Hi guys,

Inside the mark '800'.
Unfortunately the photo of the mark did not turn out very well.
Your opinions please.

B.R.
Sergey

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From only this pic i don`t like it real, but maybe more and good pics will change this opinion.

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more shot

The key might be that the ring was done by a person who imho has not been familiar with the true structure and composition of the SArune. I can hardly imagine that was done by a period manufacturer.
Regards,

- good point Wotan..

From the photos,,this really looks like it could be one of the 1st gen. copies made by GI years ago.
They were very good.. Some had real enamel, the silver matched the content stamp.
Some problems were - The cartouche field for the enamel was shallow on theirs. And, The authentics were very even, meaning put a line down the middle of the cartouche,,and what is on the right side is an exact match for the left, evenness, depth etc. Also the band on authentic examples is very thin and even. Maybe a birds eye shot will help..

These early copies by GI were good as I mentioned,,now with a good 15 years of age , wear and tear and this is a dangerous piece..

Thank you for your opinions gentlemen.

Hi Gaspare,

from your post I realized that you are not 100% sure that this is a fake.
This is true?

its copy

IMHO answer is in very first pic. Look arround 800 stamp, there are casting signs all over.

A few more shots in daylight. More opinions please.

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From the back of the band- the pits and scratches around the mark, the thickness of the rear of the band- and especially here- the two uneven top rear corners... and all the scratches (removing casting flaws and balls?) throughout- im of the mind that this is a cast postwar piece.

For me some points in every direction.
For example i like the look of the black enamel on the one pic.
Seems like the is the real glasy one.

In my opinion this ring needs a handinspection to maybe be sure in it.

I thought of what you said, odal, with the black enamel earlier....that's the sliver of purple that implicates the glassieness- I like that too. The rest, I am not a fan.

Sergey,, I'm sure. Just trying to correctly identify it.. The more photos you take the more its easier to see. This is a 1st generation or early GI copy.
They didn't make a lot of them. And some even had real enamel in them. They then went to a really good [then new] quick , hard fake enamel. After a couple years they had to change their manufacturing methods completely as it took to much time and expensive to make them.

Their early SA, SS, HJ, rings were good when new,,but now with some defacing, wear and tear, getting knocked around,,they display good honest wear appearence to them.
Some collectors swear by them!!, some just swear at them. ......

Hello Gaspare,

you can show an example of similar copys. Early copys SA, SS or HJ.
It would be interesting to compare.

B.r.
Sergey

so many pages about evident copy )))

Sergey,, first,,sorry but I don't collect copies and presently have no copies/photos to show. Maybe try GI for their current copies,,they seem to have a ring for every nazi organization there ever was!
2,,Evgeniy is correct! Search around the ring forums and you'll find the fake SAs and good SAs..

This is just a old , very well made fake with a lot of wear and tear on it. Remember some of these fakes were worn for longer than the period rings!

Many thanks for you opinions. And yet I agree with the opinion of Odal. Before make a final verdict you need to keep this ring in your hands.

Sorry, but you did not convince me, in my opinion this is a WW2 period ring.

P.S.
Evgeniy,
'FJR' also believes that this ring is original)

B.R.
Sergey

FJR can believes in any thing
I have the almost the same SA ring and can understand how lookoriginal )))

Hi Evgeniy,

if you do not want to show it here, send me please photos: schwarzwolf64@yandex.ru
It will be very interesting to compare.

you can find it ring here, in forum

This is GI new offering for the SA ring.. They have done minor changes at least 6 , 7 times. Some stamped 800, some 835,,they will change the colors, little nuances here and there etc. etc.
Their description:


DESCRIPTION: This exquisite S.A. ring is styled on its sides in the very same manner of A. Wilm's art- deco style of the SS-Leibstandarte rings, with differences in motif and color, of course. The ring is beautifully embellished with the Strum Abteilung emblem and is a size 11 ½. This item is silver and is clearly stamped inside (835); nice condition with no chipping to the enamel top.
PRICE: $750

They've even had to change their description as years ago they claimed this was made by Wilm! Of course it wasn't and at the time I was communicating with a family member of the firm. He did a nice little write up for me and , well, the end result was they had to change their description.
Now these are small not really good photos. But even that,,the ring looks pretty good! They have been copying the ring for many years so always be extra careful when acquiring a SA ring!

