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#348979 03/30/2021 05:00 PM
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den70 Offline OP
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Gentlemen, I propose not to litter the main topic, but create a separate one in which we can add copies and discuss them. I have some files. I think it will be useful not only to publish photos, but to briefly explain the apparent reasons. We will not post a deeper analysis for open access. But if you do not indicate the visible differences, some visitors may consider that we are denigrating items for some personal reason.

In this thread, I propose to add both SA and SS daggers. I think there are not so many good fakes to make different topics.


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den70 Offline OP
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This is probably the simplest copy. Wrong manufacturer. And the type of TM that was not used on this type of cold steel.


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den70 Offline OP
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The next copy is no less simple. The same mistake of scammers, wrong manufacturer and eagle in the hilt.

photo_2021-03-30_20-09-03.jpg (79.69 KB, 311 downloads)
photo_2021-03-30_20-09-23.jpg (67.4 KB, 312 downloads)
photo_2021-03-30_20-09-41.jpg (32.38 KB, 311 downloads)
photo_2021-03-30_20-09-26.jpg (117.43 KB, 312 downloads)

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den70 Offline OP
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I think such an object should pull, if not on Rem's dagger, then on his adjutants. Chain Christmas dagger. It's good that the manufacturer was not confused. But they made many small nuances that cannot be on this dagger. This certainly does not apply to the chain.

photo_2021-03-30_20-16-49.jpg (33 KB, 313 downloads)
SMALL_A_2_166.JPG (135.29 KB, 312 downloads)
SMALL_A_2_167.JPG (129.56 KB, 313 downloads)
SMALL_A_2_169.JPG (121.5 KB, 312 downloads)

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den70 Offline OP
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This is a fairly rare fake, as it mainly copies the daggers of Eichhorn. But it is so crude that you can immediately see it is a copy.

photo_2021-03-30_20-23-36.jpg (159.61 KB, 315 downloads)
photo_2021-03-30_20-23-40.jpg (127.41 KB, 313 downloads)
photo_2021-03-30_20-23-28.jpg (148.11 KB, 312 downloads)

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den70 Offline OP
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Another dagger made for Pak. It's good that again it is so rude and of poor quality.

image_3399979.jpg (105.61 KB, 307 downloads)
121212121.jpg (69.36 KB, 308 downloads)
image_3399994.jpg (62.34 KB, 307 downloads)
image_3399966.jpg (62.37 KB, 307 downloads)

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den70 Offline OP
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Now there are better quality fakes. It will be much more difficult for a novice collector to distinguish them. But the scammers made some mistakes.

image_4913240.jpg (64.6 KB, 307 downloads)
image_4913249.jpg (77.03 KB, 310 downloads)
image_4913251.jpg (66.41 KB, 307 downloads)

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den70 Offline OP
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Another Eckhorn. Also a high-quality craft, but little things also give it out. Especially the internal ones.

Last edited by den70; 03/30/2021 05:36 PM.

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den70 Offline OP
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In my opinion, this is one of the best fakes. Perhaps you will show others and there will be something better among them.

photo_2021-03-30_20-41-57.jpg (50.85 KB, 303 downloads)
photo_2021-03-30_20-41-51.jpg (26.72 KB, 304 downloads)
photo_2021-03-30_20-42-01.jpg (77.7 KB, 303 downloads)
photo_2021-03-30_20-42-07.jpg (58.07 KB, 303 downloads)

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Hi Den,

That is real great pictorial information that you posted, here!
Many thanks for your efforts!

It clearly illustrates that it took the fakers quite some time, before they got the eagle right!

Unfortunately, that is now history...

Best regards,

Herman


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Yes, Thanks Den

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Interesting to note that many of the fake Prototypes have that "heart-chested pelican"

121212121.jpg (19.85 KB, 327 downloads)
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Den, Excellent pictorial presentation on what I call the 'East Block Christmas Fakes'.

Primary proof the fakers keep improving on their product as time goes by.

-Serge

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den70 Offline OP
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We continue to publish fakes. Unfortunately, not all photos are of good quality or large size. But so far, the scammers have failed to achieve a good result. Another Pack. This one is much better, but we still bring out this copy.

