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OP
Joined: Oct 2009
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To clear up some confusion that not all vertical swivel hangers are made the same, as some are typical and some are non typical. There is not a single type that should be accepted as standard. By request I have posted some photos of my Non standard, but very period hanger for review. Dave Hohaus has given me a better understanding on the Hanger that I own. I am sure he can explain the differences much better than I,,, as I have seen his Swivel hangers at the Max Show.
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Joined: Oct 2009
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OP
Joined: Oct 2009
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Also in cluded is a page out Of Tom Johnsons German Dagger photo reference book to also show the similarities.
Historical Stewardship is a Trusted Honor that must be kept!
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OP
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Historical Stewardship is a Trusted Honor that must be kept!
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Agreed Pre RZM many variations exist. I BTW like yours. Thanks for sharing.
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Joined: Mar 2001
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Interesting that it is assumed that these hangers are for the SS especially since many approved SS verticals will show a 1934 date. IMO-more likely that these non RZM verticals are for the NSKK and the brown ones for the SA--since no vertical was ever approved for the SA/NSKK--except the bayonet types for the FHH. Of course if you own some they have to be SS-right?
MAX & OVMS Life Member, MAX Bd. of Experts. GDC Platinum Dealer. Collector since 1955.
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Joined: Oct 2009
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OP
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Are all pre-RZM SS verticals stamped with a 1934? ,,, as I dont have Wittmanns reference in my present location.
Historical Stewardship is a Trusted Honor that must be kept!
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Pre-RZM verticals have no dates at all.
I'll be back to this in a couple of days as I need to finish up on the MAX pictures.
Dave
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Joined: Oct 2001
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Houston I hear what you are saying and IMHO early nskk's prior to 1936 would have SA, (brouwn) hangers. Post 1936 they would have RZM hangers. Does it not make sense then that these early black ones would be for the SS?
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Joined: Mar 2001
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Joined: Mar 2001
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No RZM vertical was ever approved for the NSKK-so--No-and brown belts were never worn by the NSKK officially
MAX & OVMS Life Member, MAX Bd. of Experts. GDC Platinum Dealer. Collector since 1955.
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Here is my black convertible hanger. It came on an NSKK dagger.
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Reverse.
There minor lifting of a flake of leather. Not a tear. Note the exposed rivets.
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Joined: Sep 2000
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The weakness of this design is that the clip is narrow and the piece of leather that goes over the top to hold it is very thin. See closeups
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Now, back to the subject: Larry's hanger.
We compared his to my three (1 black + 2 brown) and the conclusions I came to:
1. It is NOT a repaired original 2. It is period copy of the original design 3. It has been improved by use of a folded over thicker piece of leather 4. A thin leather covering has been applied to the back of his example for smoothness
So, I think it is a unique well made copy of a pre-RZM convertible hanger. Nice score!
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Joined: Sep 2000
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One added point about that design. There is a second, non convertible, version that turns up now and then. Here is a picture of one owned by Vintagetimenow.
You can see that the grip holder is much lower and there is no provision for converting it to 45 degree wear.
Last edited by Dave Hohaus; 10/08/2011 11:20 PM.
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Lastly the NSKK vs SS question. My black one, as noted, was on an NSKK dagger. Whether Larry's was on NSKK or SS no one will ever know, but I can assure you the SS did use this design, or at least the non-convertible variation.
Here's mine. A gem of a Gembruch. Aand, solidly attached.
Good hunting
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