The former owner bought this ring in a grouping with a SA dagger etc. in Germany more than 20 years ago.
Please see the distinct difference between the GL ring and my ring.

first off,,20 years is nothing,,I have T-shirts older!


GI has been making this ring for almost 30 years that I know of,,maybe longer! The ring they make now [shown] is a far cry from their early reproductions,,they were way better!

Besides what Hap see's [doesn't like] here are 2 more quick ones.

Hi Gaspare,

in red, did you mark places that are similar to casting?

I looked at all the threads of this forum and did not find any one on 100% of the confirmed original onologic Design of this SA ring.
Maybe someone here will show a 100% original WW2 period, a similar design of this SA ring. I do not mean which showed Odal.
Namely, as I showed.

B.r.
Sergey

Serge,
,the red show casting defects....

There used to be 2 SA rings here,,probably still are somewhere just have to find them.. I've been collecting for over 30 years and only have 1 [not the same pattern as yours anyway]. Unfortunately I can not get to any of my rings presently.

Maybe someone here will show theirs. Remember,,most of our rings we collect were pre war and early war. After the Rohm purge the SA fell out of favor and you don't even see the rings advertised.
They are very rare period!

Here is a early advert for one..

First erly pattern of this SA one.
Reversed colours and plain back.

Very nice rings

Thanks Mike!

Hi Odal,

thanks for the pictures and explanation. Very nice rings. Of course, given your experience (Odal and Gaspare), I hope that you are not mistaken.

Thanks again,
Sergey

Serge,,
, I can only say,,you have the ring in hand,,, The red circled areas in my photo,,I see what look like casting 'dots' or casting pearls - Is it the photo? are they really there, sure looks like it??
The other photo,,that unevenness ,,a professional die cutter wouldn't have had it like that. All 4 corners would have been pretty much even. The 2 in the photo are obvious big enough difference to see even in a poor photo..

My personal opinion ,philosophy, advice is this, and its the same for everyone,,,- IF you are buying these rings as an investment, don't. Unless you have a magic Chrystal ball, buying hoping to make a profit later isn't smart.
,.and another,, Buy what YOU like.. IF you like and happy with this SA ring then keep it!, wear it, or put it in a collection, whatever you do with them.

Serge, this following isn't directed to you exactly,you've been collecting a while now and seem to have a wonderful collection. I'ts just something I'm putting out there for everyone and my own personal thoughts.

There are guys that make big money buying and reselling rings,,great. It's not a business for me,,it is a hobby that is fun. Finding or hunting down a ring then doing some history research about it is what makes me tick.

There are some guys that just want to buy a cheap ring, find a site and ask,,'is this good?'. They don't put a second of what it takes to learn why a ring is period or not...
I wonder here how many have done a search on 'Investment cast' /'Lost wax cast'? OR how many have looked in the cutting a die and making working dies from it etc. YES, it IS a lot of work,,most don't want to do it. They want to buy and ask 'Is it good'. Then later when they find out its bad they say ,,'Oh so and so on this forum said its good' so its got to be'!.. These forums are great without a doubt! But they must be supplemented buy some of your own learning either through books or classes etc. You will feel much better when someone calls your ring a fake and you can explain why they are mistaken!.
Sorry for the long rant and again not addressed exactly to you Serge,,just my thoughts for everyone.. So guys,,GO, get hunting,,hit the flea markets,,hit the scrap piles at your local big jewelers, hit the Antique show,,hit the military show,,everything you can..I've even got lucky one time and got a WestWall ring at a Rock and Gem show! There's less and less of our rings out there so get creative, find places where you can find them and GO for it!!, Happy Hunting guys!!!!

Great post, G- who knows what treasures the summer of 2017 will bring??

Hi Gaspare,

thanks for you post. And you happy hunting!

Br
Sergey

its a copy