#52487
01/08/2006 02:41 AM
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 492
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OP
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 492 |
"I think that we have squeezed all the juice out of this orange, do I am closing it .... at least for the moment.
Dave"
Am I the only one who finds this closing of a thread, that for all of its disagreements was conducted with courtesy, rather high-handed and abitrary?
Derek
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#52488
01/08/2006 02:53 AM
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,528
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,528 |
I agree!
The administration tends to overreact everytime there is the slightest tention. I didn't even think it was warranted regarding the SS thread. They should let it play out.
Tim
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#52489
01/08/2006 06:04 AM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,976 Likes: 33
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,976 Likes: 33 |
I believe that unless someone demeans, belittles or insults another member they should be able to continue a thread.Two respected forum members disagreed but in so far as I was able to read they remained relatively civil. The fact that one chooses to depart the forum is a major loss but does not call for the closing of the thread. I am in agreement with Craig on this one. Too often do many people attach too much importance to this forum. Take a breather and step away for a moment. A keyboard is a very impersonal thing.I would hate to lose this forum so soon after WMCA. I don't recall any fights breaking out between forum members at the past 12 Max shows that I attended or the last three SOS. Everyone is in high spirits at Craig's party suite. Why do things always break down on this forum. I would threaten to leave but you guys would applaud it. I hope that cooler heads will prevail and Donald please stay. Before I get down from my soapbox I would just like to add that in the interest of civility, honor and respect I do not think this forum the place to discuss the Waffen SS or Allgemiene SS role in the holocaust or in the running and administration of the camps. This borders on the realm of the political and is a very sensitive topic to many.I am not passing judgement on anyone, just offerring an opinion.Thanks and cheers, Ryan S
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#52490
01/08/2006 07:26 AM
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,888 Likes: 1
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,888 Likes: 1 |
I am a student of history, that why I collect. I enjoyed everything I read on that tread and I believe everyone is intitled to the own opinion though I think there should be factial basis behind any statements that are made to back up one's opinion. I agree this tread should not have been locked. I think that cooler heads will prevail after a goodnight sleep. Quitting is no answer to our problems either guys, be fair to thoughs of us that, A)Love History, and love to learn B)Don't collect for the money.. We are not all this way.. I don't have hardly one SS thing because of this, I am not rich, and way too young to get it in the cheap old days, I don't care if I do have the SS material though; I still want to learn each and every damn thing I can, maybe its because my family history stems from Germany and I want to know of my heritage weather good or bad, I had an acute interest in this topic since I was around 8 yrs old. Collecting to me is connecting with history, if I don't have the best stuff; so. Its teaching me, thats what I care about. I know I am not alone, yes there are the MONEY people, But there is the HISTORY people too.. Please remember that before you leave the forum or quit. This is still the easiest way for like minded people to connect, and learn.  Best to All.  Adam Michael Kirchen
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#52491
01/08/2006 09:32 AM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 221
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 221 |
Mr Chapman,you are not the only one...
Whoever chooses to collect German Militaria better reconcile themselves to the fact that Crimes Against Humanity will always be linked to the III Reich.
We are studying the Insignia of a Criminal Organization directly responsible for the running and administration of the Death Camps.
Understanding the SS empire and its history goes linked to collecting its Regalia.
If this is too sensitive a subject for some Members,it is possible they need to approach another different avenue in their collecting.
The "thread locking'is unnecessary.We are not children.
The main focus here should be the quest and share of Information done in an ENJOYABLE fashion.All that petty drama ,caused by people taking themselves too seriously,is more at home in a prime-time TV Show than in a Militaria Forum.
"Fast as a Greyhound,
Tough as Leather,
Hard as Krupp Steel!"
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#52492
01/08/2006 02:10 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 436
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 436 |
quote: Originally posted by Pablo:All that petty drama ,caused by people taking themselves too seriously,is more at home in a prime-time TV Show than in a Militaria Forum.
I agree! Pablo, your tunic shown in the locked thread is excellent, I am envious! According to the regulations I see quoted in Beaver's book (you know, the substandard one with the pretty color photos) your uniform shown is a "textbook" piece. I am still searching for the same regulation (quoted in Beaver's book) in Mollo's book but cannot find it.
