http://cgi.ebay.com/AUTHENTIC-BROWN-DAGGER-FULL-ROEM-WW...QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I don't think so. For a start I've never heard of Sauer producing a Rohm blade

Jonathan

Hi everyone, if you check Mikatim's site.
http://www.dienstdolch.de/der-ehrendolch-roehmdolch.html?Itemid=38


He has Sauer down as a Rohm maker.
but thats a new maker on me,nats

What puts me off is the price,so cheap if it is the real deal,and in such fantastic condition.If it is the real thing it is a steal at the price but I am not willing to take a chance in it.
Ivan.

Personally i would be very wary of anything like this coming out of a former eastern block country. You want a real Rohm i would suggest a dealer with a good returns policy.

Don't like were it comes from taking a chance.He sold an etch Army bayo.Wayne might be able to give an opinion

I just read Sturmbrigade's mind, couldn't have said it any better myself.

Let me make it clear that I agree with all the above comments. However: I'm looking for someone to point out a "smoking gun" on this dagger and so far this hasn't happened.
Jim

I cannot gain access to the eBay file, is anyone capable of posting any close up pics of the full Rohm inscription ?
Aside from that, it is impossible for anyone to tell if the inscription is ligit or not.
Just need betters pics in order to make any appropriate calls on this baby.

"listing unavailable"........The eban gestapo musta squelched his listing.

If the inscription was a fake, the guy sure knew how to bait a trap. The dagger is a beauty. I stayed up half the night last night comparing the inscription with as many as I could find photos of. I could only pick out a few minor variations.

Here you go Pat. This is his photo.

In my opinion, this full Rohm inscription is 100% genuine.
I don't see any obvious red flags.
Again, an hand inspection would definitively be the best method of authentification by measuring the depth of inscription versus the motto, as both were applied together and should therefore be identical.

Problem #1 solved........

Now we just gotta figure out how to get it out of the Chech Republic without getting ripped off. ...

John,

At that price, tell the guy that you will pick it up yourself in Prague and you'll still be making a good deal.
I noticed that the item is no more listed on Ebay and I'm pretty certain that somebody really got a good deal on this one.
Also considering that this trademark was never seen with a Rohm inscription, would make this dagger quite unique and worth a lot more than what it was listed for.

Alright now, who's the rattle snake that bought it ?

What worried me was,if the seller knew what he had,why sell it so cheaply on Ebay,yes put it on with a reserve and a reasonable starting price,see where it goes,but to put it on with a £1500 buy it now was,let's face it,giving it away!
Call me paranoid,but we all know about the scammers and fakers from that part of Europe,would you have received "that" dagger,or an empty,tampered with parcel,or nothing at all,"lost in the post".Has the seller whetted our appetites,had email enquiries from prospective buyers and is now doing a deal privately,scamming someone.The seller had sold only very few things,less than 30 if I remember correctly,and had 100% feedback,making him "trustworthy"?
I have a full Rohm and compared them myself,the depth of the inscription was the only thing I was not happy with,ut I'm no authority on them.Where is Fred Stephens,come on Fred have a look.
Just my paranoid opinion.
Regards,Ivan.

Yes, there are some 'Finds' out there...

BUT.....Remember:

Pawel Nowak....

Sylvie Salter.... Dave/dblmed

Yep, a good look would be in order... to apply an acid etched Rohm inscription to a good blade is a piece of cake, oldest con out there

Red

I have a Rohm dagger with the signature removed, that i acquired directly from the vet many years ago, but I am certainly no authority on any dagger. I can however, make some comments about dealing in the Czech Republic. I have bought several very nice and rare items there over the past 10 years, primarly Gestapo related, because that is an area in which I have had a lot of experience and trust my judgement.

It is also a place that a lot of Gestapo pieces were abandoned. The Gestapo did not leave Prague until May 8, 1945, in the wake of the Czech insurgency...and juat ahead of the Russian army. They were escorted out of Prague by a Red Cross convoy. Many of them were arrested the following day in the old Sudetenland as thay made their way toward Germany....and the American lines.

Like most places in the world, there are a few fast operators in the Czech Republic, I suppose, but by and large, I have found the persons that I have dealt with there far more honest and reliable, than many I have run into right here at home. It is my opinion that the everage Czech has a much higher ethical standard than what we encounter here on a daily basis.

