Translate German to English - Click here to open Altavista's Babel Fish Translator Click here to learn about all those symbols by people's names.

leftlogo.jpg (20709 bytes)

Upgrade to Premium Membership

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3
odal #315820 02/07/2016 06:28 PM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
M
Offline
M
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
Circle the wagons, boys. (An old west USA saying meaning keep the inner circle tight to fend off invaders!) someone asked me about best place to get a ring like I had (I don't recall some pattern skull or ww)-and my answer was the same Gaspare gave me-Buy from an Old established collection! Fake rings will always be fake rings!!!

hapur #315861 02/09/2016 04:04 PM
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 318
M
Offline
M
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 318
Originally Posted By: hapur
Originally Posted By: Byzanti
Also, the cracked shield die...I presume it's non functional in that state, I suppose they would just make a new die? Or did they have some imperfect ones, but have a method for fixing die flaws?


It is not working die, it is master for making working die. Usually when die gets broken, it is just thrown away. Sometimes it can get fixed and then sometimes you can see some repair defect.
Mostly therm die flaws are used to hide casting defects. Many gays use term die flaw but actually never has seen some die with flaws.
If interested I can make some repaired die pics.
Please do, Hapur, that would be HIGHLY interesting! And if you had a pic of a ring made with a repaired die, then that would be perfect...

Mark4321 #327002 03/05/2017 06:59 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Because this 2 dies (the one for the Westwall ring and the one for a swastika ring) are now again in auction and discussed in some forums i will show it here again and remember this older fine thread.

Screenshot (47).jpg (116.67 KB, 353 downloads)
Last edited by odal; 03/05/2017 07:06 PM.

�Eine gewaltt�tige, herrische, unerschrockene, grausame Jugend will ich. Jugend muss das alles sein. Schmerzen muss sie ertragen. Es darf nichts Schwaches und Z�rtliches an ihr sein. Das freie, herrliche Raubtier muss wieder
aus ihren Augen blitzen."
odal #327003 03/05/2017 07:23 PM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
M
Offline
M
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
I think I can make out that "watermark" on the photo too... can you guys as well?

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Especially interesting i find the sold with ring.
I myself can`t imagine that this inside comes while die strucking.
Would like to hear some other opinions.
Mabe Hapur can help with his knowledge. wink

gdc.jpg (115.16 KB, 313 downloads)

�Eine gewaltt�tige, herrische, unerschrockene, grausame Jugend will ich. Jugend muss das alles sein. Schmerzen muss sie ertragen. Es darf nichts Schwaches und Z�rtliches an ihr sein. Das freie, herrliche Raubtier muss wieder
aus ihren Augen blitzen."
odal #327032 03/07/2017 07:42 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Nobody here with an opinion?
Here the front of this ring, for me a cast one:

s-l16001 - Kopie.jpg (91.83 KB, 279 downloads)
Last edited by odal; 03/07/2017 07:44 PM.

�Eine gewaltt�tige, herrische, unerschrockene, grausame Jugend will ich. Jugend muss das alles sein. Schmerzen muss sie ertragen. Es darf nichts Schwaches und Z�rtliches an ihr sein. Das freie, herrliche Raubtier muss wieder
aus ihren Augen blitzen."
odal #327033 03/07/2017 07:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
and a comparison with a period original:

comparison.jpg (204.92 KB, 275 downloads)

�Eine gewaltt�tige, herrische, unerschrockene, grausame Jugend will ich. Jugend muss das alles sein. Schmerzen muss sie ertragen. Es darf nichts Schwaches und Z�rtliches an ihr sein. Das freie, herrliche Raubtier muss wieder
aus ihren Augen blitzen."
1 member likes this: ASmith
odal #327041 03/08/2017 01:40 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
M
Offline
M
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
Dragons teeth do look different I agree- lettering too. And the second helmet has no rivet/vent hole above the national shield. Good eye, Gtz.

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
M
Offline
M
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
It's gonna fool a lot of people!

odal #327058 03/08/2017 07:47 AM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 431
Likes: 2
Offline
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 431
Likes: 2
Originally Posted By: odal
Nobody here with an opinion?
Here the front of this ring, for me a cast one:


Based on this pic I say cast ring.


There are less original rings than you think, much less...

www.totenkopfrings.com
hapur #327060 03/08/2017 09:23 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Originally Posted By: hapur
Originally Posted By: odal
Nobody here with an opinion?
Here the front of this ring, for me a cast one:


Based on this pic I say cast ring.


That`s what i think too.
A mother die for die strucking sold together with a cast ring.
How strange is that?


