#89786
10/28/2006 05:19 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
Today I would like to realize on of my „old projekt“ here: Is ZEITLER a producer or a distributor? AND TO PUT THE DISTRIBUTOR´S COMPONENT TO REST. As ZEITLER produced also armies and lufts I dare to put this topic in the ANL forum  . Since TTW totally erroneously has written in his army book ZEITLER to be a distributor´s mark this incorrect rumour is around within the collectors community. ZEITLER has been a prominent MANUFACTURER of blades and edged weapons since the start of this firm. ZEITLER has had his OWN BLADE FORGERY. My research (as the firm is out of order since the late 70ies; now a night club resides in the certain location at Vienna 8th district) resulted in that the blade forgery of ZEITLER was at Freiland, a small village near Lilienfeld in Lower Austria. Dear fellow collectors, the roots of the ZEITLER firm are back into the imperial period. First I would like to show an Austro-imperial pioneer hewer with the ZEITLER Mark and the imperial acceptance mark on the other side of the blade.
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89787
10/28/2006 05:20 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89788
10/28/2006 05:20 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89789
10/28/2006 05:21 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
pioneer hewer 4 (army acceptance mark)
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89790
10/28/2006 05:23 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
Now the ZEITLER mark on an Austrian “First Republik” air-defense-dagger. About 1937/38.
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89791
10/28/2006 05:24 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
Then there is the ZEITLER mark on a 2nd Luft. This mark (and equal ones on scarce e.g. armies, SAs, police degens) has led to the error of ZEITLER being a distributor simply because of to few knowledge, information and much to few research about this firm.
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89792
10/28/2006 05:24 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89793
10/28/2006 05:25 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89794
10/28/2006 05:27 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
Finally the ZEITLER mark on the least invention of this firm, the ZEITLER Feldmesser 77 military Field Knife 77) which was intended as a bajonet for the well known Steyr AUG 77, the Austrian Sturmgewehr. I was produced only in a very limited number (today it seems to be very rare).
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89795
10/28/2006 05:29 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89796
10/28/2006 05:31 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
ZEITLER 77_3 (ZEITLER mark on scabbard)
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89797
10/28/2006 05:33 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89798
10/28/2006 05:34 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89799
10/28/2006 05:35 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89800
10/28/2006 05:36 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
The ZEITLER 77 was not accepted by the Austrian army which in 1978 accepted a slight varation by GLOCK as only a field knife without bajonet function. Soon after the FM 77 adventure the ZEITLER firm was closed.
Be sure, against all doubts mentioned earlier in this forum, ZEITLER was a true manufacturer of blades and edged weapons for about one century.
Here the later FM by GLOCK varation.
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89801
10/28/2006 05:38 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89802
10/28/2006 05:39 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89803
10/29/2006 02:36 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 3,290
|
|
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 3,290 |
Wotan Thank you sir very informative topic. Love the grip on the 2nd model luft.
|
|
|
#89804
10/29/2006 11:51 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 788
|
|
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 788 |
Very interesting and informative wotan. Thanks.
Weapons Collector
GDC Badge #0136
|
|
|
#89805
10/30/2006 12:31 AM
|
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,361
|
|
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,361 |
Reini Interesting. This has been accepted by most, including Wittmann, I think, since his book was published. ZEITLER had an RZM number assigned to them as well...and that should have been the tip-off that they were a manufacturer, but it was overlooked by TW evidently..... 
" Always interested in Aluminum fitted, rare, and superbly conditioned Army daggers." DJ Roach
|
|
|
#89806
10/30/2006 03:06 AM
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Good post Wotan. I really like that luftwaffe!
|
|
|
#89807
10/30/2006 05:50 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,274
|
|
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,274 |
Wotan, Excellent research!!! While I don’t currently have one, I think that in the past I have owned or handled a couple of ZEITLER marked Imperial era swords. Regards, FP
|
|
|
#89808
10/30/2006 07:45 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,316
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,316 |
Wotan, a fine example of a valuble contribution to the community. I was under the impression that Zeitler was a distributor as well.
Thanks for this information.
Johnny
Silver Badge #0398 My Avatar = My dagger security system! 
|
|
|
#89809
10/30/2006 09:11 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
Thank you for your interest and your kind comments. I am glad that I am not totally wrong adressing this certain theme.
