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Joined: Sep 2013
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Good subject. Houston Coates had some choice stuff like the cuffs and other police items at the Tn. Military Show last Thanksgiving. A really nice Kripo disc.
I bought a beautiful Japanese officer sword with original wooden scabbard, covered in leather for military use from Houston at the show.


Mark

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Here's a couple tough customers.... Btw both are for sale or trade pm please if interested!

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Mike,
,the tonfa wood?
,and the club a hard rubber?? What is the clubs length?

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The tonfa is a monadnock p-24 s side handled baton, 24 inches in length... Made of a hard black molded plastic or rubber- about 3-3.5 lb I'd guess.., the club is a deep blue hard composite either a plastic or a rubber, with a black rubber washer- prob 4 lb or so, original leather carrying strap with it/ about 20 inches. These batons have seen real use!

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Love this one- about 10 inches I'd guess... Nice old wooden tire thumper... Also posting for sale soon! Heavy, lead filled baton with original carrying strap.., prob about 3.5-4 lb at least. It's a shot caller that's for sure!!!

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Oh man! Forgot to mention the come-alongs! Nice old set..

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nice Mike!! Yeah that sure looks like it was drilled out, filled [prob with lead] and a wood plug in it...
You know I hear all the time,,'those are for fish' , 'Those are for tires'..
Tire and fish clubs usually a bit longer..
- any markings on the club or the come-a-long?

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Markings? Well I'm not sure it's got something under the lacquer but I can't make it out- and like a North Star like pattern on the "pommel".., on the shaft is red and black markings maybe it was someone's name?

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pretty sure the marks at the end is from the wood lathe chuck that held it..
That side peg is interesting. Does it go thru to other side?

Are the handles of the c-a-l aluminum or steel?

Last edited by Gaspare; 06/26/2016 01:34 PM.
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Yeah I couldn't get a good shot of the markings man regardless they were pretty worn.. Yep the other side has the "peg" as well- looks like same color material (wood putty?) as top and bottom,.,come a longs I will pull out and check I never really looked! Just thought they were cool and tossed them in the box lol!

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wonder what the side plug is for?

The handle material will help you date them. IF aluminum they are most likely postwar.

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No idea on the side plugs- maybe more weight added? It's heavy as heck. I looked at the come a longs I think it's steel or another metal- too heavy for aluminum- but maybe something else? Didn't see any clear markings but will look again!

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try a magnet.........

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Ahh of course! Yes will do-

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had a forum member contact me out of the blue and ask if I'd be interested in a 'paperweight'! grin

Of course I was and we did a interesting trade for a 'Sapper Glove' and a beautiful old Aluminum knuckles:

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they are a nice size and fit even my big hands!

Coming at ya!

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Also,, from my collection but haven't shown until now..

These are steel knuckles. They were ground / pick up in Germany in 1946... Don't know if they are Allied or Axis.

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little beat up, but they have character!
Nice knucks, good size and still can get the work done..

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I received this piece in a trade..

Not sure of time period. It is only the right one. I've heard that sometimes only one was issued. This could be calfs skin or deers. Very soft, smooth, yet strong. Called a 'Sappers' glove. From what I can gather this is pretty old. Maybe WW1, or 20s,,or [?]
anyway, enjoy the photos.

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Not sure what is sewn in to the knuckle area,,maybe lead powder, or steel filings.

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This is not the thing you want to get hit in the face with!

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Ain't that the truth! I would have guessed it for interrogation but I don't think that after a hit or two with this u can say much or are even conscious! Body shots would also be devestating- just as lethal in certain areas! Where did u find this G?

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Byz.,,, A forum member noticed this topic and contacted me to see if I would be interested in the Glove and the Aluminum Knuckles!
A little cash, some trade items and we were both happy..

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Hello,
Here's an item I picked up a number of years ago. The girl I got it from said it was her grandfather's who had been a policeman. Don't know anything about it other than that. I would think it's from the 30's or 40's but really have no idea. I also have a nightstick or two somewhere around here. The one item I wish I still had but it's been lost to the ages was a small black hard rubber truncheon which if I remember correctly had NYPD markings on it. I had gotten it from one of my Uncles years ago.
thanks for looking
Duzig(Bill)

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Nice piece bill! Is it weighted (leaded/heavy?)

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- yeah that's a really nice one! , and in good condition too..

What is the length on it?

