SS Chained Dagger for opinion

Hi All
I have an SS chained dagger in my collection and know absolutely nothing about them other than what I have read on various websites.
I would welcome any comments based on the photographs below.
If ive missed any photos of specific parts then please ask and I will take some more and post .
The chain is non magnetic and is missing the 2 end links which attach it to the clasp.
Scabbard is painted steel.
No maker marks visible on the blade.

23 photos added in the album below

Srellis,

Welcome,

Your link will not open unless one signs up for a google membership so I removed it.

Please post photos, NOT links. Instructions are in the Welcome Forum.

Thanks,
Dave

Thanks Dave

Do I need webspace somewhere to upload photos to ?

Originally Posted By: Dave

Srellis,

Welcome,

Your link will not open unless one signs up for a google membership so I removed it.

Please post photos, NOT links. Instructions are in the Welcome Forum.

Thanks,
Dave

first few photos -

Attached picture P1050134.JPG

more photographs

Attached picture P1050132.JPG

more pics

It is authentic, but missing the connecting links with the clip. The chain is probably made of nickel-silver, but could be plated steel. Reproduction links could be made and added by someone who does such work, or, perhaps, a custom jeweler. If you have the links made, be sure the original material is used and the links are shaped properly and grooved, as are the others. The chain appears to have ben heavily polished, removing the so-callled dark "burnished" background. There are varieties of chains and this one appears to be a "Type II," which had darkened backgrounds to the chain links. The paint appears to be original or a very old repaint, a good sign. It's hard to tell about the blade since there is only one partial shot of it, bit it looks OK in it. Nice grip, from what can be seen.

Cliff, that were exactly my same words in a private email to Steve.
You literly took the words out of my mouth.

The chain is a so called type B1.
Early full nickel. To bad it's that heavily cleaned.

Restoring it is, IMO something to consider here because the wotanknot is totally loose from the chain. You really don't want to loose that piece...

Thanks very much for the information, very helpful indeed.
The chain is non magnetic so I will rule out the plated steel.
Sadly the top two links are missing.
There are no makers marks on the blade, is that normal ?
I will post up another photo of the blade

Originally Posted By: Grumpy

It is authentic, but missing the connecting links with the clip. The chain is probably made of nickel-silver, but could be plated steel. Reproduction links could be made and added by someone who does such work, or, perhaps, a custom jeweler. If you have the links made, be sure the original material is used and the links are shaped properly and grooved, as are the others. The chain appears to have ben heavily polished, removing the so-callled dark "burnished" background. There are varieties of chains and this one appears to be a "Type II," which had darkened backgrounds to the chain links. The paint appears to be original or a very old repaint, a good sign. It's hard to tell about the blade since there is only one partial shot of it, bit it looks OK in it. Nice grip, from what can be seen.

Originally Posted By: srellis

Thanks very much for the information, very helpful indeed.
The chain is non magnetic so I will rule out the plated steel.
Sadly the top two links are missing.
There are no makers marks on the blade, is that normal ?
I will post up another photo of the blade

Originally Posted By: Grumpy

It is authentic, but missing the connecting links with the clip. The chain is probably made of nickel-silver, but could be plated steel. Reproduction links could be made and added by someone who does such work, or, perhaps, a custom jeweler. If you have the links made, be sure the original material is used and the links are shaped properly and grooved, as are the others. The chain appears to have ben heavily polished, removing the so-callled dark "burnished" background. There are varieties of chains and this one appears to be a "Type II," which had darkened backgrounds to the chain links. The paint appears to be original or a very old repaint, a good sign. It's hard to tell about the blade since there is only one partial shot of it, bit it looks OK in it. Nice grip, from what can be seen.

Yes Steve,

these daggers came out of factory without maker logo's on them.
Occasionally we see maker marked blades in chained scabbards but that was just due of the fact that the SS man already had
a standard M33 maker marked model and was qualified after a while to ware a chained scabbard. He simply bought the chained scabbard only to reduce costs and placed his M33 model in the chained scabbard. So, maker marked daggers originally don't belong in chained scabbards.

Thanks Kris

Once again excellent information.

Regards
Steve

Originally Posted By: Krikke

Yes Steve,

these daggers came out of factory without maker logo's on them.
Occasionally we see maker marked blades in chained scabbards but that was just due of the fact that the SS man already had
a standard M33 maker marked model and was qualified after a while to ware a chained scabbard. He simply bought the chained scabbard only to reduce costs and placed his M33 model in the chained scabbard. So, maker marked daggers originally don't belong in chained scabbards.

A additional explanation for a maker marked dagger ending up with a chained scabbard can be found in ss obergruppenfuhrer Fritz Weitzel's period publication The Celebrations in the Life of the SS Family where it is stated during funeral rights "the unit commander takes the dagger from the coffin and exchanges it with the dagger of a relative or close ss comrade as a sign of the continuing struggle and sense of duty of the ss".

Originally Posted By: Dean Perdue

Originally Posted By: Krikke

Yes Steve,

these daggers came out of factory without maker logo's on them.
Occasionally we see maker marked blades in chained scabbards but that was just due of the fact that the SS man already had
a standard M33 maker marked model and was qualified after a while to ware a chained scabbard. He simply bought the chained scabbard only to reduce costs and placed his M33 model in the chained scabbard. So, maker marked daggers originally don't belong in chained scabbards.

A additional explanation for a maker marked dagger ending up with a chained scabbard can be found in ss obergruppenfuhrer Fritz Weitzel's period publication The Celebrations in the Life of the SS Family where it is stated during funeral rights "the unit commander takes the dagger from the coffin and exchanges it with the dagger of a relative or close ss comrade as a sign of the continuing struggle and sense of duty of the ss".

Thanks Dean, again great information.