Regards
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89810
10/31/2006 01:25 AM
|
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,321
|
|
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,321 |
Wotan,
Excellent topic and you are 100% correct they were a maker. Those are some of the best Zeitler Wien Marked daggers and knifes i have seen, they are usually in horrible shape. I have tried to collect at least one nice Wien marked Heer or Luft. Definately top notch items you have there, With Wien being my last name you can see why i search for this maker. I'll find a keeper one day, then we can compare blades.
Eric
|
|
|
#89811
10/31/2006 01:35 AM
|
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,361
|
|
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,361 |
Here is an Army that I own by this outfit.....They evidently bought their fittings anywhere they could and assembled (their blades with them) since they didn't make their own fittings or scabbards.
" Always interested in Aluminum fitted, rare, and superbly conditioned Army daggers." DJ Roach
|
|
|
#89812
10/31/2006 01:41 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,858
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,858 |
I own a Firemans dress bayonet with Zeitler-Wein
97.jpg (17.78 KB, 154 downloads)
TKissinger
|
|
|
#89813
10/31/2006 01:42 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,858
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,858 |
It also has a strange number on the pommel
TKissinger
|
|
|
#89814
10/31/2006 02:33 AM
|
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,274
|
|
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,274 |
Terry (and Wotan), Absolutely no offense intended - but I think that it must be an “Austrian” thing. You see the extra long serial numbers on 98K combat bayonets by Genossenschafts Maschinenhaus der Büchsenmacher (Ferlach/Kärnten) - letter code “bym”. I have no clue why they did it that way. Regards, FP
|
|
|
#89815
12/19/2006 12:11 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,330
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,330 |
Hi everyone,Ludwig Zeitler Wien RZM M7/104
Here is my new addition.Its a HJ but still fits in this discussion on the maker/distributor question.
|
|
|
#89816
12/19/2006 12:12 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,330
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,330 |
|
|
|
#89817
12/19/2006 01:30 AM
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 |
This has been discussed at least once before. Most members have agreed that since they were issued an RZM code (M7/104), they were a manufacturer rather than a distributor.
Dave
|
|
|
#89818
12/22/2006 04:14 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 5,130 Likes: 24
|
|
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 5,130 Likes: 24 |
Here's my meager addition to the thread. I've found this mark is not often seen at all, on anything. This particular bayonet is definitely on my "upgrade" list, but I just haven't seen another in any shape. At least I found one. Man, would I LOVE to have Terry's, especially with the inventory numbers on the pommel. Terry, if you're ever looking to trade that one, look no further
GDC Gold Badge #290
GDC Silver Badge #310
|
|
|
#89819
12/22/2006 05:15 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155 Likes: 5
|
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155 Likes: 5 |
An Imperial, or Republic, period Zeitler M95 bayonet marking.
"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
|
|
|
#89820
12/22/2006 05:17 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155 Likes: 5
|
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155 Likes: 5 |
This is the rarely seen Zeitler logo on the other side of the Austrian M95 bayonet. Anyone seen this logo marking on a WWII period dagger or bayonet?
George
"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
|
|
|
#89821
12/22/2006 07:17 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 |
Here is their rarely seen SA transitional logo.
Dave
|
|
|
#89822
12/22/2006 07:29 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31
|
|
OP
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 5,021 Likes: 31 |
ORPO, have sent you another one of my files per PM because I cannot remember from where the pic is.
wotan, gd.c-b#105
"Never look for sqare eggs" as a late owner of an original FHH-dagger used to say.
|
|
|
#89823
12/22/2006 11:11 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155 Likes: 5
|
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,155 Likes: 5 |
Thanks Dave. I have not seen this particular logo in the shield before. Is this an etched logo?
Thanks for the PM Wotan. I sent you a PM in response.
"You can't please everyone, so you've got to please yourself." Ricky Nelson
|
|
|
#89824
12/22/2006 11:31 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 |
Orpo,
Sorry for the poor photo - its the only one I have. Yes, it is acid etched.
Dave
|
|
|
|
Forums42
Topics31,670
Posts329,066
Members7,519
| |
Most Online5,900
Dec 19th, 2019
|
|
|
8 members (Stephen, C. Wetzel-20609, Vern, Dean Perdue, JONATHAN, Documentalist, Dave, S.Wilson),
789
guests, and
187
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
.JPG){kind=link}
