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#319032 06/03/2016 03:21 AM
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I got my first SS dagger today. Got it for
$1800 out of a small town in southern ontario canada. Its an early Klaas made m33 dagger.
Its got the Anodized scabbard. Beautiful mirror finish klaas blade. Good condition grip with eagle and runes. The crossguard is my only issue. Its got a gau marking. Which i know SA daggers have gau markings. Ive seen postings about gau markings on ss daggers. Its got the "HO" marking. Which is the munich area. Which i know SS dagger district stamp I is munich. Im wondering if they just mis stamped this dagger. Or its a parts dagger?
Cheers

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Oh yes...ill add photos soon. And i find the fittings fit pretty well. The crossguards fit smoothly with the curves of the grip. Plus no gaps between the crossguards and the grip.

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heres 5 pictures right now

20160602_113948.jpg (114.88 KB, 319 downloads)
20160602_113959.jpg (112.09 KB, 320 downloads)
20160602_083113.jpg (69.06 KB, 319 downloads)
20160602_114014.jpg (111.96 KB, 318 downloads)
20160602_114155.jpg (84 KB, 318 downloads)
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another 2 photos. any help would be fantastic!

20160602_114056.jpg (120.83 KB, 319 downloads)
20160602_114116.jpg (112.28 KB, 317 downloads)
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as you can see the HO gau marking on the crossguard in an odd spot. seen them stamped in odd spots before thou.

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Hi nice early dagger I see nothing wrong with it I live in southern ontario....Lucky pick up I have seen this crosguard striking before so no issue on my end Nice Klass cheers, Ryan

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Thanks ryan! I think its fine too. But just checking.

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Not for me. The lower crossguard doesn't belong to this Klaas dagger.
Most of the early daggers, and definitely Klaas, always had districtmarkings on the back of the lower crossguard.
A roman number I,II or III.
The stamped 'Ho' what you see is on a crossguard that belonged to an SA-dagger! So, partsdagger...
That would be then the reason why the fitting grip/lower crossguard isn't perfect as you would expect on early SS-daggers.
The SS-runesbutton also isn't the type that Klaas used on his daggers. So, grip also possible not belonged to this dagger/blade.
The blade also looks like it was cleaned at some point...
Offcourse that is my opinion.
The dagger just wouldn't do it for me as I expect perfection
on the daggers that I buy.

Last edited by Krikke; 06/03/2016 10:15 PM.
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I was wondering how long it would take for someone to realize that the "Ho" on the guard meant it was an SA crossguard.

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Thats what i said that HO was on an SA crossguard. Thats not any news to me. But paul from LST and wittmann and may others agree that SS daggers had gau markings from time to time. Plus ive seen early klass runes that were not the typical ss runes of a klass. Right now wittmann has one for sale. And if your take a look at the ss runes quiz in this forum. It has Klass ss runes that were different from the normal fatter runes normally seen. I dont believe in the text book "has to be" this type or its a parts dagger answer. But thanks krikee

Last edited by waffenman; 06/04/2016 12:52 AM.
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http://www.wwiidaggers.com/37758.htm

Heres wittmanns klass ss dagger thats has a chained scabbard. Apparently soldiers used there old ss daggers and used the chained scabbard when it became available.
This klaas has no district stamp on the crossguard and is maker marked klaas.
Same eagle and ss runes button as my klaas.

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Gau marked crossguards as seen from time to time on Chained SS daggers but NEVER on regular SS dagger, the so called M33.
You cannot compare your dagger with a Gau marked SS chained, it ain't the same thing.
Definitively a part dagger and as such, much less desirable than a proper textbook dagger.

Last edited by Patrice; 06/04/2016 11:42 AM.
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thanks pat,
its just wierd that DAVE posted about the HO gau marking....but heres a copy and paste from a post on gau markings on ss daggers

M33 daggers with gau marks exist. See page 27 of Tom Wittmann's SS book.