�Eine gewaltt�tige, herrische, unerschrockene, grausame Jugend will ich. Jugend muss das alles sein. Schmerzen muss sie ertragen. Es darf nichts Schwaches und Z�rtliches an ihr sein. Das freie, herrliche Raubtier muss wieder
aus ihren Augen blitzen."
odal #327156 03/10/2017 06:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Comparison of the backside:

back.jpg (89.08 KB, 338 downloads)

�Eine gewaltt�tige, herrische, unerschrockene, grausame Jugend will ich. Jugend muss das alles sein. Schmerzen muss sie ertragen. Es darf nichts Schwaches und Z�rtliches an ihr sein. Das freie, herrliche Raubtier muss wieder
aus ihren Augen blitzen."
odal #330174 07/03/2017 05:56 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
here's an old die...this one of a good luck ring.. Horse shoe,,4 leaf clover, wish bone,,,just missing a Swastika!

A real work of art... Talented die cutter here!

s-l1600 (1).jpg (181.24 KB, 316 downloads)
Gaspare #330175 07/03/2017 05:58 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
another old one.. probably took some enamel in the shields afterwards.

s-l1600 (2).jpg (128.94 KB, 315 downloads)
Gaspare #330176 07/03/2017 06:03 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
here's the good luck ring die again..

We always talk about nice even band here. this is why.
They were cut that way!
One side wouldn't be thicker than the other. Everything nice and even.

Wonder what was going to be in the center of that cartouche?!

s-l1600.jpg (141.43 KB, 314 downloads)
Last edited by Gaspare; 07/03/2017 06:04 AM.
Gaspare #330177 07/03/2017 08:24 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,371
Likes: 1
Maybe an unready die?
The cartouche looks looks rather high too, so could be it still needs some work on.


�Eine gewaltt�tige, herrische, unerschrockene, grausame Jugend will ich. Jugend muss das alles sein. Schmerzen muss sie ertragen. Es darf nichts Schwaches und Z�rtliches an ihr sein. Das freie, herrliche Raubtier muss wieder
aus ihren Augen blitzen."
odal #330179 07/03/2017 10:27 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
M
Offline
M
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
The details are amazing. The shanks are wishbones with a rabbits foot in the center...

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
maybe Odal,,or maybe just a big high gaudy ring..

Mike, your a genius!! Rabbits foot!!! YES, absolutely.. Cool, thats seldom seen on good luck pieces..

Gaspare #350686 07/24/2021 12:38 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
I had an email a while ago asking why some dies the Cartouche [front] were flat and some 'dipped'...

There were many dies as can be seen in this great old topic... This period die from my collection is 'dipped' .. It is simple,, it gets flat when it gets rounded, and sometimes finished flat as well...

DSCN4775.JPG (76.75 KB, 254 downloads)
Last edited by Gaspare; 07/24/2021 12:39 AM.
Gaspare #352711 11/26/2021 05:56 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
got friendly with a salvage guy that occasionally gets and sells old European jewelry dies.. He sent me this,,says its from 40s. Could be French...
Takes a cameo or a 'gem' Its not for me as its not a mans ring etc. but still nice to observe and study:

Die5.jpg (104.63 KB, 227 downloads)
Die4.jpg (85.71 KB, 227 downloads)
Last edited by Gaspare; 11/26/2021 06:00 PM.
Gaspare #352924 12/15/2021 06:59 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
I missed out on this die while I was out of town. frown. Supposed to be from late 30s.... , Oh well, next time.........................

Die.jpg (53.3 KB, 302 downloads)
Die2.jpg (59.22 KB, 301 downloads)
Gaspare #352937 12/16/2021 02:23 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,813
Likes: 52
B
Online Content
B
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,813
Likes: 52
I'm impressed by the craftsmanship !

Thanks for posting.

Last edited by benten; 12/16/2021 02:24 PM.
Gaspare #353705 02/21/2022 05:28 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
I got another old die last week. A unused working die.. Nice Art Deco ish design...

The 3 holes on the cartouche could be used for like some of our glass panel rings with emblem and the 2 screws from behind to affix, or maybe even to solder a panel on..

Seller calls me when ever he finds dies that are European or European made sent here. He had found a bunch of old [1950s] NOS working dies.. this was the only mans ring..

Serial numbered,,and depression [red] is for when in holding chock there was another holding screw/bolt.

- Most are in cardboard or wood boxes which he throws away after unpacking/inspecting frown... I told him I'd give him a bit more from now on IF he saves the container!!!!

Die5.JPG (30.01 KB, 235 downloads)
Die6.JPG (35.46 KB, 233 downloads)
Die4.JPG (63.97 KB, 233 downloads)
Gaspare #354062 03/12/2022 01:40 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
We have a local 'Gun Show' [really just military some flintlocks, bayos, reloading stuff, survival,,a bit of WWII,,oldies etc.] So I had met a guy that had a broken die to a old US coin!! He said it was fake and damaged from misuse etc. and somehow he got it.. I could tell it was old and asked if he had more. And,,,of course he had one I liked from 1950..

