UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons Army, Navy, and Luftwaffe Forum 1st model Luftwaffe(Bearing-out spiders on an alum

Dear colleagues of forum. Whether took place to be such. In a book T.Vitmana about it not a what not mentioned.Spiders sit very well.Tracks of insertions or other breaking are not observed.Mainly on the producers of Ernst Pack & Sohne GMBH, Solingen,Anton Wingen,Herder....
On the Russian forum a discussion goes concerning originality of these objects. I invite all knowing to take part in a discussion.Objects to on svey essences very rare, and meet not often.
If for whom that yet objects-propose such a picture in my theme
Best Regards

Why are quiet all? That not whoever did run into similar spiders on an aluminium? Who can that will rotin it the same...

The only aluminum 1st model I have seen with disc inserts was a restored piece after the original had b een de natzified. That example looked like it might have come from the factory.

The examples you show look clearly to me to be restored. Both the composition of the swasticas and their placement and condition make me question their originality.

Still, it is better than denatzified.

JMHO

Jim

Several producers used the inserted discs on the pommel and crossguard Pack was certainly one of them. The example owned by alien is a poor conditioned example the other example shown belongs to me and still in my collection and is certainly not restored.

It looks like the spiders are copper & have some plating remaining on them.
Agreed, it`s a beater.

Could such have the place on existence on these pictures as you consider?

Jim may well be right and I have NOT studied these daggers that are of little interest to me.

The traces of plating/finish (if that is what it is) may just be to lend some authenticity to a restoration but I question why anyone who is clearly skilled enough to produce an insert of such high precision would bother to waste their time on a dagger with little value. It doesn`t make any sense to me.

I own a nice example of one of these by Pack. All discs are inserts. I have owned it about 30 years and it certainly is no reproduction or restored example. The hilt fittings are made of aluminum. There are a very few of these daggers with SA inserts from very early on. The discs are probably of copper, but coud be copper-plated. They were then plated with silver and gold in the swastika areas. As noted by WWII-Collector, a number of makers used discs in the guard and on the pommel.

I concur with Landser. It doesn't make sense but we've seen it happen, however IMO, not with this dagger.

Siegfried Waffen examples I have seen meet the criteria I see here. The problem is that it was a transitional period piece. Some are seen with nickel fittings while the majority will be aluminum. They started to skimp. If you find one like the example shown in will look well like all kind of things are wrong. First off when the lacquer wears off and then goes the very thin plating you go right down to the base metal which you see on the pommel.
I find that there is nothing wrong with this dagger. The disks look like the ones I have on mine. Mine I believe is a bit earlier and may well have been better placed, but they are IMO the same.
All I can share with you is what I have. Here are a group shot with others. The Siegfried is with the portapee. The difference you may see is what a mint example looks like compared to one with worn plating. They get ugly fast with these versions, as they didn't hold up well.

Hope this helps.

Serge

This is my Pack. I would have to agree with WW2-Collector and Grumpy on these Packs, the discs are inserts, hilt fittings are made of aluminum.

Rich

Wags, it seems that despite my lack of hand on experience here logic ruled the day :))

Pitbull, what a lovely Pack! And nice spiders too :))

I can`t help it "spiders" just crack me up; I don`t think I`ll ever call them anything else now. Haaaa!

Serge, Love your Wusthof 1ST!! Is that one of the beauties that came out of the woodwork along with two other maker 1ST's here on GDC last year?? That is a great piece!! Kevin.

Good eye there Heers68, along with good memory!

-Serge-

All enormous thank you for posts and interest in a theme
Nevertheless appears such objects took place in the category of weapon 3 Reichs
Best Regards
Vitaliy