UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons SS Dagger Forum CHAINED SS HIMMLER HONOUR DAGGER

Another interesting item found here:

www.germanmilitariacollectibles.com

Priced at USD $8750...

At a glance, all looks to be original but... the combination?

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Scott,

What are you trying to say here ?

Dave

Dave, I haven't seen this combination before... just asking if it's possible? (That is, with the Himmler inscription)?

Anything like this is possible.

If both the dagger and the scabbard check out as correct, then why not ?

There are endless guesses - usually between 2000 and 5000 - as to how many Himmler inscription daggers were handed out. It is possible that at least one guy who had the right to wear a chained scabbard went and stuck his Himmler in it.

The scabbard appears to have a type 1 chain, but the portepee seems to be the usual add-on-to-pump-up-the-value tie.

I think it is an open question

dave

I personally Vet purchased a similar combination 2 years ago in Canton Oh. Came with a 30 year old picture of the Vet holding the dagger and wearing the captured helmet. Bought 'em both. 2 GDC members were with me within 2 hours of the buy and saw them. All I'm trying to say is never say never....

Tom Johnson has one on his web site, came out of a Police Station in France according to his blurb. The scabbard has the type 2 chains and dagger comes with tear drop hanger.

A "ratty" Himmler is very unusual. I saw one at the SOS and was stunned. Most are very well taken care of. Personally, and I may be against the grain here, I would walk from one in this condition. That is only my personal opinion. A Himmler in this condition will be very, very difficult to ever sell.

Mark

Mark,

You are right about being hard to sell, but I've seen a few 'ratty' ones too. The question to ask is whether the original owner or perhaps a later GI allowed the dagger to become ratty.

No way to know for sure.

Dave

I believe a newer member was trying to sell a ratty Himmler M36 on the GD classifieds for $10K a few months ago. Looks like the same piece although that's just from blade condition.

The money end of a Himmler is the blade,so unless you have really nice blade (which most of them are) its kind of like trying to sell cancer.

I think Billy G is correct. The seller was selling the blade and crossguards, he didn't have the grip and scabbard if I recall... He also was offering the chained scabbard separately for sale, perhaps he "parted" them together.

Red

I think this hobby needs to have an always say never Attitude.I have a Few vet items that I personally purchased over the years but that does NOT make them a Variation or legit.Maybe the Group of vets came through a town,the vet saw 2 daggers and one had a broken blade but he liked this Scabbard better...is that a True Variation?...Nope

The Himmler with chained scabbard has been known for many years and is a correct period piece in most instances. IMO this would NOT increase the value--so why do it?
Also--Himmlers in poor condition DO sell and are not difficult to sell IF the price is right.

I once had a R�hm dagger in a chained scabbard - nice piece...

I have personaly obtained early RZM SS dagger that has came in a mid period M36 Chained scabbard. Some collectors seem to go by the references books examples only and not use a little common sense.

Just becasuse something is not in a book does not mean it never existed.

I think its completely logical that this combination exists, so no problem there.

Is the one shown in this thread a period example of this combination? I don't think so... The seller of this complete dagger had these Himmler parts for sale a while back, looks like the same blade to me... No problem selling it as a complete dagger if he's disclosed the new grip and scabbard.

Red

Inscription side.

quote:

Originally posted by Redbaron:
I think its completely logical that this combination exists, so no problem there.

Is the one shown in this thread a period example of this combination? I don't think so... The seller of this complete dagger had these Himmler parts for sale a while back, looks like the same blade to me... No problem selling it as a complete dagger if he's disclosed the new grip and scabbard.

Red

It�s definitely the same blade when compare these pictures.

Sam,

My full Rohm came in a chain scabbard directly from the veteran with another M33SS identified. Both from the same house in Germany directly from the US veteran.
Ron Weinand
Weinand Militaria

you know this is my dagger and the pictures are posted without my consent. but it's ok i have had this a few years now and you all checked it out in the past.i got this with the scabbard and all parts except the handle that was bought off of Ron.W here on this site. anytime i listed this for sale i have stated that the handle was a replacement and that is ruff

And who is sdp ? he hasent ever sent me any emails asking about my dagger,i could tell him everything he would like to know about this.but my for sale add had most everything i could think of already in the listing.It's good to see some of you remember looking at it before , but your rules of posting pictures ???? you should of asked him if he had the ok to post them.and it is what it is and there aint that many of them,i know you guys are all to rich for my blood and would never like this but i came to you looking for knowledge .this is a great place to come and check things out thats for sure and thanks to all the help i've had.

wes_143, when you place a pic of an item on a forum I believe it becomes public domain.
True, most collectors out of courtesy will seek permission before posting someones pics.

In this case, it was a question of if what was a parts dagger is now being offered as a complete, unmessed with dagger.
I have not read your description at GMC, as I am not inclined to pay just to browse, but I think the posting of your pic here for comparison purposes is legit.

thats ok i dont mind anyway.but i have always been up front when listing this and it is here that i have learned things i need to , but yes this was found with the scabbard and i think the pitting in the throut shows that this has been together a long time and not just added , all i did was buy a handle here from a member,and it came with the portapee so i left it there and added one screw to the scabbard

but as far as the pics , only the two were ever posted here on this site the ones with the white background were not

Nothing wrong with rehabing a dagger, apparently that was your only option, and if not you, someone else would have done it.
As long as you are up front about it,as you say, I see no problem.

The pics with the white background I presumed are from the GMC auction site, you are saying you don't want them here ?

as i said it dont bother me one bit, i just thought if someone was going to post them i would be asked and it caught me off gaurd when i read it at first, but there's no harm done here , i had metioned about another i found that was all beat up too and i am always greatful for the help i get because i am not real fimialer with these as i am a pocket knife guy but i come across all kinds of stuff and have bought the third reich daggers book by j.a bowman for a little more insight.

can you tell me anything on this dagger i posted feb 7 under the gau markings , it looks like and old dagger in a chained scabbard as well and it came this way,blade is ground both sides but everything else is well marked, so would it of been a maker marked dagger or rzm or gr ??? any answers would be good.