UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons The BCN Bayonet Forum List of WKC marks and date ranges?

Hi Guys,

I've been searching for a chart or list that shows the various WKC maker marks and the date ranges each was used. Does anyone know where I could find such a list?

Thanks

Wittmann and Johnson books....Basic books for collecting

Tim,

Fisher's Quick Reference might be a start. They have a bunch of WKC maker marks shown although in my version (5th), they're not listed by years of use.

quote:

Originally posted by DAMAST:
Wittmann and Johnson books....Basic books for collecting

Thanks guys. I've looked at some of the Wittmann and Johnson books before and they seem to be focused on daggers, swords, presentation pieces, etc. My focus is on bayonets and fighting knives. I have several reference books for those, but none with detailed lists of maker marks with date ranges.

I've seen some of the nice post by Terry (TKissinger) where he showed maker marks and some of the CE marks and their date ranges. Do you know of a similar post covering WKC marks or a good book focused on bayonets (maybe a Wittmann or Johnson I missed) that have such lists?

Thanks again.

Tim:

Why not ask TKissinger or BillyG of the BCN forum on GDC for their notes and knowledge? If anyone would have these maker marks in use and an idea of their usage dates, it would be them.

John

Hi Tim,

WKC markings are not as straighforward as some makers, in my experience. The single knight's helm mark originally was registered to W.R. Kirschbaum & Cie. before the amalgamation with Weyersberg. So, the single helmet mark can date as early as 1862-1883.

After the founding of WK&C the two combined marks will be found of the knight's head and the king's head after 1883. The letters WK&C and WKC will be found with this dual logo. The logo later changed to just the knight's head but I don't know the patent date for this logo. Walter says the WKC Stahl-und Eisenwarenfabrik name was registered on 9 May 1930 until 1950 but that does not necessarily include the maker markings.

Not very helpful I am afraid but WKC seems to have used several markings concurrently, particularly just the knight's head or the knight's head with WKC below with no real timeline.

Bayonets are even more odd as S84/98 will be found with W.K.C. (Nazi) and W.u.K. (Weimar) as well as written out on earlier bayonets.

George

Hi George,

Thanks for the reply. I wish it were more straightforward, but it's seldom that easy. If it was, collectors would have less to talk about, and where's the fun in that? :-)

Tim

Hi Tim,

I've only got 2 WKC bayonets in my collection. First is the knighthead with WKC Solingen. This piece appears (at least to me) to be an earlier mark because of the better quality construction. Also, the crossguard is quite elongated which made me think this might have been a piece actually made by Eickhorn. I don't know that to be the case though. Nicely constructed piece though.

This is the more detailed knightshead with WKC. Notice the plume on the top of the helmet has lines as does the visor. Marks which are not on the other mark. Looks to me to be a later production piece from the weight & parts although as you can see, this one has crossgraining. I believe this is called a "natural" finish?

It's an interesting study of maker marks.
There is a decent reference in Johnson's "collecting the edged weapons of Imperial Germany" Vol I pgs 52-60. Taking the maker mark from 1883 side by side logo thru the Weimar period. Fisher shows the mark variations for various applications.
Billy, That's a rare Fire bayo. I can not remember seeing an unplated example... Ever.

Thanks guys.

Billy, that's a great unplated Fireman's bayonet! I have a Luft NCO that has great crossgrain. How common is it to find dress bayonets with crossgrain? This is the only one I have.

Closeup

This is what got me thinking about the WKC logos. Seems like a pretty straightforward WWI KS98. 3-rivets, T/O slot and oil clearing hole in the horn grips, cloth Prussian officer's knot, and plated blade and hilt. I love the "been there" look, if it could only talk.

Any comments on it? Are any WWI KS98's considered "issue" pieces, or were thay all private purchase?

pic 2

Maker marks