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Hello Byzanti and Gaspare,
It is weighted. Almost feels like the lower part of it is spring and the top is weighted. I paid five dollars for it a number of years ago. Yes it looks like it was never used. It is about 8 1/2 inches long. Am I correct in thinking that it might be from the 30's or 40's? Thanks again for your comments and info.
Bill

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Gaspare knows more than me about these, we're just both avid "tools" enthusiasts- but being unused is totally possible, and the leather is in great condition for the age- sure 30s or 40s imo is definitely possible, they just stopped making and using them later, but later isn't unheard of.... that being said I've seen near mint pieces from the 20s that look almost like this, heck we were looking at a spiked prison baton from the 19th century U.K. Last week with engraving and everything, it was in great shape so I think that this could have easily stood up to some years these were built for endurance and strength they aren't going to fall to pieces just like that but then let's see what G says but I like it bill
Nice piece man

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you know its weird,,,on ebay you can't sell knuckles,,,but' you can sell these!..
Bill,,that was a great price even back then.. You can pull up 'Vintage leather Blackjack' on eBay and you'd be surprised what these things can go for sometimes..

The style of these really haven't changed,,you'll see adverts! But,there is another completely different pattern. The flat version,,or 'Sap'..

Bill heres an old advert that shows some the same as yours. No date here but IF I remember right its from the 30s at least,,probably teens..

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Here;s an old ad showing the flat and round together..

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the flats are shown at the beginning of the topic too but figured I'd throw another on up..

I've seen some police uniforms that had a thin, narrow pocket made in to their pants either at the side of leg just right above the knee or one higher up by waist..

I spoke to a Policeman at the MAX . He said he was on a Texas police force and he was issued a flat one in the 60s! He said he loved it and it had hit many a elbow, shoulder, and head with his! It was a nice long, slim, flat one. I bought the story and the jack! wink

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I was just checking.. Looking at the ad I posted last page one of the rubber jacks have imprinted on it 'Metropolitan Police'!

I checked and the adverts are from the late 1800s!

So really if the blackjacks we own have been kept in good condition we really don't know what year they were made/from! Their styling really hasn't changed in over 100 years!

[cool knucks,,on my most wanted list!]

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Last edited by Gaspare; 10/02/2016 04:56 AM.
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Quite possibly the coolest set of knuckles I've ever seen- that's straight happy jack Mulraney gangs of New York right there dead to the year. Bet u those were issued the summer after the draft riots, and because of them!

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Hello
Byzanti, thanks for your info. The girl I got if from was around my age so I figured her grandfather would have been around the same age and era as mine so the 30's or 40's does make sense. That spiked prison baton sounds interesting, and deadly. Any pictures of that piece? Gaspare, thanks for those pictures and info. Mine does indeed look like the one's you show. Guess I did pretty good paying 5.00 bucks for it maybe 20 years ago or so. With the way laws are today a policeman would be in deep trouble if he used one of these on a suspect I bet eh.
Very interesting items you guys have, I think I'm gonna start keeping my eyes out for more items like these. Thanks again for all your help and knowledge. It is appreciated!
Bill

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I'll try to find those pix bill- and yes I do agree these are not standard issue today! The 19th century policing and fire fighting man that was rough work low pay (those things haven't really changed that much!) police and fire had to fight just to make it- not just the criminal element but other police depts and fire squads! NY had horrible overlap and mismanagement really just a mess of inefficient and ineffective systems by the mid 19th century- NY city cops fought the NY metro and borough police in all out brawls sometimes!! Fire squads were more like gangs in a lot of ways! generally speaking the police were used to just control the poor and working classes of the city- the idea of justice for the common man wasn't thru the police but maybe thru a gang or of course the mafia! Police work was for the tough guys who could handle the low pay etc- often newer immigrants that were kept out of other professions and opportunities! Andy militarynut also knows a lot abt ny policing too he identified an early leather police pistol belt slide that held maybe 20 bullets I think by just the contractors name! I think it was rosenblum but I forgot!

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Byzanti,
Would love to see those pics & thanks again for that information. I have seen a couple of documentaries on the history channel about that era and as you say, the NY police were fighting other police etc. If my memory serves me correct I thought I heard on one of these shows that out of the gangs came the fire departments more or less. Interesting period in history for sure. Lots of interesting history in New York.
thanks again
Bill

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was by my 'safe house'.. Had this case a long time and have had a bunch of different things in it...

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I know your all expecting a Tommygun,,,but they are a little scarce here in NY!! These,,guess they have some uses whistle

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Nice meathook

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Cool smile


My Name is Bob and I am a "RACE O HOLIC" AND "THE OLDER I GET THE FASTER I WAS"

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