Fran
fran@thethirdreichemporium.com
(Always looking for NICE German WWII Visors, Imperial/Third Reich Medal Bars & Excellent or better Silver Wound Badges)
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#52493
01/08/2006 03:18 PM
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 492
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OP
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 492 |
"I do not think this forum the place to discuss the Waffen-SS or Allgemeine-SS role in the holocaust or in the running and administration of the camps."
I think Ryan brings up a very valid point here. There is another section of this site entitled "Period History Forum". I would suggest that when issues like this arise, and they most certainly will, that the moderators or owners would be better served by just moving the posts to the relevant section. Other forums successfully practice this, leaving a marker that indicates that the post or thread was moved to the correct venue.
Derek
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#52494
01/08/2006 03:35 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Pablo, I think you said it very well. This hobby is not for the faint of heart. No war collecting ever is. I don't collect VietNam stuff because I lived thru it and know all I need to know. It is history to some, but reality (too much of it) to others. I think folks need to just not take bait laid right in front of them...we surely are not children here. I am not bailing no matter how hot the kitchen gets! Jerks will always be jerks, the calm man prevails in the long run. Mark 
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#52495
01/08/2006 05:58 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 436
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 436 |
The thread in question had to be one of the more civilized discussions on this topic I have seen that ended up getting locked. Maybe it was a preemptive locking, but certainly all involved kept a reasonably civil tongue. The drama in which the two parties who have threatened to leave almost makes me want to vomit. I love reading both of their informative posts, on a variety of topics, on many different forums, but if you are going to leave, just leave, do not turn it into some sickening drama with various people begging you/kissing your butts to stay.
Almost very person who is involved in the forums makes a contibution of one sort or another and to see (almost) anyone go is a bad thing. In the particular thread in discussion the reasoning behind the two alleged departures escapes me for really there was no reason to go.
This particular forum is the SS forum...by default it is either the most loved or hated of militaria collectibles. I have a Math/Computer/Engineering background. For me (generally) things are black and white, have to fit into a defined category, have to make sense. With the SS it is not black and white, it is VERY gray and it would not be truthful or correct, in a lot of cases to place everything into the bottle that Allied propaganda and the Nuremburg trials has laid out for us...it just can't be for there are too many inconsistencies for it to logically work.
95%+ of us here are well above drinking age. I would guess well over half of us have served their counties. Most of us are educated and somewhat well-read about this topic...
And you are going to tell me we cannot discuss this like adults, without picking up our ball and going home? If you cannot, maybe it is a good thing to leave.
One man's opinion.
Fran
fran@thethirdreichemporium.com
(Always looking for NICE German WWII Visors, Imperial/Third Reich Medal Bars & Excellent or better Silver Wound Badges)
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#52496
01/08/2006 08:11 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,504
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,504 |
Fran you are one of the reasons I dont like posting here any longer. What if anything have YOU ever contributed to this or any other forum ? Nothing except rebuttle views and challenges that are done with the arogance of a real Mr.Knowitall and the occaisional "I need an opinion" thread, But tell us all what have you shared of any value to the collector.I can tell you,youve shared nill, nada, nothing.But you use your arrogant manner to stir the pot on any occaision you can do so.As I said before I remember "The Third Reich Emporium" from before this forum took off and am quite sure everything you know was learned here on these forums and others.Thats all I will add.Too bad because you drove away a real scholar who was a benefit to us all and in doing so Im afraid I must show my support and respect for him by trying to refrain from posting here any longer. No doubt you will come up with some sharp tongued smart aleck reply, Ill leave it to others to judge your character by it.Personally Ive never met you,but this is not the first time youve stirred a pot.  
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#52497
01/08/2006 08:44 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 436
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 436 |
quote: Originally posted by JohnPic79: Fran you are one of the reasons I dont like posting here any longer. What if anything have YOU ever contributed to this or any other forum ? Nothing except rebuttle views and challenges that are done with the arogance of a real Mr.Knowitall and the occaisional "I need an opinion" thread, But tell us all what have you shared of any value to the collector.I can tell you,youve shared nill, nada, nothing.But you use your arrogant manner to stir the pot on any occaision you can do so.As I said before I remember "The Third Reich Emporium" from before this forum took off and am quite sure everything you know was learned here on these forums and others.Thats all I will add.Too bad because you drove away a real scholar who was a benefit to us all and in doing so Im afraid I must show my support and respect for him by trying to refrain from posting here any longer. No doubt you will come up with some sharp tongued smart aleck reply, Ill leave it to others to judge your character by it.Personally Ive never met you,but this is not the first time youve stirred a pot.