SMALL_A_208.jpg (102.56 KB, 254 downloads)

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den70 Offline OP
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Another fake Eick, with laser etching.

1ц1.jpg (83.06 KB, 249 downloads)

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Very interesting pictures, Den! Thanks!

You are right, that last Pack starts to look dangerous, except for the eagle...

Best regards,

Herman


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Here are some more

Grip.jpg (21.94 KB, 218 downloads)
DSCF0030.JPG (29.91 KB, 219 downloads)
Both Grips.jpg (64.45 KB, 218 downloads)
Dagger 2.jpg (137.54 KB, 218 downloads)
Eickhorn Front.jpg (102.82 KB, 218 downloads)
Selh fake dagger.jpg (43.51 KB, 218 downloads)
Selh Eagle blurred 2.jpg (37.15 KB, 218 downloads)
IMG_0448.JPG (79.06 KB, 218 downloads)
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What an amazing variety of fake eagles and Christmas daggers!
There must be about 100 fakes for each original Christmas dagger around!

It also explains why so many original parts, lose SA blades and SA grips, are offered for sale...

Best regards,

Herman


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Add these Pre-Production eagles wink grin

Eagle lapel pins - small.jpg (60.66 KB, 190 downloads)
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E
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Wow, this has been really interesting.
Seems like there is a endless supply of parts for such a rare dagger.
But what do I know.
Ed

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You are right, Ed.

The starting point is an SA dagger and those are in free supply in any condition you want. Stickpins also easy to find. A laser done blade is harder to find, I'd guess, but not too hard.

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one of my personal fav's

514abdafdd63684193c98f10f0553ba3d.jpg (89.02 KB, 199 downloads)

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description from the seller:
Use of original parts and use of old tools.

This type was issued in only a few numbers (so-called Christmas dagger 1933). Contemporaries. Originals are in the intern. Military market (Max-Show) in the high four-digit range traded. Orig. heavy nickel silver fittings with manufacturer "H" and Abn. "S" and matriculation "3". Original blade blank Forged steel with forge mark "A18", old oxide. Angel (eagle) - this one worked up after 45 and so finished

1be367e69a1f22a9be6711600f3dc7b83.jpg (63.38 KB, 198 downloads)

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Thanks, Sturm,

Looks like they ruined a good EP&S.

Dave

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den70 Offline OP
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Thank sturmbrigade, for showing this copy. Blades for Christmas dagger are sold separately on ebee.

Dave, I'm not sure if this is a corrupted original dagger. In my opinion this is a completely new-made item. In addition to laser etching, you can see the wrong brand on tang instead of SAN - OAN

s-l1600 cris.jpg (109.33 KB, 183 downloads)
s-l1600 crist.jpg (135.93 KB, 183 downloads)
s-l1600.jpg (118.91 KB, 183 downloads)
s-l1600 crismas.jpg (132.91 KB, 183 downloads)

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Nice mistake on the tang mark, close but not cigar.


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Here be cautious about sales now in the UK

Regards

1.jpg (152.38 KB, 103 downloads)
2.jpg (240.57 KB, 103 downloads)
3.jpg (100.16 KB, 103 downloads)
b4a2ed42-4ef9-4754-9b64-b052011d176d.jpg (82.63 KB, 103 downloads)
c3d75306-9b63-43e3-b507-b07000ae1c63.jpg (75.22 KB, 103 downloads)
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That's awful hopefully it won't catch anyone out as its so badly made


Regards Sean
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I think the eagle looks like a pelican.

Thanks for posting, Piper. I try to keep track of these and they do keep trying but as seany says, this one is way off.

Dave

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I agree, easy to spot one!

Unfortunately there are more sophisticate ones...

Herman


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The eagle is usually the first give-away. This is the best fake eagle I have seen.

Look closely and maybe save this image.

Dave

SA1b.jpg (30.05 KB, 94 downloads)
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Excellent reference material, Dave!

Thanks!


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Great shot Dave


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I think of these as "Prototype SA Daggers in Waiting"

grin grin whistle

Eagle lapel pins - small.jpg (60.66 KB, 38 downloads)

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