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JohnZ #310824 09/01/2015 06:49 PM
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That's a beautiful early Hörster John, made only nicer by the grip & distributor mark. Love pieces like this, they have so many little points of interest.


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Here are a couple photos of distributor marks I didn't have before.




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Is this a EPack TM with a Otto Haupt distributor?



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Here are the two versions of the Eckhorn 42 over shoulder TM, one with Original and one without and different arm configurations.

John

Two TMs.JPG (39.94 KB, 193 downloads)
Two KS98s.JPG (38.77 KB, 192 downloads)

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Very nice John, I didn't know there were variations on the this late TM, I'm going to pay more attention to this late TM.


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I have seen the Original version on daggers, Heers, Kriegsmarines, Luftwaffes, NPEAs, but this is the first time I have seen it on a Dress bayonet.


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On german forum was found a short blade KS98 zinc hilt, only with Hertra-Qualitaet on blade, any info would be appreciated. b.r.Andy

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Added 30 marks typically found on bayonets to the Maker Mark Gallery. It now contains 410 marks. I have a first test of the Distributor Mark Gallery ready with 140 marks. You can view it HERE. It does not include blade spine marks but I'll get to them after this section is ready to go live. Still going over the pros and cons of separate versus combined Maker/Distributor mark galleries and would like to hear your opinions. Maybe a better option is to have them in the same gallery but in different sections.


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Vern,

There should be a distinction so listing them in the same gallery but different section sounds like a good idea.


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Hopefully will have ait up tomorrow wink


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I always thought that the above TM was post war, but Carters new TM book states this TM was in Ads in the late 1930's see page 269.


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Terry,

Was this mark used on exported blades? The "Germany" part makes me think so.


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Fisher states that this mark was found on a post war hunting knife (2005 7th edition, page 1141)

John


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I have consulted my scrolls (period paperwork and catalogs) the trademark was used during the 30s as I have paperwork with this Export mark.. Fisher is a great reference but most of the research is 2nd and 3rd hand. Accumulated from others work..
I bought 100s of old knife blanks when herder went into bankruptcy years ago.. In there old stock was stuff from the 20s to the 80s.
They did not throw nothing away...
Here is a picture of a cold-cut knife blank showing trademark for export..

s-l500.jpg (22.23 KB, 225 downloads)
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OK I will drive it home .
So it was used domestically also!!
Period documents are the best and while there may be a few errors in Anthony Carter's new book Much of the research he did himself with Henning Ritter of Solingen.. John Walter more or less assembled it.
Notice trademark on the pocket knife blade...
This is why (good) reference is worth buying!!!
Right Terry!!! So now we know it is a period bayonet... Of course it helps that I post the picture of the period advertisement showing the trademark.
Regards: James

Friedrich Herder ca 1935.jpg (76.67 KB, 218 downloads)
Last edited by DAMAST; 03/31/2016 06:44 PM.
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Rarely do we see definitive proof as shown by Jim. As they say: That settles that.

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Thanks James for the help now that you have seen the TM take a look at the complete bayonet.

Top one is a Horster and bottom is the Herder. The Herders blade and rivets are magnetic, pommel not. The Herder blade is a little wider at the crossguard but tapers more to the tip.
Horster blade is 7 5/8 in. verses Herder 8 5/16.



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Always learning Terry, that is my favorate part of this hobby...
Regards: James

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What I learned out of this exchange is that one reference book is not enough... multiple views of the same topic will eventually give you the right answer, one alone may or may not.

And, the best resource is original and period documentation.

Congrats, Terry, on a rare bayonet TM.

John


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Makes total sense John I also have the Fisher reference in the pile..
There are still many discoveries that will come to light..
What a great thread.
Regards: James

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I hope Vern adds this one to the TM list.

I once had a Fireman bayonet with the Herm. Konejung TM that also had Germany in the TM. Carters book doesn't show it but maybe it wasn't post war like I thought.



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I just saw a Herm Konenjung bayonet over the weekend. It was a short sawback with stag grips. There was red felt in the pommel and it came with a frog and company knot. Same markings as shown in the previous post.

Len


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Terry,

I've seen a couple of Konejung sawback blades with "Germany" too. They looked period produced, I always figured they were somehow for export.


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I know when we see (GERMANY) we right away think postwar or export.. put this is not always the case as proven on the Herder mark above...
Germany as used as part of a trademark was also used domestically during the 30s and early 40s..
I have looked at what I have on Konejung and could not find a document with Germany as part of a trademark but that does not mean much as most of what I have is before 1934. Konejung just sent updated pricing on there master earlier catalog..
It would not surprise me at all that this Konejung mark is period and was also used domestically as was the above Herder mark..
You must remember Konejung was a huge tableware and cutlery maker as was the Herder company..

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Thanks James for the input on these TM's

I have a new one (for me)H & F Lauterjung, Solingen. See photo below. I don't know why I had never came across it before. This is a project bayonet, meaning it needs some work. Will show you photos when finished.



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Here is one I have never seen before

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Cool mark, I suspect it's a distributor. Never seen it before either.


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Stingray

I just sold one of those on a long bladed Fireman.

Here is the Lauterjung before and after photos. Better than before




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A fire bayonet? Damn it, another one to add to the list!


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This is a first for me on a dress bayonet(Karl J. Krebs)



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I've never seen the stylized "K" with crown missing the oval. I have a large & small Krebs mark on fire bayonets.


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Distributor on a russian forum KS98 piece, no maker markings, handle with screws, distributor "Militaer Effekte Rimpler" b.r.Andy

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Andy

Were the screws like the EPack?????


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Yes similar, but i am not expert on this, the blade was on otherside unmarked.not extra condition blade,rough refinished shape.b.r.Andy

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Here are a couple new ones for me.

M. Kattler distributor on a long bladed Eickhorn

Prunus, Solingen on a short bladed dress bayonet



Last edited by TKissinger; 10/26/2016 03:15 AM.

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Hello here a A.Meissner Breslau distributor on a KS98 reported from Ukraine.b.r.Andy

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I just found a short model dress bayonet with the Hertra- Qualitat mark on it the H is very faint sorry no pic just can't get them small enough to post.

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This trademark has me stumped. It looks to be a seal or sea lion, but I can't find that in any of my hardcopy or any online references. It's on a KS98 Dress Bayonet. Any help would be most appreciated.

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There is unmarked piece with distributor Joh.Hall/ Donaueschingen on KS98 short carbine blade. b.r.Andy

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