I thought you had left...again. Adios.
Fran
fran@thethirdreichemporium.com
(Always looking for NICE German WWII Visors, Imperial/Third Reich Medal Bars & Excellent or better Silver Wound Badges)
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#52498
01/08/2006 09:34 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,064
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,064 |
Its been a very sad weekend,,,,,,,,,,,,, 
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#52499
01/08/2006 10:45 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 436
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 436 |
quote: Originally posted by fknorr: quote: Originally posted by JohnPic79: Fran you are one of the reasons I dont like posting here any longer. What if anything have YOU ever contributed to this or any other forum ? Nothing except rebuttle views and challenges that are done with the arogance of a real Mr.Knowitall and the occaisional "I need an opinion" thread, But tell us all what have you shared of any value to the collector.I can tell you,youve shared nill, nada, nothing.But you use your arrogant manner to stir the pot on any occaision you can do so.As I said before I remember "The Third Reich Emporium" from before this forum took off and am quite sure everything you know was learned here on these forums and others.Thats all I will add.Too bad because you drove away a real scholar who was a benefit to us all and in doing so Im afraid I must show my support and respect for him by trying to refrain from posting here any longer. No doubt you will come up with some sharp tongued smart aleck reply, Ill leave it to others to judge your character by it.Personally Ive never met you,but this is not the first time youve stirred a pot.
I thought you had left...again. Nothing but attacks, I see you are adding a lot here as well. Adios.
Fran
fran@thethirdreichemporium.com
(Always looking for NICE German WWII Visors, Imperial/Third Reich Medal Bars & Excellent or better Silver Wound Badges)
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#52500
01/08/2006 10:55 PM
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,537
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,537 |
It is sad that those who cause the most commotion on the Forums also add the least in a positive manner. The Uniform Forum
was intended to discuss uniforms, not morality. The last round of these forms of insults and pompous behavior drove a great majority of the serious collectors away from this site. Please add my name to that of Donald and John who have decided to exodus. Instead of locking the thread, I believe a positive move by the owner of this site would have been to direct the trouble makers to cool their retoric or go some where else. Adieu!
Bob
"A man needs to know his limitations" Dirty Harry
Gold Badge #263
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#52501
01/08/2006 11:56 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 567
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 567 |
It's sad to see everyone arguing amongst each other. I don't know what the answer is, but I sure hope we all find it soon - I really enjoy this Forum of all miltaria Forums the most! So much knowledge being locked away because of hurt feelings and sensitive egos. I really hate to see it happening . . .
Brad
The happiest people don't necessarily have the best of everything; they just make the best of everything they have . . . .
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#52502
01/09/2006 12:44 AM
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,528
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,528 |
I'm failing to see what the big problem is. I saw nothing all that bad of what Fran posted? I think that people are taking this all way to seriously. I think everyone should go relax, and have a beer. I know I am! 
Tim
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#52503
01/09/2006 12:45 AM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,976 Likes: 33
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,976 Likes: 33 |
Here's a thought. People being people and men being, well men we all have egos and are full of bravado. I have been accused on more than one occasion of adding fuel to the fire but that was never(or seldom) my intention. As my wife puts it, I was just being a man! This topic has already gone on too long and is beginning to deteriorate into a possible insult slinging match. I think that it is time to create the Neanderthal forum for those who wish to vent, argue, insult (lightly)and engage in acts of false bravado. Heck I might even visit that one myself on the odd occassion. Rules being: no profanity, no threats of physical harm, no hints of illegal actions or activity, Now maybe I'm serious and maybe I'm not. Might just fill a need. C'mon guys it is 2006, where the hell are those resolutions?!!!! When I was a child I acted as a child. Now is the time to put away childish things. Time to grow up gents. If I appear condescending I didn't intend to be. I could still mature a tad myself. cheers to all, oh and by the way...I'm still not leaving!!! Ryan
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#52504
01/09/2006 12:48 AM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,976 Likes: 33
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,976 Likes: 33 |
Oh yeah, Stephen...Nice touch. Are those actual tears in their eyes? cheers, Ryan
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