UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons German Sword & Miniatures Forum Just To Share...Why Not

Thought i'd post this piece. It's a nice conditioned Police officer degen by Alcoso. A peer was trading out some of his edged weapons so I swapped him a couple Km badges for the piece. These are his pics (and nice pics at that)- i'm too lazy to photograph it since it's in the display case. I never have considered myself a police or SS collector though I probably will keep this one rather than flipping it, as has been my past practice.

Condition is quite nice. Came with the knot. Blade is pristine, hilt has no plating loss or damage, and only 1 very small pressure ding to the wood grip. Note the scabbard throat screws are contemporary replacements, though I intend to replace these with period screws. I think there is a very decent possibility the scabbard is a repaint. I cannot be certain however. It does retain some conditional issues I would ordinarily associate with period wear and the missing chips don't seemingly indicate a prior paint job. That said, I still feel it's a 50%-50% with respect to a repaint.

I'll try to get motivated in a couple days and photograph the piece myself better illustrating the blade and the entire scabbard.

Anyway, just thought i'd share for the hell of it.

Tom

Nice score.
Congatulations!

Very nice!

PVON

My favorite "affordable" sword. Never have been able to determine is the copper grip eagle was meant to be that way or a thin silver coating wore off over time. If these were originally coated the couple I have show no trace of it today.
That's a very nice example you have there Tom.
Jim

Thanks friends.

Jim, i've wondered the same. I've never seen an example with the copper/brass grip insignia that retained any traces of a silver wash, so my inclination is to say no. That said i'm not an SS or Police collector so my experience has generally been limited to simply flipping related pieces. Perhaps someone else has an answer to this question- i've often been curious.

Tommo

The eagles were silver-plated, as opposed to nickel-plated. The silver, of course,is much softer and doesn't wear well. I have seen at least one sword with traces of silver remaining and own some with nearly 100% silver remaining on the eagles. Johnson has one by Weyersberg on his site that has most of the silver left on the eagle.

Are you speaking specifically to the brass/copper grip inserts? That would presuppose ALL these particular cast buttons manufactured in brass/copper were originally plated. That's ultimately the crux of the question.

I've never seen a brass eagle on a police sword grip, only copper ones. I have no doubt at least the earlier police swords had silver-plated grip eagles. As I said, I own several such swords and there's the one on Johnson's site. As to the later swords, paint or some other substance may have been used, perhaps a light wash similar to that seen on combat badges, etc. Any of these would, of course, wear poorly from being handled often, explaining why the vast majority of police swords are seen with little or no plating or coating left.

Very nice, great looking sword Tom congrats

A very nice looking sword! With my own sense of it being that the copper eagles that I've seen on a lot of German Police Degens are just that, copper. FP

If anyone is interested, there are photos of an excellent police officer sword with fully plated eagle on pp. 165 and 166 in A. Hayes' excellent "SS Uniforms, Insignia & Accoutrements - A Study in Photographs." The eagles were silver-plated to conform to the basic metal police eagles, as seen on cap emblems, etc. I doubt the SS would have approved of "raw" copper eagles for these swords. That would have given them an unfinished and somewhat cheesy look. After some handling by the owners, the light silver finish would begin to wear away. Continued wear, plus exposure to perspiration, other moisture and pollutants from the wearer's hand would have quickly acted to leave only the copper base metal. I am not trying to deride or degrade those swords with only the base copper left. Most are found that way. I am saying they they did not start that way.

I suspect you assessment is correct Grumpy. But for whatever reason I find these "copper eagles" attractive. here's an example of mine on a Herman Rath sword. This one has the SS "culture" mark on both the hilt and the scabbard throat.
Jim

I have a piece of reference literature that states some buttons were in brass. I'll need to dig it up and post the applicable section. Perhaps the author was mistaken or perhaps the information is antiquated. It might be Angolia....stay tuned.