popping up with a somewhat noticable frequency. Just a thought to be very careful, as with ALL SS camo.

You picked to words out of my mouth Scotty boy!

Took my palm smock to the SOS and John Donovan gave it a once over and believed it not an orignal. In his opinion the material was not right and he suggested that others more qualified than him could be used for another opinion. Being disgusted with the whole affair I accepted the loss.
Checked out a repro company in California who stated they have been selling palm smocks for about twelve years.

GJd52...is there no way you can obtain a refund?? If the piece is a verifiable repro...I (and Im sure it was expensive) I dont think I'd eat the loss. Of course its your call.but in most states I wouuld approach it as a fraud and theft case..most states having a fairly low threshold (400 in California) at which point a theft can be charged as a felony. IM sure there are several legal ways to handle it. Also..in California..the statute of limitations for fraud does not begin to run until the fraud is "discovered"..so..even if the purchase was several years ago...you may still be covered. What you need to do it get the piece evalueated by some good sources..however..I do understand the challange..the representation being that the piece came from a respected collector/author. Additionally..if the item was mailed to you using US Post..then you have another great hammer to work with..mail fraud..federal offense..which opens a whole new aresnal and avenue to pursue. I would seek advice of a good criminal lawyer near you..most will at least evaluate the case for no charge..then..gather documentation..and decide to contact the DA's office..as well as the police where the smock originated. If you can get the proper documentation..and I would if it were me work with MIke/Assoro..then if the DA/police will investigate and feel there is grounds to file..then they will prosecute the case..and you dont even need a lawyer. For what you probably paid for the piece..if it were me...I'd go whole hog. Maybe not a popular thing to hear or say..but in the end it may deter the individual from dealing in this fashion. Just some thoughts to consider.