Dave

wierd!!!! lol

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Even if the crossguards have been changed
I paid 1800 USD for it. Im happy
Cheers

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as I said I have seen SA marked crossguards before on SS daggers Dave and Krikee it happens, as per the two Toms and others...if you have been around enough you will have seen everything notice how the Ho is almost at the end of the lower fitting. The dagger is legit, is it a parts dagger? possibly but a closer inspection is need... you learn something new everyday cheers to all, Ryan

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thanks ryan!
well like i said. The "HO" marking is the district of "Munich". So I was wondering if they mis-marked it possibly..... I mean anything is possible...could of been a friday and the district stamper said "im done!" and just stamped it with the wrong stamp... "HO" on SA crossguards And the roman numeral I on SS crossguards are both Munich... So same district.. And as Dave said on an earlier post "That M33 ss daggers with gau markings do exist....look at page 27 in wittmanns SS book.
Im just curious to what people say. I know its not text book, and it most likely will bring down the value. But the fittings fit pretty well if you ask me. Am I wrong? And most parts daggers the crossguards are way off and noticely dont fit well at all. Just my opinion
cheers

Last edited by waffenman; 06/05/2016 05:02 AM.
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look at the fittings? is it that bad?

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Originally Posted By: waffenman
Thats what i said that HO was on an SA crossguard. Thats not any news to me. But paul from LST and wittmann and may others agree that SS daggers had gau markings from time to time. Plus ive seen early klass runes that were not the typical ss runes of a klass. Right now wittmann has one for sale. And if your take a look at the ss runes quiz in this forum. It has Klass ss runes that were different from the normal fatter runes normally seen. I dont believe in the text book "has to be" this type or its a parts dagger answer. But thanks krikee



Last edited by Dave; 06/05/2016 06:51 PM. Reason: Insults
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********************

Last edited by Dave; 06/05/2016 06:49 PM. Reason: insults
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Well krikke

****

Last edited by Dave; 06/05/2016 06:50 PM. Reason: Insults
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Sorry dave,
He was getting too me. I apologize.

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Krikke and waffenman,

If you wish to remain members of GDC you should re-read our rules. There is a link at the bottom left of each page. This is the key part.

"Be friendly, polite, positive, and helpful. .... Please do not make posts that are calculated to make others angry, damage their reputation, or start arguments.

Dave
dave@germandaggers.com

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Sorry dave,
I wasn't trying to insult anyone

I was just trying to get some peoples perspective on the gau marking. And krikee got very negative very fast.
Sorry again
Cheers

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I know there are exceptions but IMO its always best to buy standard configurations not only for peace of mind but also if you want to resell. To me this dagger looks like it has a Boker grip, SA cross guards and a Klaas blade. The lower grip/cross guard fit looks off to me and the stress damage on the upper grip/cross guard fit could be due to the mismatch. Too many questions here IMO.

Last edited by Fitzer; 06/05/2016 09:52 PM.
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words we should ALL follow cheers

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Thanks fitzer
Yes i agree...i thought the same thing with the grip. Looks like a boker. Its just when i saw more klaas early daggers with the same grip. I wondered..mmm not sure. Because tom has one for sale. And a guys grand father was an MP in ww2 and had a klaas that had the same grip. So i was still wondering...mmmm
Thanks everyone
Cheers

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A few points I would like to make based on my experience:

Many early SS daggers had the I, II, or III marks stamped on the rear of their lower guards. Many did not. I have owned three Klass daggers and none were marked. Also, The rarer the dagger, the less likely it is to have the marks. Why? no one knows. One theory was that it made for extra work but added nothing that helped accountability so that the practice was discontinued early on.

The TW Klass in a chained scabbard linked in a post above is a ground Rohm blade that has no district mark. I own an Eickhorn Rohm dagger with the "I" mark. I have never seen a Himmler dagger with a district mark ... but I am sure that by later tonight 2 or 3 will be posted here.

