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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69
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OP
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69 |
I am considering this dagger as first one and although I have read some I still look for leadership on fairly big purchase or considering a purchase I should say. Thank you for any suggestions in advance. I don't see a number on guard and the SS seems strange ?
d1.JPG (101.85 KB, 324 downloads) d2.JPG (92.7 KB, 332 downloads) d3.JPG (78.13 KB, 334 downloads) d4.JPG (108.19 KB, 334 downloads) d7.JPG (112.32 KB, 327 downloads)
Last edited by Devil's Metal; 03/09/2018 02:57 AM.
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Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 6,781 Likes: 38
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Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 6,781 Likes: 38 |
Interesting. I don't have Horster listed as a maker of SS daggers during the RZM period. I didn't find them in Wittmann's SS book.
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 257 Likes: 2
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Joined: May 2012
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It seems a nice SA dagger 😉
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Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 6,781 Likes: 38
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Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 6,781 Likes: 38 |
Need to put my glasses back on
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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69
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OP
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69 |
Wish I knew more or had time too. The round SS on it seems odd although I am no expert as not to say SS but SA compared to what I have seen and missing a number"1" or ? on the guard. I need to pull trigger is my guess as its an old timer and the price seems fair at what would be approx. $650 U.S although some chips on handle from what I guess was too tightened and the temp changes etc.
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,084 Likes: 96
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,084 Likes: 96 |
This is an SA dagger. They did NOT use "I" on the guards
Early SA mostly had one of several Gau marks, but this is a later vintage SA dagger and should have no marks or stamps on the crossguard.
DAve
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Joined: Aug 2017
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Joined: Aug 2017
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Hi, I'm no expert and learning all the time but this looks like a very nice condition RZM type SA ( Brown shirts/storm troopers) Dagger complete with its leather hanging strap and belt loop, I'm presuming the scabbard paint is original and not repainted but can't really tell from your pics if it is then it also seems to be in very nice condition as is the blade and logo, maker mark is - E&F Horster, Solingen - RZM code M7/36. the price of 650 usd seems a very good price indeed that's only ?469.25 British Pounds I would expect to pay around ?550 to ?650 in that condition with hanger and loop here in the UK
Last edited by AndyBurton; 03/09/2018 05:50 PM. Reason: missing text
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Joined: Aug 2017
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 128 |
That's weird when I add the British pound sign here - ? it looks ok in the reply box but comes up as a question mark when I post the reply.
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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69
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OP
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69 |
Thank you all very much and you are all very helpful. I am learning each day and for all I thought I knew I now know the SA and brown strange I was always drawn to the brown knives. Seems the price is fair although not a home run based on this new knowledge as the SA are not as collectible as the SS it seems. I agree the price is fair but, not all that much different than you mentioned in the U.K. Some further confidence I have is that the seller also has a SS binder with photos etc in it and a uniform. I thought this reinforced my question of authentic but, now why he has some SS items and then a SA knife or I am just over thinking as a buyer. I found several daggers of the Luftwaffe which I very much like the looks of and still pondering the direction I will go.
Last edited by Devil's Metal; 03/09/2018 09:05 PM.
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 77 Likes: 3
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Joined: Mar 2005
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Very nice conditioned SA for the price, complete with accouterments! Devil's Metal, I do believe you are overthinking things. The seller might have come across a nice SS grouping that he's selling. Just because he has a tunic (or uniform) and a photo album, it doesn't automatically mean he has the dagger as well. Looks like he just has a nice later period RZM SA dagger for sale. You mention its price is about the same in the UK as it is here? It's $200 cheaper than what a similar example goes for in the UK, plus it's complete with hanger and belt loop (that's almost another $200).
If you want to start collecting only SS items, that's fine. But SA's are definitely not less collectable, just less scarce than SS daggers. I own some of both and cannot tell you which ones are my favorite. They are all their own little piece of history... Some people become "type" collectors focusing on one organization, and others (like me) try to find the nicest and most interesting examples from all different edged weapons the TR produced, military and political...
But over time I'm sure you will find a lot of enjoyment in collecting, no matter what direction you choose. Good hunting!
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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69
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OP
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69 |
Very nice conditioned SA for the price, complete with accouterments! Devil's Metal, I do believe you are overthinking things. The seller might have come across a nice SS grouping that he's selling. Just because he has a tunic (or uniform) and a photo album, it doesn't automatically mean he has the dagger as well. Looks like he just has a nice later period RZM SA dagger for sale. You mention its price is about the same in the UK as it is here? It's $200 cheaper than what a similar example goes for in the UK, plus it's complete with hanger and belt loop (that's almost another $200).
If you want to start collecting only SS items, that's fine. But SA's are definitely not less collectable, just less scarce than SS daggers. I own some of both and cannot tell you which ones are my favorite. They are all their own little piece of history... Some people become "type" collectors focusing on one organization, and others (like me) try to find the nicest and most interesting examples from all different edged weapons the TR produced, military and political...
But over time I'm sure you will find a lot of enjoyment in collecting, no matter what direction you choose. Good hunting!
Unfortunately my personality tends to over think just about everything. I have missed opportunities galore in just about every aspect of life as I read way to far into it then its gone ! But, I am learning and seems every day now I find gem after gem which in itself causes me grief. Now I must make a decision of what direction to take as once again today I found another SA that appeals to me greatly but, locally I have found a very nice army dagger that has also caught my attention and I can actually go physically see it as opposed to across the country. Once again I cannot thank all the contributors here for offering to me their most precious commodity their time and for that I am grateful.
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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69
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OP
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69 |
In the end this one sold for $630 US and I missed out due to my over thinking again.
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,084 Likes: 96
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,084 Likes: 96 |
You did not miss much, Dev. RZM SA daggers are not in short supply.
Consider looking for an earlier maker-marked dagger SA dagger.
Dave
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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69
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OP
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 69 |
You did not miss much, Dev. RZM SA daggers are not in short supply.
Consider looking for an earlier maker-marked dagger SA dagger.
Dave Thanks for the advice Dave, I am going to go back to the other earlier model F.Dick and see if we can work out a deal.
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Overthinking isn't necessarily a bad thing, especially when handing over considerable amounts of money.
I'm a bit like you, so what I've done is taken as many detailed notes as I can, plus I keep a 'database' of images that I can refer to. This allows me to make a checklist of things to look for, and I'll base my judgment on that checklist.
I also like to apply that checklist to these forums when someone asks whether an item is good or not (before I read other peoples responses). Once I've come to a decision, I'll start reading the responses and see if my decision was right or wrong.
Also, if I see even one red flag that stands out, it just becomes an outright "no" for me.
They say that all collectors make the mistake of buying at least one or two fakes, so if you do, don't beat yourself up over it, take it on the chin and learn from it. :-)
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