UBB.threads Forums Uniform & Accessories The Honor Ring Forum Skull ring

I have been given the opportunity to buy this skull ring that has West on one side and Front on the other. The ring is marked 835 F on the inside. I have the ring in my possession so I can take more pictures. let me know what you think. Thanks, Mark

Certainly a known pattern although very worn. Most of the rings like this that I have seen say West Wall but I also have one marked West Front. Hard to say more from these photos although the band looks suspiciously thick to me. Most kantine rings have quite thin bands, partly due to wear and partly because many were made that way when silver shortages hit WW2 Germany.

Thanks SpitfireVb. It is a thin ring and wanted to zoom in and show the marking. Here is another shot of the ring showing the thin band that someone snapped and reshaped to fit a smaller finger.

Here is some close up pictures. Sorry for the poor quality and will try to take better ones later on today.

Here is some more close up pictures. Sorry for the poor quality and will try to take better ones later on today.

hi ritterkreuz
just looked at your large skull west front ring and this is my honest experence with this ring in my opinion after over fifty years and a big collection of original third reich rings including my ss honor rings your ring has the combat wear that should be shown and is marked properly corect great to see real third reich rings again i would give your ring thumbs up atleast 1,000 percent real i see no red flags at all thank you for showing this combat worn large skull ring god bless happy easter andy militarynut

I agree with Andy, now that I see the nicely thin band. Congratulations!

Thin band and even towards the rear is usually a good sign. Hard to see inside but I think this ring shows a lot of promise. Yet to get one of these- nice catch!

Mark (Ritterkreuz),

If you scroll through the amazing Westwallrings thread pinned above, you will find a large selection of West Wall/West Front Rings, including (on p.6) a nice clean example of the one you posted here. It belonged to our departed friend, Odal. Here is a link to that page:
http://phpstack-500133-1583587.cloudwaysapps.com/~germand2/ubbthreads.php/topics/181289/6.html

I posted a few rings on the WW Ring thread (see p.52). Enjoy.
http://phpstack-500133-1583587.cloudwaysapps.com/~germand2/ubbthreads.php/topics/181289/52.html

I have a similar ring to the one posted here. If folks are interested, I will post some pics when I have time.

Cheers,

Stephen

We would love to see the pics Steven!

Thanks for all the great opinions on the ring and I am going to proceed in the purchase. Would like to get a few more in the future but these scare me more then a SS helmet.

I have come to realize that it is not that hard actually- its just that the long-standing culture of fear mongering as the method of instruction turns people off the collecting of these things altogether. With anything once you know the hallmarks and patterns of the originals- almost all of the fakes are actually not too difficult to spot. There are a few- rare patterns, deeply aged and believable early reproductions, first copies, etc that require a more detailed inspection, and the hopefully trusted opinions of the handful of folks that have actually seen those before. Like any niche, the believability and trustworthiness of the experienced is critical to the survival of the hobby. They must be cautious not to scare new collectors away, and also writing a book helps a whole hell of a lot too. Granted, there are guys especially in the HR field who learned a little, crapped out a book, maybe changed their minds, but did no real good for collecting in general. That being said, the problem I see much more than that with rings is the persistence of shameless fraudsters who have no problem calling out everyone else just to pimp their fake crap rings as real, then steal from honest collectors who think they are buying a good ring. Again probably for no less than the third time in as many months-
The head of the field needs to write a book on these rings.
It has been long enough!

Well if you write a book I will buy the first copy Mike.

LOL if I was the man it would have been done years ago, Mark! I am queuing up just like the rest of us. Its like waiting at a GnR concert for Axl and Slash to come on already...but seriously,. A 60
Plus year old hobby, no authoritative reference as of yet. Not talking about honor rings, just every other one ever collected. Anyone know of any good references yet made we can cite here?

But I have to admit- the GDC archived ring posts.... that?s the best reference that exists to date! A book or 3 would be a nice add though I think. Ok, 4 references to a book needed now- that?s plenty for April

What Mike said above;

" With anything once you know the hallmarks and patterns of the originals- almost all of the fakes are actually not too difficult to spot "

Is the secret of collecting TR artifacts .... and most other things too.

Dave

guys in the 40 years of collecting rings I have enough to do 2 books. One done already and a contact to print it... But it all means nothing..