Gau marks on SS chained daggers? They pop up now and then and this has been known for a long time. I have never heard of a reason that made much sense. If you have one that does, lets hear it !!

Gau marks on early maker marked daggers? As shown on page 27 of TW's book. I own that dagger. I bought it because it was the only early SS Puma dagger known. Another later turned up. I bought the dagger with full knowledge of the anomaly. I have had it apart and see no signs of fiddling. Whether it left the factory that way ... I think so but who knows?

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Thanks dave!
I was hoping you would reply! Thanks for your knowledge.
Its my first ss dagger. And it sleeps with me in my bed every night haha. So if its not text book. Im fine with that. And i know it will be valued less. Thats cool with me too. Because i dont want to sell it. Its crossguards are most likely SA crossguards. But still seems to fit pretty well. I mean i spent $1800 on it. Not $4000.
So at the end of the day. The grips in good condition. And the blade ( cleaned i know ) is fantastic. The scabbard is nice! Thanks again every one. If i do buy another ss dagger it will be text book. But just happy to have an early SS dagger with questionable guards
Cheers

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I believe that there is an identical Klass SS dagger posted for sale in Ottawa on Kijiji.ca just saw it today is it the same dagger? Priced at $2800.00 as textbook cheers, Ryan

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Correct! Even uses the same pictures.

Sad story

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Here is his description:

I have a early made German authentic SS M33 dagger made by Robert Klaas.
- early made dagger made between 1933-1935. Not an later made RZM dagger.
- beautiful mirror finish blade and acid etching. amazing shape!
has beautiful Robert Klaas kissing swans maker stamp.
- great handle thats in good shape. usually these handles are prone to chipping and cracks and flaking. But this one has no cracks or chips. a tiny bit of flaking but very little which is rare for SS handle grips.
- early made anodized ( blued ) scabbard in great shape as well.
- SS runes and eagle are beautifully set in the handle.
any questions just ask

im will send photos no problem if you need more
will deliver in the ottawa region and will ship country wide
cheers!

********

Not a mention of the bad crossguard or the big chip re-glued you can see on the lower left of the lower left of the lower guard. Or the cleaned blade.

If anyone belongs to that site, please report the item.

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How is this a sad story?

I bought it for 1800 usd so for 2800 cad
And i never posted that its textbook on kijiji
So mind your business

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And why would you report the item dave?
How does this dagger effect you or anyone?
Dave has nothing else better to do but snoop around. Get a hobby!

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And you can ******** my balls! Your all masterbating on your daggers as we speak because you all have no lives! Oh no! Someone is selling a dagger on kijiji we dont like! Call dave the loser of the bunch!! He has nothing to do any ways! Hahaha

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Well, Mr. Bowyer, ...or Todd, if you prefer, ...

You failed to mention that the blade has been seriously cleaned, the grip has a re-attached piece on the front and that the lower crossguard is not from an SS dagger.

Besides that, I wanted to say that your three posts above are pretty entertaining and they put you in the running for an award or two.

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Thanks!! I liked it myself! Lol And 2800 which is a starting price ( and anyone can negotiate) canadian (2150 usd) isnt a crazy amount for an ss dagger with some issues. Seen some ss daggers on LST And wittmanns site for a lot of money for daggers with huge chunks out of the handle. And blades that are quite salty! And even parts daggers that are advertised. So have fun picking on the new guy.

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http://www.wwiidaggers.com/38495.htm

This ones 1900 usd and the runes are facing the wrong way! And the blades missing a quater inch and has been re-tipped. Lets call the police and report this horrible horrible crime against humanity! God bless us all and better start buying drums of water! Its coming to an end! Lol

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Well, I hope it finds another warm bed to sleep in smile

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She was a bit of a slut! Lol but i will always remince about the good old days we had

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i changed my kijiji ad so everyone can sleep better tonight! god bless!!!!

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