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Excellent thread and vey informative. These fakes are becoming better and better but are still light years away from any original.
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A Big "Thank You" from me too. This is the kind of information I visit this forum for. Great pictures and information. Very good job. This is great information for all. Best Regards, Al
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OP
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We will see more of these, you can be certain. Someone spent some big money tooling up to make those components and they will make more than one!
The blade is the correct length, width, depth and weight. The steel is a duller color than the real ones.
You should expect to see these in SA and NSKK too. The basic indicators are:
- Grip wood too perfect - incorrect tang nut - RZM style plated scabbard fittings and screws - Very light scabbard
Dave
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There is one point that I missed in the above thread, so let's see who can find it.
There is one fairly obvious point that says this is NOT an Eickhorn dagger.
Anyone ?
Dave
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Dave, I thank you for this thread, this alone is a great example of what this forum is all about, without knowledge like this available, alot of guys would get burnt. thanks for your time, and effort! (lets hope the "BAD GUYS" dont see this thread, and make adjustments accordingly!)
lol, as far as being able to tell what makes this not a Eickhorn, I have no clue, and I am anxiously awaiting the answer!
"Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a mans character, give him power" Abraham Lincoln
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Dave, I dont know if you refer to the motto, but some letters are definately not matching an early Eickhorn motto. M and h for example, but also other letters are somewhat different.
Best regards,
Tor-Helge
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Not the motto, although that is not a good copy either.
Dave
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It's not a subtle or hidden point - It is right in front of you Dave
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The eye on the maker mark looks very low!
Regards Russell
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No .... Look at the last picture I posted Dave
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Once again Dave has provided an in depth study of the SS Dagger Thanks Dave
Matt
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The hand accented grooves on the crossguards???
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Red, Nope. Not the grooves. Those are NOT hand accented, they are casting flaws. Keep looking Dave
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I meant the hand accenting to the grooves we see on early Eick crossguards aren't on these... OK, how about that they're not HE or AR internally marked???
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Wait, what about no GAU stamp?
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Darn, I meant District stamp!
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Nope. Nope.
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Dave, All I can see is the scabbard throat is "thin" and not the Eickhorn "thick" type.
-serge-
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Early Eickhorn crossguards should be marked "H,E" or "A,R".
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ollar |
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Yes !
I looked at it a long time before the penny dropped. Eickhorn did not use P.A. guards.
Serge,
Also correct.
Anybody else spot something I missed ?
Dave
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Is the ebony handle the same lenght and width as the originals? I bet the dark finish on the handle is appiled staining?
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Yes, the grip was the correct width, height, and within the correct weight range. It was not ebony. Vern looked at it and guessed dyed pear wood.
Dave
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Thanks Dave great thread.
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quote: Paul H Posted 15 April 2008 01:08 Hide Post Dave, I thank you for this thread, this alone is a great example of what this forum is all about, without knowledge like this available, alot of guys would get burnt. thanks for your time, and effort! (lets hope the "BAD GUYS" dont see this thread, and make adjustments accordingly!)
Paul is absolutely right we hope that they dont see it, but like vultures they are watching as we write and post. It is up to "us" to carry on this great hobby, so that deception does not takeover and lie to the new collector. This is some scary stuff, Dave posted. "Deine, Ehre Heisst Treue" Your honor is your loyalty to this hobby. Lets stay ahead of these guys. Good job again Dave. Sincere Thanks Larry
Historical Stewardship is a Trusted Honor that must be kept!
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Thanks Dave, great thread with verry good pictures.
Ralf
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Hello Dave, I have try to you a private message to send. That cannot be done!!! Can you write me down please times? [email protected] Greeting Ralf
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Thanks for sharing your knowledge.Certainly makes the hobby more enjoyable for those of us who still have a lot to learn!
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Mik, I don't use PM. Send email to [email protected]One of the guys who recently showed a fake one here was going to send it to me so I could photo it, but I have not heard from him. Dave
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Hi Dave, GREAT article! Although I no longer have my SS daggers, I am ALWAYS open to learning. You just never know when the next one will come your way. I wouldn't want to,as the book says Get stuck by a Phoney Dagger". Thanks again. Peace, Mark
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Thanks for the Imformation, as the prices for original SS & SA daggers get higher the fakes get better.
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If you have phony SS daggers or ones that have been ... um ... humped, consider posting them here. Or send them to me and I'll post.
Dave
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Dave thanks for the informative post! As a new collector this is information surely helps a lot!
One question, when you have it in hand was it easy to spot it was a fake? Did you know right away or did you have to spend some time going over the nitty gritties so to speak?
I think a dagger like this would probably be photographed in such a way to hide the flaws, put on an auction site like ebay and then sent to the unsuspecting seller.
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Even from a distance it looked too pretty. I spotted the new looking grip wood right away. Then the trademark positioning as soon as I saw the blade. After that I saw signs as noted above. A new guy would probably not spot these.
With the value of these daggers, there is a big incentive to fake them.
Dave
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THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU !!! I have a(poor)repro dagger with chain. As an old W.SS vet (34th) I just look at it for nostalgia's sake. Just from reading this ONE thread i learned a lot. I am not a collector, but am very interested looking at the schemes people will go through to make a fast buck. The scary part is that replicas are getting better and better, and I wonder how many will be taken for a ride. As always: Caveat emptor ! Haen
when an elephant flies, don't criticise his style; just marvel that he does it.
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Dave, That must have taken you a considerable amount of time to post. I'm just another member saying Thank You.
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Thanks
US collectors - If you have a fake and send it to me, I will do a thread on it and return it.
Dave
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A reminder that if you have a fake and live in the US**, please send it to me for posting and analysis. I'll keep you name out of it if you wish and sent it back at my expense. I'd buy it too, for $100 or less. ** other areas too, if your local Customs won't get too exited
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How about one from BUDK knives, from ten meter distance they look OK . Thy cost $ 12.99 plus shipping. If you will pay $100.00 for it (LOL) I will buy a couple of dozen, and send them to you. (LOL-LOL) Just kidding. !!!!! Thanks for the postings guys, never too old to learn, even at 85 HN
when an elephant flies, don't criticise his style; just marvel that he does it.
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Those $12.95 or even $21.95 don't fool anyone.
I am very interested in doing "show & tell" on the newer fakes that can really confuse newer collectors.
Dave
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Hi Dave,I may have one for you.How can I contact you for the pix? Thanks Dutchman.
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