UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories SS & SA Uniform Forum SS Officers' Cape

1) I think someone needs to see the original file size - hopefully the pic was made in something B I G like sev. megabytes.
Then that can be scanned at hi-res and maybe using "dust & scratch" removal tool (like Digital Ice) & maybe "sharpening" of a good digi editing program.

2) THEN maybe Robt. Noss of the "Photos/Documents" Forum - or Rbt. Hassler can try reading the old Suetterlin Schrift.
Trying to make sense of a 75kb image file seems unlikely to yield anything of use....

3) make friends with an FBI forensic guy and get HIM to enhance the pic!

This is a scan I made,Its better than the best image I have taken,I do believe the script, as inimicus points out, needs to be decyphed by sutterland reader, anyone help?? I have juggled around a bit with photoshop however its the letters I dont recognise! Thanks everybody for your fantastic response! Cigar for the guy who can tell me the officers name!
cheers
Martin

Derek, The cape is completly black everywhere!
cheers
Martin

Thank you Martin,
The reason I asked such an arcane question was that I came across this interesting detail of an officer's cape.
Derek

Derek, Your last photograph shows an old technique that was often employed on Imperial Officer greatcoats (and pehaps Imperial capes as well) and that is utilizing a collar backing cloth to also form the obverse collar piping....by allowing it a slight (around 2mm) protrusion. On Imperial greatcoats that I have looked at this backing material is usually velvet. I have also seen it where the backing materail was other color of velvet and had the piping sadwiched between the collar backing and facing materials in the conventional method.

Martin,

Here is my best guess at the name in your cape. As you can see, I enhanced your scanned nametag image to make it just a little clearer. I suppose if this name appears in a SS-Dienstalterliste then it might be correct. Not sure of the first name but I believe the last name to be "Piltzer", using a mix of Sutterlin and Arabic letters.

Here is your nametag with the name underneath...

Cheers,

Hello, Derek, Yes now I understand why you asked, the cape which is showing its underside lapel could be obfr or above, do you know who the officer is? General ranks had grey interior panels,it would be entirly possible this could have been also used under the collar,indeed looking at the example of Jim Toncars attributed to Lammers,the neck fastening strap appears to be backed also in a light colored material, perhaps Jim Toncar could
enlighten,as to the collar backing on the Lammers example. I note on the greybacked lapel example in the image,it has no clasps, and appears to have no collar insignia, maybe the officer did the easy bit of the updating, just removing the rank insignia? Any date for the image?
Thanks for starting a great thread!
Cheers
Martin

Darryl, Looks like you won the cigar!
Piltzer is certianly a good bet for the surname!
altho I am not sure on the first, Im thinking more on Hans, given that the author has used an sutterlin Z on the surname, I figure he would also have done on the first name, its difficult!
A big thank you to you sir!
It would certainly seem I now have enough to
trawl the Dienstalterliste,
Thanks again, and a happy new year to you and your family!
Warm regards,

I hate to be a kill joy, but the '38/'39 DAL contains no such name. It is updated to June of 1939. Perhaps one can examine the other volumes at han, though I do not have 1937, nor 1940. The regalia under discussion here is extraordinary. Thank you for sharing your important find with us. Viel Sammerlglueck.

Hi, Donald, Thanks for the input,very kind, your not a kill joy, just another stone turned over,I shall chase all combinations down all avenues! Once again thanks for the input.
Kind regards
Martin

I do find Pittler, Dr. Curt and Pitzel, Karl though. At the risk of being a school marm (which I guess I am officially...) you cannot do this stuff without the reprints of the DAL. The 1934 is on line; The 1936 is reprinted in Germany, as is the 1939/40. Finally, the 1944 is as well, but it is incomplete for the lower ranks. It is an interesting and compelling source.