This ring I show. A simple WW ring probably the most common of them at one time.. I can promise you this - It was never made in Silver. No adverts, no trade guilds, none in old collections, nothing.. Brass alloy with a silver wash period..
But this ring was posted on a European forum. I immediately said its a fake.. The response,,,'what the hell do I know.. I dug that ring just last week'..
There is enough faults to see without even better photos, even that it was not pressed. But they believed the digger and called for my head to the administrator!.

Check out any book on the Krim shield! The most ridiculous things ever in print. Variants of variants. Rare ,but a few made and I have one etc etc.

Dave,,daggers and rings are apples and oranges.. You have a ton of info on daggers. Actual specs!, they were only made one way!!!.. You have the 2 Toms that brought back actual pounds and pounds of parts. Books from Soligen etc.,,no, nothing like a ring friends.. And most rings were not required to be hallmarked during the 3rd reich!

I tell you now if any of you can think you can determine a original silver WB or GAB your just bragging.. 10 years ago in Warsaw 'My cousin Vinny' and I were in the factory that makes their awards. They were/are making perfect copies... I even got info for Don Bible to a place using a 10 ton press to make police discs! I paid the price by being thrown out on my head more than once... This is not brain surgery guys!!

IF things continue to go well and I can get the rest of my translations I will hand in the drive at the MAX to the publisher. I'm only do this out of respect for my friend who passed Goetz [Odal] and my living mentor and old friend Andy..
So you guys have a happy resurrection Sunday this Sunday and the rest of you the next Sunday!!

G - I agree, and the calling for your head elsewhere is the calling card of these dirt bags. Still, book one and book two need to be here. Even without the specs, that opinion lives on far longer than we do, and will have better eyes than ours looking at them. What I see here is a classic case of exactly as I mentioned above- they are attempting to discredit the expert the instant his opinion shows because it is a threat to their very existence. Of course they will hit hard and hit low. That is what fraudsters do! I still see no reason to avoid collecting out of a fear that frauds and fakes exist out there. What must be combatted is ignorance and fear- every time I have asked for a further thought or picture on a piece the sanitizing affect of the sunlight slinks these losers back to the shadows whence they came. Here is a simple tip for everyone- if they cannot or will not answer a basic question or respond with threats or silence, if they ask for upfront cash, if you do not know where on earth your package is coming from, or if they go home run on you and call their piece self authenticating or perhaps just insult you, tell them to take their rings and put them where the sanitizing affect of sunlight does not shine.

hi gaspre
thank you for you infomitive e mail on the makeing of third reich rings not an easy task i think back of what don boyle told me about author bender or the outher author of ss cloth who published many ss books on cloth etc don once putting all his hard work getting pictures documents from germany and many outher documents on the ss honor ring went to bender and said i would like to publish this book on himmler rings and the myths and stories around this rare ss honor rings told about this rare ss artifact bender told don he was waisting his time this book will never sell and i am not publishimng it well guess what don went to another publisher and this book still sells so gaspare take it from me all of us guys will buy your book we need a good learning book on this canteen rings private purchase rings some jeweler hand made especially made in france most in silver as far as the west wall rings west front rings just like dave n gaspare says they are brass with silver coating 100 percent on we still can keep an eye on these ring criminals makeing dyes etc ok guys if i missed anything please correct me and hope every body here has a great easter god bless all andy militarynut

Andy is right.

I don't collect rings and have only a few in my hands, Finnish, Norwegian and German-Norwegian, but I would definitely buy G's book.

John

Immense knowledge plus innovation and new efforts= Power. The kind that energizes the base of old collectors and inspires respect in the new. And exists in perpetuity for the future.
There are so many books written on gau badges and weird guns and microscope videos- tremendously innovative! Immense knowledge? Not so much...

these microscopes that plug in the laptops... I bought one last year.. $50,,not bad.. BUT,, when I took a flat pressed ring and examined it it just looks like a faults around the band!
.. And,,the more power used the worse it looked! So I thought experiment more.. Bought a cheapie 1923 class ring at flea market,,$35. [no 'gem' in it but Sterling].. Anyway,,seems a once a flat pressed band gets rounded all sorts of things come in to play,,micro crystalline shit this and structural shit that .. Cut the band,,let it expand slightly,,or any kind of bend in band and it will look like faults.. Guess for looking at enamel,,fine lines in the cartouche etc. they might come in to play..
I still say,,and with anything 3rd reich.. study the authentic stuff,,not the fakes,,**** the fakes,,we collect the real deal,,,and as one of our members says by his name,,,there's not as many authentics as it seems! Be careful guys,,always doubt,,, good photos a must,,you can always ask here,,make it scream its authentic to you or let someone else get it...,G.