I told him I think it's illegal to have a piece that makes money [coinage]... He quickly took it out of his display case an put in his briefcase. blush shocked grin..

The other he told me a very fair [low] price for it and I got it! Pretty sure its a womans ring.. It's damaged but a little different than my other dies..
I have a section on dies in my project. I was showing 2 or 3 and some info.. - But then last year found great pages from a 1930s German trade booklet and just wanted to have a die for each of their line drawings, and understand their technique/workings etc.

Here it is.. Please,,you guys have a die for anything - a pin ,watch face, cufflink, anything! please I invite you to add the to this post.... Thanks..,G.

Die7.JPG (95.41 KB, 210 downloads)
DIE8b.jpg (52.67 KB, 210 downloads)
Last edited by Gaspare; 03/12/2022 01:46 AM.
Gaspare #355236 07/23/2022 01:34 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
I've had this Ukraine pin a long time. It was for directly postwar when they did not want to be part of the USSR... [So far no ones been able to tell me what the bottom says/means]...

BUT,,, what do I find on an auction?? an actual working die for it!!

Description:

WWII FREEDOM FOR UKRAINE Steel Stamping Die FOR PINBACK * JN56
From the archives of the Johnson National Insignia Company of New York, this listing is for an original steel stamping die used to make a pin that reads FREEDOM FOR UKRAINE. The octagonal die has dimensions 1 ¼” x 1 ¼” and stands 1 ⅞” high. The die weighs 12 oz and the condition is Excellent.

UA3.JPG (49.04 KB, 182 downloads)
UAdie.jpg (153.95 KB, 182 downloads)
UAdie2.jpg (180.79 KB, 182 downloads)
Last edited by Gaspare; 07/23/2022 01:36 PM.
1 member likes this: ASmith
Gaspare #355251 07/24/2022 08:18 PM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
M
Offline
M
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
Back to this for a moment- does anyone know what the part on the bottom means?

Gaspare #355252 07/24/2022 11:19 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
Mike,, I've asked our Ukrainian relatives, friends. Some of the old school .. No one really knows exactly!! The die is a standard worker. I have a few with this 6 sided configuration and was used here and around for years as it was easy to chuck up....


You guys have dies,,,any kind of die, info on dies etc. Please post away..... Thanks..,G.

Last edited by Gaspare; 07/25/2022 02:02 PM.
Gaspare #355254 07/25/2022 12:01 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
M
Offline
M
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 31
I’ve seen Greek writing on the bottom of fraternity and fraternal organizations, what I’m wondering is if this might be related to an American Ukrainian (youth?) organization, association, or maybe church or scouting affiliated group.

Gaspare #355259 07/25/2022 01:57 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
Anyone with dies or even photos of dies, hardening, cutting techniques, repaired dies etc. please feel free to post them...

Last edited by Gaspare; 07/26/2022 02:49 AM.
Gaspare #355263 07/26/2022 02:31 AM
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 23
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 23
Likes: 1
Originally Posted by Gaspare
WWII FREEDOM FOR UKRAINE

I'm glad you posted this considering current events...Jeez, the CIA has been sowing division between the slavs for decades. Russians and Ukrainians are practically the same people from my experience.

I'd really like to know the history behind this...

1 member likes this: Evgeniy
Gaspare #355264 07/26/2022 02:59 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
ASmith,, welcome to the forum... I didn't post it about anything concerning current events. The pin is old and I've asked a few places the what bottom meant. No one seems to know exactly.. Please nothing political here,,,forget the CIA ,sowing divisions etc..

- SO,, what do you collect?

Do you have any period rings or jewelry.? It's all welcome here,,advertisements, photos in wear, line drawings,bracelets, tie clips, cufflinks, boxes, military and even non military....

I believe even studying regular [non military] commercial jewelry will help us in learning too..

Last edited by Gaspare; 07/26/2022 03:00 AM.
1 member likes this: ASmith
Gaspare #355265 07/26/2022 05:36 AM
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 23
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 23
Likes: 1
Originally Posted by Gaspare
ASmith,, welcome to the forum... I didn't post it about anything concerning current events. The pin is old and I've asked a few places the what bottom meant. No one seems to know exactly.. Please nothing political here,,,forget the CIA ,sowing divisions etc..

- SO,, what do you collect?

Do you have any period rings or jewelry.? It's all welcome here,,advertisements, photos in wear, line drawings,bracelets, tie clips, cufflinks, boxes, military and even non military....

I believe even studying regular [non military] commercial jewelry will help us in learning too..