In addition to that, the Czech Republic is a great storehouse of WWII pieces that were ditched by the retreating German army and police forces. I have interviewed first hand, a few Germans that were in that exodus. There are places in the Sudtenland that have produced a number of SS rings anti-Partisian badges, Gestapo warrant discs, and other rare items. About 8 years ago, I visited a person living there in one of the high-rise communist era apartments, that had one room of his apartment completely filled with metal-detector finds. It looked like a high-quality museum display. Nothing was for sale. We knew each other as fellow collectors and friends. I saw several anti-partisian badges that had been badly eaten way by the acid soil of the agricultural fields along the streams, where many of the Germans had been held for long periods while they were being sorted out by Allied troops. Both the British and Ameriacns were involved in this. Anything like SS rings, insignia, or Gestapo warrant discs were hastily buried or discarded here, so as not to tie its owner to those organizations. Do not associate the acquisition of rare materials here with places like Poland. There is a tremendous difference in the circumstances.

I am not trying to influence anyone's opinion about this. I am only stating what I have learned from first-hand experience. You are making a mistake if you discount this as a place to find authentic, and rare pieces, and are put off by the question of ethics of the people.

Don Bible

Don, very interesting info on that period & location. It's the kind of thing that I look for on the forum. Thanks for it.

Thank you for your comment Barry. I might add that over the past 10 years that I have spent several thousand dollars on Third Reich items in the Czech Republic mostly Gestapo items.

A few of these pieces were picked up there personally by me, but most were purchased on the basis of high quality scans, and were paid for by bank wire transfer.

I can say without qualification that I have never been sent a bad piece, nor have I ever lost one red cent in dealing in that country.

I wish I could say the same for Atlanta, Georgia, or Peterborough, England!

To see examples of some things purchased there by me, see the current issue of "The ARMOURER", a militaria collector's magazine published in England. A current single issue (September-October) may be purchased at the following web site www.armourer.co.uk

Don Bible

Hi Don,
Read your article in The Armorer.Very interesting find.Congrats....
Whats wrong with Peterboro?
Has a nice Cathedral..
Seiler (Yank in UK)

Hi Seiler,
Thanks for your comments about the article. I am glad you enjoyed it.

My problems in Peterborough back in 1994, didn't originate at the Cathedral!

Regards, Don Bible

Gotcha!!
Seiler (yank in UK)

KNOWN SA ROHM DAGGER MAKERS

.AESCULAP
.F.DICK
.CARL EICKHORN
.GOTTLIEB HAMMESFAHR
.HACO
.C.G.HAENEL
.GEBRUDER HELLER
.J.A.HENCKELS ZWILLINGSWERK
.FRIEDRICH HERDER
.EDWARD WUSTHOF
.AUGUST MERTEN
.P.D.LUNESCHLOSS
.DAVID MALSCH
.ERNST PACK & SOHN
.GEFREES SPALTENEDER
.WAGNER & LANGE
.GEBRUDER BELL
.H.HERDER
.WILHELM KOBER & CO
.ANTON WINGEN JR.

According to:

http://www.kmmilitary.com/KNOWN-SA-ROHM-DAGGER-MAKERS

MAYBE it will turn out to be real but it wouldn't be an easy sell compared to the conventional makers.

Hammesfahr made SA Daggers ?

Dave

Dave:
Look at your McSARR listing. Both Hammesfahr & Cie and Gottlieb Hammesfahr are listed.
Jim

Yes,thats right.
Seiler (Yank in UK)

I know that Gottlieb Hammesfahr is listed, but no one can ever come up with a dagger. Same for Klass and Boker

Dave

Interesting since G H is not one of the "dotted"(.) ones on Mikes list. Perhaps he will tune in an provide more info.
Jim

UK Dealer..militaryantiques.co.uk may still have the one they had for sale some time ago.
Seiler (Yank in UK)

Hammesfahr Cie is a relatively common maker of SA daggers (this is the example on military antiques website), whether Gottlieb Hammesfahr produced an SA is another matter

Fischer has Gottlieb as rare only 1000 daggers but has anybody seen one thats the question?