Hello, I have always wondered about this Seilheimer Etched Bayonet with scabbard and frog in my collection was genuine or not. Here are some pictures which I hope will be enough for people to give me some feedback with their opinions. Thanks.

Jerry

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Jerry:

First of all, let me say that I like the etch. It is the one that appears on page 203 of Wayne's great book, German Etched Dress Bayonets.

Seilheimer seems to have purchased their etches from Holler and you can see the Holler bookends on this bayonet, as well as on pages 202-204.

It is the Luftwaffe etch, which Wayne calls scarce.

It has the third type of Seilheimer maker mark. Someone can correct me, but I believe that this mark is the earliest of the three known marks used by Seilheimer.

No red flags that I can see on the etch.

John

nice bayonet,,,i just picked up one identical to this one about 2 weeks ago,and i posted the trade mark on this forum and also was told that this was the earlier of the 3 trade marks that seilheimer used,,,nice to see another one,,

This picture and the next was from the same catalog. Must have used all three at the same time??????????

same catalog

Etched bayonets with this exact TM are VERY suspect as hundreds if not thousands were imported in the 60's. All were in 100% mint condition including the scabbard and very well executed.Some had the same etch patterns but were unmarked. Some even had stag grips.It was common knowledge among collectors of the time that these were fake or at the best-parts and they sold for $15 or less. They were everywhere. Since then many of the mint scabbards were switched to other period pieces.Some newer collectors don't know this history and now think these are period.To each his own but I would not have one in my collection.

Houston:

Thanks for the info... I never knew that.

John

Houston is 100% correct. In the 60's the combination of this trademark and mint condition automatically meant "put it back on the seller's table". The late Jim Atwood was responsible for most of them.

p.s. Jerry, I'm not trashing your bayonet. I'm not smart enough to be able to tell if the etch is good or not. I do remember Atwood sending me one with stag grips and the same etch on approval for the amount of (you guessed it) $15.00
Let's wait for Wayne's opinion on the etch.

Well, for a moment there I thought I might have a good one. Now, as I said in the beginning, I am not so sure. However, I really do appreciate the information given so far. Good or Bad, I think it is best to know. Let's see what else we can learn about this bayonet.

Here is the same Paul Seilheimer bayonet that I believe is original.
Just compare the borders of the etching: no missing parts...
The makersmark points the other way...

Best greetings,

Herman

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Jim also had lots of mint Paul Seilheimer swords - all with the scabbards wrapped in twisted brown paper. We didn't look at things such as which way the MM pointed, we knew what they were, and Jim priced them accordingly.

Dan

My brother got stuck with one of these, sword thru triangle several years ago at the MAX show. He hasn't bought one since.

It is unfortunate that Jim Atwood is usually only remembered in a negative way, much of which promoted by the shady actions of those who sold some of his postwar assembled stuff down the road. He also unearthed tons of really good items.

Most collectors these days would be surprised to learn that Jim actually was, from when I knew him, honest, personable, quite knowledgeable, very trusting, and a friend.

Dan

what parts of the etching are "missing"?.. i see no difference other that the engraving is on one long style and on one carbine length,,,where do my eyes deceive me????...

See indication in the picture.

Check Wayne's book on this, he explains it very well.

Best greetings,

Herman

Another thing I remember is all of the 60's ones I remember seeing were the long type

Houston,
when this was going on did you note any PS marked paper bags at that time?? Bret Van Sant

I have been collection PS stuff for a while now (mostly swords) and one thing i have noted with most Seilheimer fakes is the direction of the MM. Like the fake Eick's its facing the wrong way - at least with the MM shown above. The PS in a circle and the dog with sword are a different kettle of fish.

I don't remember the bags that much but hundreds if not thousands of different ones were available-some original?--some not

Interesting information! Houston, you need to write all these things down and offer it to the collectors. I think these small tidbits are priceless. I have seen a few PS bags and given the size either for army, luft or long dress bayos? Never was really to sure.The printing on a few looked a bit odd like the printing on the fake Eick bags you see offered from time to time. Thanks for the reply!!

Bret Van Sant

I do own several period bags from several manufacturers. I also own a SEILHEIMER army bag which, imo and due to my personal knowledge, is period without any doubt. If you have handled some of them you nearly immediately can tell which is the right thing or the wrong.
Regards,

hi wotan,,,can you post some pics of the bags?..thanks,,,Robert

Hello Robert/militarymania, sorry,
due to the fact that I want to avoid any information how an unquestionable original bag looks like (it has certain features the known fakes still miss) I did stop with showing pics from original bags. Please understand my attitude, regards,

Wotan, I think that is a wise move
Bret Van Sant

Gentlemen,
Let's bring this discussion further. Do any of you definetely own one of the 60's examples of this etch. If you do please put some pictures of it here so that all of us can take a good look at it, THAT would be worthwhile looking at and discussing.

I Love This Stuff
Von Ryan