UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons SS Dagger Forum Paul Seilheimer SS dagger

Just traded for a Paul Seilheimer SS dedicated dagger. The makers mark is a elongated circle with a PS in the center and surrounding the circle is Paul Seilheimer and at the bottom is solingen. It is a ground Rohm but the makers mark is untouched. It has In herzlicher Kameradschaft von dem Bach. this is over the ground rohm part of the dagger.Ollks really good. Traded a 42 dated luger for it. Just wondering if anyone had heard of this maker.
g24t

Does that dagger have an "Sw" gau mark ?

Hi mate, i have an interest in Seilheimer edged weapons and have seen a number of fake SS daggers before with the Dog and PS with sword makers mark. Unfortunately they are not a known maker of SS daggers - not that this is the final word on your dagger at all. Is there a possibility you could post some pics at all??

THE DAGGER HAS A ROMAN NUMERAL 3 ON THE CROSS GUARD.THIS IS ONLY A CIRCLE WITH PS INSIDE OF IT. I HAVE SOME PHOTOGRAPHS AND WILL LOOK AT THEM TO SEE IF THEY ARE BLURY, ALSO WITH A LOOP LIGHT, YOU CAN SEE THE ROHM DEDICATION WHERE IT WAS GROUND OFF. IT TAKES A LOOP LIGHT TO SEE IT.
G24T

I tried to take some photographs of the writing, I sent them to skyline I think, Anyway if they are fuzzy, he will let me know. I am leaving tomorrow for a hune in Junction Texas and will be back monday and try to send some more photo's, might need a e-mail address for some one to post themfor me.
i am at [email protected]
g24t

meant to say hunting not hune. sorry
g24t

I've got the pics but they are inconclusive. Johnny really needs access to a better camera to post pics.

whle I am at the lease this weekend, my son-in-law who has a good camera will take the photo's for me.
the perosn I traded for the dagger said that he had it verified with several collectors and he is a friend of mine if its wrong, I will re-trade him.
Johnny

Great Johnny, can't wait to see it!
If you have any provenance on the piece, that may also be helpful.
Best, John

Here is a link to a url with photos of Johnny's dagger: http://share.dell.shutterfly.com/action/welcome?sid=8AZtGzhy0bN32g

I'm not a real big fan of this one. The eagle is really low on the handle- not a good sign.

I could be wrong- I'll look for input by the real experts here.

John

From what i can see from the pics the lettering of the motto is not consistant with the etch used on SA's by Seilheimer (from lakesidetraders website). In particular the "N" and the "H" are different. As you can see the SA lettering is much fatter and tends to taper to a point as it comes down the SS lettering does not. Whilst other letters such as the "E" are close and could be putch down to the etching process itself IMO the other letters are too far off. Also the trademark appears to be too far away from the crossguard and smaller. Of course I agree that there is always some degree of small differnce in the etching process but personally i dont like what i see.

I am not sure that comparing letters in mottos on SA vs SS tells anything.

This one is close enough to be interesting. If you would send it to me with the OK to take the dagger (not scabbard) apart, I would really like to see it in person. I would keep it no longer than 2-3 days and send it back insured at my expense.

Dave

DAVE, SEND ME YOUR ADDRESS AND I WILL SEND IT TO YOU. I ALSO CAN SEND YOU THE PACK AND YOU COULD TELL ME ABOUT THAT ONE.
G24T

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Hohaus:
I am not sure that comparing letters in mottos on SA vs SS tells anything.

This one is close enough to be interesting. If you would send it to me with the OK to take the dagger (not scabbard) apart, I would really like to see it in person. I would keep it no longer than 2-3 days and send it back insured at my expense.

Dave

I agree its like apples and oranges Dave, but with the lack of others to compare to i wonder would have the etch used for an SS been dramatically different to an SA? Do you think that similar letter templates would have been used or completly different (im talking letter shape)? anyone out there with a SS/SA maker have any pics to compare?

In Wittmann's book on SS daggers see page 244 and 245. Two photos of a "vd Bach" dagger show the maker to be Gottlieb Hammesfahr. Mine is on page 244 and the crossguard is marked with roman numerals III. Both dedications over a previous ground Roehm one.
Finally I can add something to this forum!

GT - Email sent

Sturm,
At this point nobody knows if there is corrolation between the letter of SA and SS mottos used by one manufacturer.

We have seen several attempts to tie SS manufacturers to motto letters because of similarities, but there always seems to be a few differences that cast doubt.

My position would be: Until it is proven that SA/SS manufacturers used the same letters in their mottos ... we should keep an open mind.

Dave

Sound point mate - looking forward to your analysis on this one!!

Well it looks like I have lost several thousand Dollars. Dave did a good appraisal of the Paul Seilheimer and its a fake. I bought two daggers from a man named paul or pawl from Poland, both daggers are fake. I should have read the information on the forum about fake daggers, and paul. I collect k98's and got into daggers about a year ago. There is a lot to learn, this was a costly lesson. I still have two daggers I feel good about, one is a 1196/38/ss. Yall have seen it on the forum and liked it. Anyway live and learn.
Thanks David
Johnny

Nobody likes to see a fellow collector get the shaft by the low life fakers and the scum that knowingly sell the fakes as real.

Sound advice is to post pics here before laying out your hard earned cash.

This is the same guy from Poland who has signed on and been banned about 9 times. He uses different providers for internet services so he pops up again and again. Mostly he trolls for email addresses so he can scam folks.

Dave

Im sorry to hear it was no good Johnny being a seilheimer fan i was hoping it was the real deal...

well a little good news. the man I traded the luger for is going to send my luger back. I e-mailed him the report on the dagger and he saw where he was duped by pawl and is going to make it right. The pach is a lost cause.
g24t

Question..was PS a late comer to the SS game?
I have an original PS catalogue,and it does not show them as producing the SS dagger...

www.kurskmilitaria.com

Kursk,

Yes, verrrrrrrry late producer of early SS daggers. The late 1990's or early 2000's to be exact

Dave

heh heh..so post-post-post war?