Thanks for the welcome!

Fair enough, I guess I'm one of those internet wackos who knows too much... grin

As far as what I collect, I've actually started collecting Third Reich postcards, but the Third Reich jewelry is something that I'm drawn to like a lot of people...I actually had a dream about an official SS bracelet one time, but I don't think there's any such thing?

Gaspare #355267 07/26/2022 03:03 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,084
Likes: 96
Online Content
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,084
Likes: 96
Hello, ASmith,

Welcome to GDC. I don't know of any "official SS bracelet", but I am sure someone is working of one for you now wink. As soon as they age it to look about 1938-ish, they'll let you know grin

Dave

PS - We don't get into modern politics here.

Dave #355268 07/26/2022 03:42 PM
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 23
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 23
Likes: 1
Originally Posted by Dave
Hello, ASmith,

Welcome to GDC. I don't know of any "official SS bracelet", but I am sure someone is working of one for you now wink. As soon as they age it to look about 1938-ish, they'll let you know grin

Ah, what? If no such thing actually existed, I'm all set.

Gaspare #355271 07/26/2022 06:56 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,084
Likes: 96
Online Content
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,084
Likes: 96
ASmith,

In this hobby you never rally know what to expect. Maybe they did make bracelets ... but maybe for just the Army guys. whistle

111.jpg (37.66 KB, 73 downloads)
1 member likes this: ASmith
Dave #355272 07/26/2022 08:00 PM
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 23
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 23
Likes: 1
Very nice, lol. I get it bracelets are feminine, jeez, it was a just a dream...it looked cool I swear, had a panther and skulls and stuff on it. You know, masculine things, lol.

Gaspare #355274 07/26/2022 09:19 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
G
Gaspare Offline OP
OP Offline
G
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 12,099
Likes: 275
- Theres plenty of what they call 'Patriotic' bracelets out there.. Usually a gift for the women folk... Most common was the WestWall but there were others. Try a search here a few might pop up..

Postcards!. There are some great books on postcards. Some of the early examples are very expensive and rare. Also on the easy side to conserve and keep/store..

1 member likes this: ASmith
Gaspare #355277 07/26/2022 11:26 PM
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 23
Likes: 1
Offline
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 23
Likes: 1
Originally Posted by Gaspare
- Theres plenty of what they call 'Patriotic' bracelets out there.. Usually a gift for the women folk... Most common was the WestWall but there were others. Try a search here a few might pop up..


Thanks, I'll take look. I actually didn't think to look, since I figured there wouldn't be many.


Originally Posted by Gaspare
Postcards...on the easy side to conserve and keep/store..

Yep, that's why I like them! I only have a few, but I definitely prefer the ones that weren't actually sent. Jewelry and the stuff that goes into making it like 'dies' is definitely more interesting as opposed to plain paper. I don't have anything as of yet obviously, but I brewing up some ideas about where I might start as I browse the forum. smile

Gaspare #355278 07/26/2022 11:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 780
Likes: 26
E
Offline
E
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 780
Likes: 26
Dave
Wow!! What a picture. Sheds a NEW light on what we are all collecting.
They may not be miniature daggers, they may be dainty daggers. Who knew??

Gaspare #355280 07/27/2022 02:05 AM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,084
Likes: 96
Online Content
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 15,084
Likes: 96
grin grin

I should have Police, not Army.

Found that photo a while back and just knew it would be useful some day.

Page 2 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  Stephen 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Popular Topics(Views)
2,261,465 SS Bayonets
1,760,275 Teno Insignia Set
1,128,738 westwall rings
Latest New Threads
Luftwaffe Swords
by Tanker - 03/27/2024 07:29 PM
Paul Weyersberg Heer
by Tanker - 03/27/2024 07:13 PM
HJ Fahrtenmesser,
by OWN - 03/27/2024 07:05 PM
Wir fahren gegen Engelland - Battle of Britain
by Stephen - 03/27/2024 10:06 AM
Hiddensee brooch
by benten - 03/24/2024 04:13 PM
Latest New Posts
Wir fahren gegen Engelland - Battle of Britain
by Gaspare - 03/28/2024 12:34 AM
Paul Weyersberg Heer
by Tanker - 03/27/2024 11:30 PM
Luftwaffe Swords
by Tanker - 03/27/2024 07:29 PM
HJ Fahrtenmesser,
by OWN - 03/27/2024 07:05 PM
Frog question.
by Dutchman - 03/27/2024 03:27 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums42
Topics31,652
Posts328,702
Members7,501
Most Online5,900
Dec 19th, 2019
Who's Online Now
7 members (Nietzsche, Documentalist, benten, Vern, maybarker, Mikee, Baz69), 461 guests, and 60 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5