As usual, I have found it difficult (if not near impossible in some cases) to decipher the names written in old German artefacts. I have a black SS helmet or two that have names inside that I have yet to translate accurately. It can be very frustrating. Attached below is one such name...Horst H----mann, but I'll be darned if I can figure out the rest.

In my opinion, the "T-Z-E-R" at the end of the surname in your cape is correct however, the first part is the part that is hard to pin down. I suppose if one had the time (and the patience) to go through the 1939 DAL name by name the individual could be found. Best of luck!

Cheers,

Darryl, I assume H. v. Hautmann or Haukmann.
I like this things a lot where you have to research and to indentify ... And the great finder of the cape will lift this secret also I am sure about it. There aren�t a lot of guys with such capes, and it was for sure an older "Haudegen".

Thanks again guys,you have been great, thanks
Donald,for your time and effort, now I have to locate a 39 Dlst` and get down to long job,anyone tell me where to locate a copy ?
Also at what time of year were they compiled?Could it be I need a 1940 copy?
Cheers

The rank lists appeared each year, I believe, from 1934 'til 1944. The crux, though, are the reprints as a basis of research for you and me. Biblio Verlag reprints the 38/39 one, which I stupidly called the 39/40 above as I have very severe jet lag having spent a week in Vienna and flown thirteen thousand miles in one week. It is edited by Bruen Meyer, was published in 1996 and has the isbn 3 7648 2487 5. I believe it set me back about 110DM in 1997, and I have not priced it recently, though I have seen it on the shelf in Charlottenburg in November. My chums at the Zinnfigurenkabinett in the Knesebeckstrasse in Berlin carry it and you can order it online. See http://www.zinnfigur.com or [email protected]. I should think that Weitze might carry it as well. I do not propose one buy an original, however. The 1936 reprint is less compendious than the '38-'39.

Thanks Donald I will get myself one!!

Hi, Derek, I think I found the answer

Thank you for posting your very interesting photo Martin. It certainly does appear to be a dead ringer for the cape in the Horthy shot. Do you have other pictures of what appears to be a very nice piece?
Derek

the quality in the detail that nobody can beat

1

2

3

last for now

I really enjoy every single photo of this great cape, this tailor quality is just stunning for me.

Martin - Absolutely stunning, posting of that cape is like a Christmas gift. I�d be proud to add these images to my collection of information. You know I�d never use them for evil, only good!

Rick

Hi, Rick,and Robert,glad you like it, I am coming over to the SOS in feb 07, and may well
bring it along. cheers, Martin

Where did you get that from??

cheers

daz

Not my cup of tea but some very nice items. So nice to see. I remember as a young man in my mid 20`s One of my friends had a very heavy hide coat that was black and German. I used to wear it in the winter around Belgravia. Once I was stopped by an old German guy who asked me where I had found the Gestapo Coat? I gave it back to my mate very quickly in case I lost my job.

Wish I had it now though?

After a long wait, at last a fabulous image of the SS evening dress tuxedo and cape worn together!! Where has that photo been hiding so long? Andrew Mollo describes in his excellent reference, Uniforms of the SS.Vol.1, SS-Grosser Gesellschaftsanzug, SS evening dress,
the evening dress cape and the evening dress tuxedo, as the formal evening items, and in turn quotes the Schutstaffel der NSDAP. Kleiderkasse Preisliste. Nov 1940. It seems to me that the evening dress cape, was not a replacement for the 1934 SS Undress cape, which has been assumed by some students of the period, but is an entirly differnt item, Mollo describes the 1934 dress cloak in the same reference(collar tabs and no clasps etc), and in turn quotes another 1940 publication the Organisationsbuch der NSDAP.This would seem to indicate that both capes were official items at the same time. This would also account for the extreme rarity of the evening dress cape, as it would have had any extremly short production period. I am very interested if others can add any more info or images.
Maybe someone should have told the guy in the first image of this thread he is overdressed, or maybe he hasnt been home from the night before! Best regards, Martin.

Impressive thread!